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Castles in the Air - further observations on the Hornby New Castle

Silver Sidelines

Entry posted by Silver Sidelines

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Some six months have elapsed since my Blog entry here commenting on the Hornby New Castle:

 

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In fact I have acquired three or four models, all 'new' and with one exception, all from UK retailers. During this time I have been able to run the different engines and make a few adjustments.

 

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First a view of Hornby's all purpose nylon washer or spacer. Apparently they are used to position the front bogies on the Schools Class. They are used here on the New Castle to pack the gear train. They also make appearances on some of the driving axles. I say 'some' because not all my Castles have the same chassis arrangement.

 

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I have shown above a view of the chassis from '˜Earl Cairns'. This I think is my newest Castle. The slidebars are nicely parallel with the '˜frames'. The leading driving axle is packed on both sides with nylon spacers to reduce sideplay and prevent the coupling rods rubbing on the connecting rods.

Those of you with an eye for detail will note that in contrast to newer models Earl Cairns does not come with rear sand boxes, just wires for the sand pipes.

 

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Whilst most of my Castles ran reasonably well I was not happy with the performance of Ince Castle which I believe is one of the latest models. It had a tight spot at low speed and a definite wiggle at high speed. Its performance did not improve with use and I made the decision to take it apart and re-quarter the wheels. This did not improve matters and I was left with a suspicion that perhaps the coupling rods or one of the wheels was not to specification. For the record Ince Castle had three nylon spacers, one to each axle. The spacer on the centre driving axle was cut in the manner of a Circlip, possibly added after the wheels had been quartered.

 

The picture above shows the replacement Hornby parts. Perhaps it is relevant to note that the wheels are supplied quartered but the axles are not fitted with any nylon spacers.

 

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Above is a view of the underside of Ince Castle. My first attempts at fitting the replacement wheels as supplied with no spacers was a disaster. The engine ran smoothly, very smoothly until it came to some curved track. With so much sideplay available the coupling rods and connecting rods locked together - very unpleasant.

Returning to the view above of Ince Castle Chassis you will note that one set of slidebars is parallel with the '˜frames' whilst the other is angled outwards - obviously to provide additional clearance between the coupling and connecting rods. Again for the record I did attempt to run the engine with only one spacer on the leading axle. Whilst it generally performed well going forward it was not at all good in reverse and could not negotiate Peco Medium radius points. Replacing all three spacers (on the same side of the engine as on the wheel set that had been removed) solved the running problems and the engine is fine. I am none the wiser as to why the original wheel set produced such rubbish running. I am slightly bemused by Hornby's use of nylon wheel spacers. Earl Cairns has a lower model number than Ince Castle - so which is the improved version?

 

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One of my Castles came from a well known auction site - Brand New - never been out of its box. I should know by now that this can be code for covering up all manner of problems. On first sight it was a good engine. It didn't seem to have been out of its box and it looked new and ran well. However - there was something odd with its appearance. I should have taken a picture. When two engines were placed together the buffers on 'Great Western' were a good 2 or 3mm higher than any of my other Castles.

 

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Removing the body from the chassis revealed a 'blob' of glue on the underside of the body (location B ) which had been used to attach the inner cylinder detail. I smoothed the glue away as I thought that it was perhaps preventing the body sitting tightly on the chassis. There was very little improvement, the buffers still pointed upwards. Time for something more radical. The body is very rigid but gently flexing the buffers downwards opened up a gap beneath the front of the boiler (location A ). My solution was to open up the gap and pack it with a piece of black plastic - in my case a tiny piece of black PVC cut from a file divider - problem sorted.

 

Am I too fussy or are there lots of other Castles out there with niggling problems?

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Barry Ten
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I've got a couple which both run well, but both had irritating smudges of whiteish residue on the bodywork, as if from cyano adhesive. Generally, though, I've not had a problem with the running qualities of any Hornby locos in recent years.

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Silver Sidelines

I've got a couple which both run well, but both had irritating smudges of whiteish residue on the bodywork, as if from cyano adhesive. Generally, though, I've not had a problem with the running qualities of any Hornby locos in recent years.

Thanks Barry. Yes a friend's Grange was covered in white - helped convince him that it needed weathering. Running qualities seem to be a bit of a lottery and I don't really see much difference between Bachmann and Hornby.

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robmcg

Having really only just discvered your blog, I am very pleased.. I too have bought many Hornby and Bachmann 00 BR steam locos since 2004 and have had a similar mix of new and s/h., and can concur with your opinion that it's a bit of a lottery with assembly and running qualities, both Brands having a share of 'errors' or faults, mostly however, like you I just enjoy the models. I would guess that from 100 models maybe half have some fault or other, about 10 have serious faults which can usually be repaired, and 2 or 3 need to be returned to retailer. I think given the prices and margins this is to be expected.

 

I do wish the A1/A2 class by Bachmann didn't droop at the cab! Not an easy easy fix, that one... I just photoshop most errors like that!

 

Rob

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Silver Sidelines

Rob

 

Good to read your message. It sounds as though you have the same 'philosophical' approach to RTR models as I have.

 

I am not sure I understand your comment about Bachmann A1 / A2s - although I did have problem with Great Eastern - which went straight back!

 

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liathach

I purchased R2849 Beverston Castle from a well-known shop in Liverpool this week.  Alas, all the problems mentioned above happened to mine.  When I first tested, the loco ran poorly at slow speed backwards.  I tried to take the body off to try and check more closely.  The pipe work by the cab fell apart.  Then getting the body back the front bogie pin sheared off (fixable).  The loco then ran sweetly for five minutes, then everything jammed and a coupling rod fell off to a rear driver.  I spent hours trying to re-quarter the wheels and eventually gave up.  Never before have I had such a badly made locomotive.  An absolute waste of over

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Silver Sidelines

Oh dear not a happy story.   You may need to treat yourself  to something from the Christmas Sales - perhaps Bachmann and from that other shop in Sheffield?

..... Never before have I had such a badly made locomotive........ Hopefully the retailer or Hornby will do something about this!

I do have a concern with recent Hornby steam engine models - they appear to be just that bit too clever to the point that to my mind they are not practical.  However one or two recent purchases have not even been good to look at, the finely detailed  plastic body mouldings being thin and warped.  The O2 and the 52xx come to mind.  In the interests of being fair minded some recent Bachmann models have not been without their problems but when required have been readily replaced by the retailer.  I hope you get sorted and better luck for the New Year.  Regards  Ray

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liathach

Thanks for the information Ray.  I couldn't resist going for a Hornby Star Class - Knight of the Grand Cross - on the assumption I'd been very unlucky with Beverston Castle.  It certainly looks a picture and runs smoothly. However, the thin plastic mouldings (chassis/footplating area) are a concern.  Secondly, it is a hopeless hauler!  I have a ruling gradient of no more than 1/80 I'd estimate.  The loco goes in to a wheel-slipping frenzy with 5 coaches on.  Most of my other kettles have no problems with 8-9 coaches on!  Inside the body but there is very little room to add extra weight anywhere.  Even where I could add extra weight, this made no difference.  I tested cleaning the wheels and allowing running time to bed in to no avail!  if only Bachmann entered the GWR 4-cylinder loco fray. I shall probably trade in the Hornby Star for a Bachmann Hall.  I'd recommend the Hornby Stars or Castles as a collector's items (never to be removed from the box) but not as a working models.  Regards, John

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Silver Sidelines

Hello John, thanks for the feedback. Hornby are coming in for quite a bit of criticism - have you seen all the comments after my latest Post about Duke of Gloucester. I am quite amazed.

Regards

Ray

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liathach

Hello Ray, I am impressed you got the loco running true again.  Hopefully the 8P lasts the distance.  I was fortunate a few years back to be given a current chassis Britannia with the fixed cartazzi truck.  I've never managed to get the body off as it has fused sealed to the motor  - a common issue with these apparently.  Although she runs noisily, she's been fault free and a good, strong hauler.  I returned Beverston Castle to Hattons today - they were excellent regarding the failure of the loco!   Am tempted to see if any improvement will have been made with the next release of Castles when they arrive!

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liathach

Hello Ray, since my last posts on RM Web, I've gone over to DCC on a rebuild.  I bought R2822 5053 Earl Cairns and R2848 5011 Tintagel Castle.  Both these are from the same production group.  Both at slow and moderate speeds tend to intermittently "lock up" when hauling a decent load.  My investigation this time led me to the meshing of the motor worm and central gear.  With the motor out, the chassis rolls evenly, with no indication of the motion being any issue.  The motor runs well out of the cradle. I swapped motors (bought a new spare to eliminate motor issue).  Looking closely at the worm and gear there are no obvious defects in either.  However, when they mesh, it looks like the gear tends to get drawn up in to the worm unevenly.  I've tried reducing lateral and horizontal movement of the gear, but so far nothing has ironed out the problem.  I have ordered a replacement gear to test an alternative.  If that fails,  I might give up on Hornby Castles again!  I've tested a Hornby Star with the same group of wagons at the same speeds and that runs fine.

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