Nearholmer Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 OK, it's an "extract of CEP" (mushroom sauce?), but when, where, and why? Winner is the first to get the answer to all three parts of the question. Kevin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnb Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 If that was just two power cars it must have had phenominal acceleration!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 If that was just two power cars it must have had phenominal acceleration!! And the stopping power of a supertanker! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kintbury jon Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I'll take a punt on the why. There were a couple of 411 motor coaches that were at Strawberry Hill Depot and used as a tractor unit. I don't think they were refurbished so I reckon it's them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 21, 2016 Author Share Posted June 21, 2016 We were working out of strawberry hill, but not in "tractor mode", and I have a feeling that you are thinking too recent. Between them, John and Russ are getting close to "why". K Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kintbury jon Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 61035 was from 7102! http://www.railphotoarchive.org/rpc_zoom.php?img=0720022222000 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivercider Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 There is this picture on Flickr, the caption of which gives some background info about set 7102 one vehicle of which became part of Tractor set 080 https://www.flickr.com/photos/36034969@N08/4744743825/in/photolist-8eh432-fumNzw-bqc7Mt-8BRRKV-duK5Bp-eP5MMb-A5Usr6 cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Is that Shepperton? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 21, 2016 Author Share Posted June 21, 2016 It is. The grass-grown platform is the big clue, although you can probably also hear Ian Allan beating the day lights out of a typewriter in the background. K Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 Was it some kind of braking trial which led to REPs having a 60mph restriction when working solo? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 The further away of the two vehicles has a door to every bay of seats (judging by the number of door hinges visible). Is it 'Mars', the ex class 501 test coach? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 The further away of the two vehicles has a door to every bay of seats (judging by the number of door hinges visible). Is it 'Mars', the ex class 501 test coach? Well spotted,it looks like a VEP vehicle,the 501 I don't think would multi with the CEP, not 100% on that mind Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 21, 2016 Author Share Posted June 21, 2016 OK, it was braking tests, but not that set of tests from what I recall. These tests were of various different brake-blocks, with additives to the cast-iron, IIRC. The two motor cars allowed rapid acceleration, so that it was possible to get several runs up to speed,followed by screeching halt within the length of the branch, between normal services. The date is clearly after 1976, and before c1979, when that motor car was formed into another test train, with bits of an EPB. I think for work on thyristor drives and signalling interference - memory is a bit poor on this, but I think the EPB car had a thyristor drive package, and the CEP car was used to provide traction outside test conditions. Date is probably 1978, but it might be 1977. Prize awarded to the collective. Kevin Edit: I can't remember what the other car was on these tests, but it wasn't a fully equipped test car, just ordinary stock, and the instrumentation was very simple. Looking at the photo, I tend to agree that it looks like a VEP driving car, which rather negates what I said about two power cars above! We used to un officially carry passengers if they looked in a hurry or were young and female, and in the latter case they were provided with tea/coffee and biscuits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 Is it two CEP cars Kevin ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Well spotted,it looks like a VEP vehicle,the 501 I don't think would multi with the CEP, not 100% on that mind A standard 501 couldn't, but Mars had EPB control gear. It definitely worked with CEP vehicles at one point: http://www.departmentals.com/photo/975032a Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 Sorry Pete I was thinking about the 501 that finished in green with screw couplings Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 21, 2016 Author Share Posted June 21, 2016 You guys have got me thinking - perhaps the "EPB" I'm remembering was Mars. At the time, nobody spoke class numbers, and 501 were called "Watford units", but if it had EP gear and lots of doors, it would have been an "EPB" to us, irrespective of where it originated from. K Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted June 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 21, 2016 I'm not great on EMUs but if that was a 501 power car wouldn't that make a two car set with 3 power bogies? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Yes, the Watford units had four traction motors under one car, which might explain why one was chosen for what I think were drive-package tests. The motors were smaller than on SR EPB, which only had two under each motor car, so the power/weight ratio was about the same (250hp/car). Gearing ratios might have been different too, but I can't remember. K Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 977395 ex-DMBSO 61035 from 7102 and 977396 ex-DMBSO 61342 from 7130 ran as tractor unit 932080 in blue/grey. Cheers David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 I think, but am open to correction (because this discussion has already proven my memory to be feeble!), that the order of events for the motor car from 7102 after 1976 was: - allocated to CM&EE(RS) and used for odd testing jobs (as per the photo with which I started this) - c1979-80 spent a longish period paired with Mars (which I misremembered as a bit of EPB) - then formed into the tractor unit. It is worth bearing in mind that the test team at Strawberry Hill had access to various cars at different times, some of which were borrowed for a few weeks while they were waiting to go for overhaul etc. There was a unit, a 4 EPB I think, that had been fitted-up for the SR-AWS tests, but was used for "odd tests" for a long period thereafter, for instance, and I'm not sure that was ever transferred to departmental stock. Also, bear in mind that the "meccano kit" nature of SR stock, and the fact the Design office and the depots were in very close contact, meant that making mods or creating oddities was a pretty simple process. In short, any attempt to chart every one of these 'specials' would be very hard work - somewhere on SEMG online, there is a summary of the ones that did get ADB numbers, but that isn't the whole story. [this is the Semgonline page ....... Keep scrolling down .....,. http://www.semgonline.com/proto/otherdir.html#dcemu ] K Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 OK, it was braking tests, but not that set of tests from what I recall. These tests were of various different brake-blocks, with additives to the cast-iron, IIRC. The two motor cars allowed rapid acceleration, so that it was possible to get several runs up to speed,followed by screeching halt within the length of the branch, between normal services. The date is clearly after 1976, and before c1979, when that motor car was formed into another test train, with bits of an EPB. I think for work on thyristor drives and signalling interference - memory is a bit poor on this, but I think the EPB car had a thyristor drive package, and the CEP car was used to provide traction outside test conditions. Date is probably 1978, but it might be 1977. Prize awarded to the collective. Kevin Edit: I can't remember what the other car was on these tests, but it wasn't a fully equipped test car, just ordinary stock, and the instrumentation was very simple. Looking at the photo, I tend to agree that it looks like a VEP driving car, which rather negates what I said about two power cars above! We used to un officially carry passengers if they looked in a hurry or were young and female, and in the latter case they were provided with tea/coffee and biscuits. Was it the manganese steel block test? Less sparking and wear and longer life IIRC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judge Dread Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 I seem to remember a 3-CEP working the Sittingborough - Sheerness service. It was somewhat clapped out to put it mildly! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Was it the manganese steel block test? Less sparking and wear and longer life IIRC. The production version of which gained the epithet "non-ferroious" amongst drivers due to their lack of stopping power ........................................................................ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Adam1701D Posted July 11, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 11, 2016 The motor cars from unique refurbished prototype 1500 became tractor unit 081 and could often be seen hauling test coaches and the HSTRC (Mk2D High Speed Track Recording Coach) around the Southern. These coaches had the refurbished window layout but original Mk1-style windows and ran in Jaffa Cake Livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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