Goods Yard Ballast?

[GKman]

I'm a newbie, not a winge, simply a fact.

Now,   I'm modelling a Goods Yard based around 1960.

I'm getting confused by differing opinions as to whether I ballast the track in the yard or not.

PLEASE HELP
Regards

GKman

 

[darren01]

Hi

Yard where made from yard ash, C+L sell this in there range of ballast, just blend some main line ballast in to the yard then just do the rest with ash.

Darren 

[28XX]

Lightweight filler

Many other brands are available

 

Build up the baseboard around the track to sleeper-top level with irregular pieces of cardboard, torn not cut, first.

 

Then get creative with the filler. I find a kids glue spatula ideal to spread it between the sleepers.

 

A basecoat of chocolate/ dark truffle/ black emulsion paint next.

[bike2steam]

I used a mixture of ash from the ash-pan of a steam loco, plus ash from a barbeque( to lighten the colour mix) crushed, and sieved thro' a 1mm mesh tea-strainer, fixed with pva brushed liberally on the required area before sprinkling the ash in place - vacuum up the excess 24 hours later. Loco-shed yards would have ash/gunge up to sleeper tops, in goods yards the sleepers would, more often than not, be on top of the ash ballast.

Edited August 13, 2015 by bike2steam

[JeremyC]

I used a mixture of ash from the ash-pan of a steam loco, plus ash from a barbeque( to lighten the colour mix) crushed, and sieved thro' a 1mm mesh tea-strainer, fixed with pva brushed liberally on the required area before sprinkling the ash in place - vacuum up the excess 24 hours later. Loco-shed yards would have ash/gunge up to sleeper tops, in goods yards the sleepers would, more often than not, be on top of the ash ballast.

I would be cautious about using real ash. I  did on a layout and it turned out to be quite corrosive, especially to soldered joints.

 

Jeremy

[Andy Hayter]

I agree with the last comment.  A neighbouring club in the 1990's* decided to  use real NER ash ballast to ballast their NER branch.  It turned out to be slightly conductive with all the problems you might expect.

 

*  They know who they are and I will not embarrass them.

[Chubber]

In the 60s I'm sure that road vehicles still entered yards to load from wagons [or am I losing a decade?] so metalled surfaces would have been provided alongside goods tracks to facilitate this in loading areas.The track between the rails would be clear/clinker except for timber baulks where vehicles were to cross over.

 

Source P73 'Goods Yards', Model Railway Design Manual CJ Freezer ISBN1 8526 538 3

 

Doug

 

[smugness equals pedantry backed by evidence...]

 

D

[Graham Walters]

Buy some play sand, it's very fine and suitable for all guages.

 

Get an old blender

 

Put sand in blender about half full is good.

 

In a pot mix some paynes grey acrylic paint in a thick wash.

 

Add to blender

 

switch on, and pulse.

 

use a spatula to scrape around the blender, pulse a couple more times.

 

Dry sand in a warm oven, allow to cool then pass through a sieve, you will get a fine ash coloured mix, with some hard larger clumps to scatter around.

 

Cost ?  not a lot !

[Londontram]

 

 

Cost ?  not a lot !

It will do when your wife finds what you've done with her blender.

[bike2steam]

I would be cautious about using real ash. I  did on a layout and it turned out to be quite corrosive, especially to soldered joints.

 

Jeremy

Mmmm, interesting, an idea I've been using for over 30 years, and no problems - yet. Perhaps because the rails ( and solder joints) are well clear, usually the ash is below the sleepers.

 

The station loco siding on my present layout, with real coal around the coaling platform, and ash ballast beyond, I've used the same idea on 3 previous layouts which had goods yards.

Edited August 15, 2015 by bike2steam

[darren01]

Here a photo of my shed and yard area using Ash ballast. 

Photo's  by C. Nevard.

Edited August 15, 2015 by darren01

[Chubber]

All good stuff, but on a note of caution if I may, when I was 'ickle' I used to use pounded-up ash from the Trianco boiler in the scullery [remember those...?] but  there was quite a bit of obviously iron-based muck in there which ended up around the permanent magnets of my entire loco fleet [both of them] along with bits of wire wool from my wonderful home-made bushes.

 

Doug

 

Damn...that Darren is good.....

Edited August 15, 2015 by Chubber

[The Stationmaster]

In the 60s I'm sure that road vehicles still entered yards to load from wagons [or am I losing a decade?] so metalled surfaces would have been provided alongside goods tracks to facilitate this in loading areas.The track between the rails would be clear/clinker except for timber baulks where vehicles were to cross over.

 

Source P73 'Goods Yards', Model Railway Design Manual CJ Freezer ISBN1 8526 538 3

 

Doug

 

[smugness equals pedantry backed by evidence...]

 

D

Road vehicle areas in goods yards, especially by  mileage sidings, weren't always metalled but they were rolled flat to give a good firm surface.

[George Leacon]

Rule number 1 Mr GK - study the prototype:

 

http://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrk2066.htm

 

http://www.nrm.org.uk/ourcollection/photo?group=Euston&objid=1997-7409_LMS_9007

 

http://www.nrm.org.uk/ourcollection/photo?group=Liverpool%20Street&objid=1995-7233_LIVST_FT_227&keywords=goods+yard

 

As others have indicated - goods yards were almost never ballasted to the same high standards as main lines. A good rule of thumb though, is the higher the traffic density and importance of the yard, the better quality the track work. A large marshalling yard, like the second photo, would be well maintained. A sleepy country station yard seeing two or three goods trains a week would receive minimal maintenance at best.

 

As others above have said, ash was the preferred material to actual ballast. Sometimes it would be level with the sleepers, sometimes the track would be simply placed on top of the ash (fully exposing the sleepers), or you could even have both.

 

Apart from (possibly) the entrance / exit lines (aka reception / departure lines) what you want to avoid is the higher grade, main line standard look such as this, with a neat and distinct ballast shoulder:

 

http://cache3.asset-cache.net/gc/102725528-princess-louise-steam-locomotive-princess-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=R4V%2fQay2ANwpmCZhkZDSEr9hpXpXdRRcciQgi95cbUu6Lpy7KtQaej90B73LkjSX3Uk85RrTmB9R1cGgXH4dEndP%2fmd06vtU3YjE68h9pwE%3d

 

Hope this helps :-)

 

B

Edited August 16, 2015 by George Leacon

[28XX]

The "well trodden" look I'm after.

[bike2steam]

 Sometimes it would be level with the sleepers, sometimes the track would be simply placed on top of the ash (fully exposing the sleepers), or you could even have both.

 It would depend on how busy the yard was, a small rural goods yard with light use would most probably see the sleepers barely pushed into the ash ballast, sometimes it would depend on what's under the 'ballast', in areas with clay sub-soil it could 'pump-up' between the sleepers thro' the ballast in busy yards.

[class"66"]

I use Geo-scenic "N" gauge ballast for both my home layout and Banks road..

 

 

cheers neil

[Roger Sunderland]

If it's a reasonably small area have a look at Chris Nevards blog site where he shows how create just such a yard using Das modelling clay. By far the best representation I've seen IMHO.

[Gilbert]

Barry Norman does this very nicely in one of the Right Track landscape DVDs (#5 or 6) I think. He uses card to sleeper height, track embedded in some ready mixed filler and wood ash from a log burner scattered over a light grey paint covering. I have used wood ash myself with no ill effects.

Chris

[RexAshton]

Worth a look here

[BobM]

Evening Guys,,,,,

This is our No2 siding at Arley.....loco ash has been spread to rail height.....makes a great medium for the layout too!

 

 

Regards

Bob

[sb67]

 

Hi GKman, you've got plenty of good advice there. Most yards I've been to and seen in photo's had all sorts of ground covering. Try and find a couple of photo's of the look you want and take it from there. The photo's from George Leacon and 28XX are very inspirational.  I used the DAS clay method and fine sand and ash. I'd highly recommend the Chris Nevard site and stuff by Barry Norman also Gordon Gravett. They are all masters of creating realistic groundwork.

Good luck and dont forget to post some pictures.

Steve.

Edited August 15, 2018 by sb67

[sb67]

The "well trodden" look I'm after. image.jpg

 

That is a fantastic photo 28XX, do you know where it is? I think I've seen it before but cant quite remember.

Steve.

[DCB]

1960 is sort of late 1950s, pre neglected era (post 1962).  The photo some eay above this post looks almost like 00 track laid on card sleepers direct on the baseboard as the sleepers have been almost completely buried.

I would suggest that for a rural goods yard  rail laid on the baseboard without sleepers and given a thin layer of ballast much of it black from coal dust would give a reasonable representation.  In one place I cut two grooves in fibre board and glued code 100 rail to the edges of the grooves to make a coal siding

On the GSWR in laces there were no rails, wagons ran in groves in the mud between the ends of the siding and where the buffer stops had bee pushed back to.

[BobM]

That is a fantastic photo 28XX, do you know where it is? I think I've seen it before but cant quite remember.

Steve.

 

Birmingham Central Goods yard in the early 60's....you can just make out the Rotunda in the top right of the image...

Regards always

Bob

Edited August 15, 2018 by BobM