0_gauge_novice Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Tales of war and peace part 2: Snowhill/Roxey Mouldings WD Austerity 2-10-0 in 7mm Beware! This is going to be an even slower and painful build compared to part 1 (Dean Goods) Now we come on the second tale of war and peace…..This time we move on from the great war to WWII. Again a British locomotive that was massive by your standards! The WD Austerity 2-10-0. I have never seen this kit on the RMWeb and I know only that Rob Pulham has one in his stack. Maybe I can motivate him to start it History of the locomotives in Greece. 16 Locomotives were brought to Greece with the UNRRA in 1946 and were numbered as Λβ 951-966. They were used as mainline locomotives the last being withdrawn in 1979, which is quite remarkable for such war locomotives. Probably it is the same case as the BR52 from Germany. The Austerities were stationed in the north (Thessaloniki). By the late 60s they were stabled in Pythion near the Turkish border running the schedules of the “Direct Orient Express” over the Greek territory or freight trains in Western Macedonia. Many of them still survive today two of them in working condition –or sort of- in Greece Λβ 962 and 964. Two more were sold to the UK (Λβ 951 & 960) and one of them is the locomotive that I want to build. During their service in Greece they were modified in some aspects that will also be made in the model. First they were converted to left hand driving, bigger windows in the cab, double roof over the cab to insulated it from the summer sun, deflector behind the chimney, headlights, toolboxes and extra water openings on the tender and a sprinkler arrangement for the coal so that the dust from it won’t fly away (?), Westinghouse pump. These are the most prominent differences from the standard WD design. When I was thinking of starting Greek prototype 0 gauge back in 2012 I called a friend that is also working on that. We had a chat about the possible locomotives (like the USATC S100, which he also has) and he said: “Ah, you now…Roxey Mouldings is producing a WD Austerity 2-10-0. I would be interested but the loco is too big for me. I don’t have space to run it.” I was shocked….I don’t have space either but I want it! I searched on the internet and quickly found Roxey mouldings. I contacted Dave and he kindly send me also two pictures of the model one during building and the other one finished. This was June 2012. It took another year until the funds for the kit were here so in September 2013 I ordered one together with the Slaters wheels. I also got the PFS plunger pickups and the ABC VL2C gearbox with a canon motor as suggested by the kit. The kit is massive and I put it aside until my skills have improved (I have the philosophy “buy when you can and built it later”). Now I think I could tackle the job slowly. In the beginning of 2015 I also got the number plates for the locomotive that I want to built, Λβ 951 (NBLC 25438/1943, WD 5652). The plates were beautifully produced by my dear Friend Christo Georgadidis of Balkanmodels in Sussex. Works plates were custom made from Narrow Planet again with excellent service. As I said. The kit is massive. A lot of frets and a lot of castings. The chassis is nickel silver and the other stuff are brass (all 0.7 and 0.5 mm thick). The castings are in brass except for the boiler backhead, which is whitemetal. The Westinghouse pump is a whitemetal part from Ragstone models. The castings are very crisp and really detailed as I find. I have read the comments that these are really hard to cut from the sprues and file but I cannot say anything yet. Also the etched parts look nice and I hope they will go well together. Here, as with the Dean Goods, I have a criticism on the instructions. They are formatted as A5 booklets (1 for the loco and 1 for the tender) with some pictures and figures. The problem is that they were printed with an inkjet printer at a low quality (both printing and paper) and the pictures are only partially useful. Furthermore the margins of the printer for the locomotive booklet were set wrong and some letters are cut off on the left side of the pages. I asked Dave from Roxey to supply me the electronic form of the instructions and although he was very helpful with everything (something was missing and he promptly send it to me) he never send me the files. I also got the two issues of the MRJ with the presentation of the kit and the pictures there are a little bit more useful. I guess the guys that developed and testbuild the kit took a lot of pictures during the builds….so why can’t they be implemented properly to the instructions? Especially in the case of the Snowhill/Roxey WD 2-10-0 and 2-8-0 a desktop publishing software was used? Just more pictures and in better resolution would do the trick. I had asked a fellow member here to build the locomotive for me and he offered me a more than fair price for that but after a lot of thought I decided to take up the challenge by myself. I will begin with the tender to see how it goes together. Both locomotive and tender will be built sprung with the hornblocks supplied by the kit. The literature that will be used for this build is: R. Tourret: Allied military locomotives during WWII. Tourret publishing. British built Austerity 2-10-0 Locomotive: The railway Gazette, 15th December 1944 (If anybody wants the article please tell me. There are some detailed drawings and cutaways of the locomotive that will help during the build) Various photos of the Greek prototype. Frets of the body....... Chassis stuff.... Tender.... Hornblocks....some are missing but its all there... Castings as far as the eye can see... Slaters bits.... The beatifully etched plates from Balkanmodels..... Again...slow and painful. Next post will be the visual differences of the prototype with the standard WD design. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Beautiful Andreas, Fellow member Jim Snowdon was the designer of the kit so hopefully he will be along to give some pointers during the build. As for inspiring me to get mine on the go, I need to finish a few things first or my good lady will do me a mischief Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKR Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Interesting project. Looking forward to this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumblestripe Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 I'm scared just looking at those pictures! Respect is definitely due. Good luck! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian@stenochs Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Just watch the snowhill austerity it is not quite to scale. For some reason the designer has extended the wheel base and who knows what other alterations he has made. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 Just watch the snowhill austerity it is not quite to scale. For some reason the designer has extended the wheel base and who knows what other alterations he has made.Hi Ian, I am fully aware of that. It was also discussed at dibategs thread "the Derby line" when he was building 2 WD 2-8-0. The wheelbase is 2mm longer so that it can overcome the non scale wheels and brake. Also the front of the chassis is narrower. I guess there are always comprimises and there is no other WD 2-10-0 on the market. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Pulham Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Hi Andreas, I hope you don't mind me posting this as a bit of inspiration for you, it's a painting that my wife has just completed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted June 24, 2015 Author Share Posted June 24, 2015 Hi Andreas, I hope you don't mind me posting this as a bit of inspiration for you, it's a painting that my wife has just completed. Hi Rob, I dont mind. In fact I have been staring at the paintings on your website... Inspiration is here going strong. Currently I am reading and searching a lot especially for the Dean Goods. I should be having all the details by the end of next week or the following one. Then I will start.... Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Dean goods in ROD service Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibateg Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Glad to see that you are having a shot at it Andreas. The kit is well designed if somewhat heavily engineered. I'm looking forward to seeing progress. Regards Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim.snowdon Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 Good morning Andreas, I came across your topic by accident (such is the way that RMWeb is organised) and now have it on the "followed" list so I will be able to see how you get on with it. I like Tony's slightly backhanded compliment - I suppose it's what you happens if you get a kit designed by a railway engineer. As you already know, the coupled wheelbase (and with it the whole loco, so everything stays in the right place in relative terms) is stretched slightly in order to get the brakes in between our over-sized flanges, but that is the only tweak; the front end framing is where North British put it. Anything else is down to our not using metal of prototype thickness (or should that be thinness?). Regards, Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
81A Oldoak Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I will be very interested to see the building of the ten-coupled chassis. I managed to get an eight-coupled, compensated chassis on the JLTRT GWR 42XX 2-8-0T running at the first attempt; 7mm scale scale is so much more tolerant than the smaller scales. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 8, 2015 Author Share Posted July 8, 2015 Glad to see that you are having a shot at it Andreas. The kit is well designed if somewhat heavily engineered. I'm looking forward to seeing progress. Regards Tony Hi Tony, thanks! It will be a great challenge though but after much thought I decided to take it. Good morning Andreas, I came across your topic by accident (such is the way that RMWeb is organised) and now have it on the "followed" list so I will be able to see how you get on with it. I like Tony's slightly backhanded compliment - I suppose it's what you happens if you get a kit designed by a railway engineer. As you already know, the coupled wheelbase (and with it the whole loco, so everything stays in the right place in relative terms) is stretched slightly in order to get the brakes in between our over-sized flanges, but that is the only tweak; the front end framing is where North British put it. Anything else is down to our not using metal of prototype thickness (or should that be thinness?). Regards, Jim Hi Jim, thanks for following. I will definetely will need some advice and what could be more better than from the person that designed it. Thanks also for the clarifications. I will be very interested to see the building of the ten-coupled chassis. I managed to get an eight-coupled, compensated chassis on the JLTRT GWR 42XX 2-8-0T running at the first attempt; 7mm scale scale is so much more tolerant than the smaller scales. Hi Chris, As my name says I am a novice. I have managed erecting a 0-6-0 chassis without compensation. Somebody will ask then "why on earth try a 2-10-0 fully sprung?". Well.....Because it is the kit that interested me (along with the Dean Goods) and I do not want to spend hundreds of pounds to build up my skills with different kits that wont be of use. I am sure that with a lot of patience and swearing I will make it... Now. I have been doing a lot of homework, especially for the tender because that is were I am going to start. A friend send me so good pictures of the details and I will post them here for showing the modifications needed to be done. Nothing extreme though. Now I need to finish the springing on the 2 slaters CR 7 plankers and finish them up by the end of the week so that I can start this one. The necessary stuff for the Dean Goods are not here yet (some slaters stuff and alan gibson plunger pickups) so I will crack on this one. I think this phrase from JFK suits me right now... We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim.snowdon Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Chris, In the case of the 2-10-0 (and the 2-8-0), it should be straightforward as all five axles are sprung. Given a choice, I consider springing is easier than compensation, especially where there are more than three axles. One change that I introduced on the 2-10-0 as well was that the hornguides have a pair of fold out tabs that register against the top of the cutout in the frames, so they should all come out at the same height, which helps with getting the loco to sit evenly on its springs. Similarly, for the tender. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 15, 2015 Author Share Posted July 15, 2015 So, almost after a month since posting I am taking the plunge. For introduction this is what I am aiming for. Lb951 (Pronounced Lamda-Vita) in 1959 in Thessaloniki (Photograph by Alfred Luft). -I wont write in in Greek letters as RMWeb cannot "digest" them an show them properly. This is the exact state of the loco that will be build. I decided to show the changes/modifications of the locomotive as being build. I hope to show some progress soon. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 Hi too all, on wednsday I started cutting out and forming the first parts. On Friday I finished with all the stuff of the basic tender chassis and I started soldering. I havent finished yet but I have taken a leap forward. Before the progress some comments 1) The material is quite thick and I needed to get familiar with its strength. Bending need quite some power but due to the strength it is almost imposible to destroy a part. I remember Tony Geary (dibateg) mentioning that the sides were not cleanly etched. I saw that and I thought in the begging that the films of the etches have moved during the process but I am pretty sure now that the sides are not very clean due to the thickness of the material (0.7 mm NS). I remember reading somewhere that when the sides cannot be etched very cleanly. 2) The first part of the basic chassis went together quite well without any swearing although it is my first time building a thing with hornblocks and in general a kit of this complexity. The accuracy of the tabs and slots is excellent! Thanks Jim! 3) The instructions were ok but as I have said that the pictures are not helping a lot. At least I have the pictures from the build of Tony and I use them as a reference. Furthermore I also have the drawing from the RG from 1944. The workbench with the drawing and the pictures from Tony (I hope Tony you dont mind.... ) The parts for the basic tender chassis. Filled and I have started bending them. The first two hornguides were a bit fiddly to make but after that I established a techinique to fettle them and all were made up pretty straightforward and very working. This was knocked up on friday. Everything was square with the first try. Excellent design! I started to position the hornguides with the help of the the metalshith axle jig with springs and the JPL chassis jig. the height for the hornguides is automatically correct with two small tabs and then you just need to adjust the horizontal position. Pretty straigth forward and everything is square with the first try! Yipie!!! Today I soldered the hornguides. I was quite easy even for a novice like me. All the axles move freely and sit on the track. I havent added the spring plates on the hornblocks and the springs. This is what I will do the next few days. I also started with the castings for the brakes of the tender. I had to drill some holes as they were not there although you could see that there should be one there (Checking with the drawing). I was straightforward with a 0.5mm drill on the drillstand. After the springs I will make the brakes, blacken the wheels and install the plunger pickups. Then the basic tender chassis will be finished. One question though about the sideplay. I was thinking of leaving no sideplay in the first and fourth axle, and letting the two middle ones having some sideplay. What do you think? Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim.snowdon Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Andreas, The assumption for sideplay on the tender was that the 1st & 4th would have none, leaving the 2nd & 3rd to float. For the castings, where small holes are needed I arranged for the patterns to have an appropriate dimple so that they could then be drilled out. Trying to cast small holes is problematic in that there is a high risk that after a few casts the "pin" in the mould for the waxes will break off, leaving a rough impression of the hole that is difficult to get a drill centred on. The male equivalent of the dimple will survive indefinitely. Regards, Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 Hi Jim! Thanks so much for the information on the sideplay and clarifying the situation qith the castings! Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 25, 2015 Author Share Posted July 25, 2015 Good evening, It has been a heavy week at work as my boss and one colleague of mine are on vacation and I am doing currently the work for all three!!! (The third is of course me... ) I am moving slower but still working on the basic chassis of the tender. I finished the springing for one axle of the tender but before I continue I would like to ask some questions. First of all. The construstion was straightforward. Fiddly sometimes but with patience it does not pose any problems at all. Though my question is. Are the springs at the correct position/length? I did not shorten them and they seem to me to be quite hard. You need to apply a lot of power to compress them for a wee bit. I know that there is still a lot of weight coming on top from the superstructure but I also have 6 more springs to add...... I do not know if this is correct. Also the hornblocks can only move up as they have reached the wire that acts as a keeper. Furthermore....do I add them now or later? My logic says now but in the instructions there is nothing (not even adding the springs!). I soldered a 0.3mm NS wire underneath from both sides although the instructions say it is enough from one side. Is this the right position for the keeper wire? I took the position of this wire from Tony´s pictures, which show that because the pictures in the instructions are of awful printed quality. If everythins is correct I will proceed with the rest. Cheers Andreas P.S. All the hornblocks were quire undersize but with a 3/16" reamer they are brought to the correct size. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibateg Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I'm glad my work is of help Andreas - I thought I recognised that tatty cutting mat in the picture... I can't remember if I changed the spring in the hornblocks or cut them shorter... It doesn't really matter where the keeper wire goes as long as it's out of sight from viewing and stops the hornblock from dropping out. Good Progress! Regards Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim.snowdon Posted July 26, 2015 Share Posted July 26, 2015 I think the springs look stiffer than the ones I originally used. It was designed round the Slaters springs, whose purpose is more to push the wheels down into track irregularities than to support the whole weight of the loco. The ones you have sound more like they are able to carry the weight by themselves, which is fine on the loco, where you want any additional weight for adhesion, but not much help on the tender. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Hi Jim, The springs are indeed very stiff. I could have build the chassis rigid and the effect would be the same. I have some slaters hornblocks around and I will test those springs tonight.Did you desigh also the locomotive with the softer springs? If so I will change all. Thank you a lot for the help! Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Andreas, If the springs seem a bit too stiff they can be softened a bit but waving them over the flame of a candle. You may need a bit of trial and error to find the optimum time for exposure to the heat. Cheers Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted July 27, 2015 Author Share Posted July 27, 2015 Hi too all! Thanks for all your inputs. As I said I had some slaters hornblocks around (for the Dean Goods) and I tested out the springs. The springs from Slaters are more soft and to my opinion, now that I can feel the difference and the comments from Jim, I think that Roxey just changed the springs without even thinking....sorry to say it like that. You need to apply a lot of pressure to compress the supplied springs and Jim I dont even think that the weight of the locomotive will be enough to compress them. I will all replace them with slaters one. I will put the order tommorow or tonight (I need also some other bits). I can work with the 6 springs from the hornblocks that I have until the others arrive but I also have some other stuff to do and solder so there are not needed tommorow. Usually a Slaters order to Switzerland takes 1-1.5 weeks from ordering. @Brian: Thanks for the tip. Since it will be trial and error I might as well replace them completely. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
0_gauge_novice Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 Good evening, Slaters as anticipated delivered after 7 days and these springs are much nicer and softer. I started on wenesday and I finished them on Friday. I attached all the axles and all are rolling free only the last one does not do so many turns as the others when I give it a turn with my finger. Is that such a big problem? I think maybe that the hornblock on one side is now more than 0.1mm (measured with calipers) off position to the forward. How would you remedy that? With a broach or a reamer a little bit on the bearing....give it a small tweak? If I just roll the chassis there is now problem for the wheels turning and it is nicely sprung. Now....wheel and axle blackening, PFS Plunger installation and then getting the brakes done Despite the complexity of the kit I am quite proud of my work. Seems to turn out ok. Cheers Andreas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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