RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted October 14, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 14, 2016 I have seen a picture of a rake of about 8 of these loaded with Sherman tanks hauled by one of the Metropolitan Bo-Bo electrics in grey livery. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bescotbeast Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 I've just pre-ordered 3 of the 70's/80's variant, looking forward to these. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BR Blue Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 A rake of these would be nice with a suitable load. I will be getting some of the 80s versions. Now to find some photos. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 Post 20798 on this thread has some very nice photos taken of the similar warflats on the Calne branch in the late 50s. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/69664-a-nod-to-brent/page-832 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BMacdermott Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 Congratulations to Hattons on these announcements. In The Wishlist Poll 2015: The 1940s Warwell was the most-wanted pre-1948 Freight Stock item and was in the Top 50. The 1970s Warwell was the most-wanted post-1963 Freight Stock item and was in the upper echelons of the High Polling segment. The Beilhack Snowplough was in the upper echelons of the Middle Polling segment. Brian Madermott (on behalf of The Poll Team) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil gollin Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 . Did these run in mixed rakes with Warflats or were they kept separate ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenGiraffe22 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 (edited) That is very welcome news Edit: now can we have a 1943 version of the Hunslet Austerity to shunt them please? Edited October 15, 2016 by GreenGiraffe22 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 . Did these run in mixed rakes with Warflats or were they kept separate ? I've seen photos of trains composed of both types; taller vehicles, such as Land-Rover ambulances and Bedford 3-tonners on the Warwells, whilst lower vehicles would be on the Warflats. A browse through here :- https://www.flickr.com/photos/brianews/albums/72157627008284776 might provide some inspiration. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 Was going to post this picture in response to Phil's query But on a closer look I reckon those are Lowmacs not Warwells carrying Ashchurch vehicles northbound through Worcester Shrub Hill However am sure warwells and warflats appeared in trains with other wagons on this traffic Phil 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Was going to post this picture in response to Phil's query 000035 cropped.jpg But on a closer look I reckon those are Lowmacs not Warwells carrying Ashchurch vehicles northbound through Worcester Shrub Hill However am sure warwells and warflats appeared in trains with other wagons on this traffic Phil Lowmacs at the front, and Lowfits behind; other types you might have seen on MoD vehicle traffic include Carflats, vac-fitted Plates, ferry Carfits and more recently OBA/OCA/SPA. I'm sure I've seen a photo with a rake of those Freightliner flats with built-up ends and a 'fixed' floor (not the post-privatisation ones, but ones called 'Freightflats', IIRC) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dungrange Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Are Hattons going to produce any military vehicles that will form a suitable load for these wagons? Suitable vehicles may already be available from Oxford Diecast or some other supplier, but my knowledge of tanks isn't that great. They were originally built to carry Sherman tanks, but presumably post refurbishment, other more modern tanks would be more appropriate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Are Hattons going to produce any military vehicles that will form a suitable load for these wagons? Suitable vehicles may already be available from Oxford Diecast or some other supplier, but my knowledge of tanks isn't that great. They were originally built to carry Sherman tanks, but presumably post refurbishment, other more modern tanks would be more appropriate. Modern support vehicles most likely. Most modern tanks are too wide to fit our loading gauge so generally go via either road using the Army's own transporters or by air using the range of available transport on the part of the RAF (Chinook, Hercules, Galaxy etc). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium petethemole Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 15, 2016 Some useful info here: http://www.thinkdefence.co.uk/2012/02/vehicle-mobility-considerations/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Modern support vehicles most likely. Most modern tanks are too wide to fit our loading gauge so generally go via either road using the Army's own transporters or by air using the range of available transport on the part of the RAF (Chinook, Hercules, Galaxy etc). I don't think you'd get a Challenger into a Hercules or underneath a Chinook.. The biggest vehicle you'd get on a Warwell would be a Warrior, an Infantry Fighting vehicle. These have to be loaded on to a special platform on the deck of the Warflat to keep them in gauge. The asymetrically-mounted turret has to be on the 'six-foot' side, to avoid fouling things like platform valances and signals. Loading is a skilled job; as a driver found out during the press launch of the facilities at Redmire; the inverted vehicle was captured for posterity by a Tyne-Tees cameraman. The heavier stuff goes by road, either on the Army's fleet of tank transporters (I think the current tractor is an American Oskosh), or increasingly on hired-in trailers. One of the latter made the news when a Challenger fell off during a run down the M4; I saw it in my rear-view mirror. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 I don't think you'd get a Challenger into a Hercules or underneath a Chinook.. The biggest vehicle you'd get on a Warwell would be a Warrior, an Infantry Fighting vehicle. These have to be loaded on to a special platform on the deck of the Warflat to keep them in gauge. The asymetrically-mounted turret has to be on the 'six-foot' side, to avoid fouling things like platform valances and signals. Loading is a skilled job; as a driver found out during the press launch of the facilities at Redmire; the inverted vehicle was captured for posterity by a Tyne-Tees cameraman. The heavier stuff goes by road, either on the Army's fleet of tank transporters (I think the current tractor is an American Oskosh), or increasingly on hired-in trailers. One of the latter made the news when a Challenger fell off during a run down the M4; I saw it in my rear-view mirror. Indeed, a MBT would only be sent by Galaxy most likely (I'm more thinking in terms of overseas deployment of such items though, and a lot of stuff coming back from Iraq/Afgahn came that way or was left behind). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamperman36 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Oh my poor wallet, looks like I'll have to find the end of that rainbow soon. Just need the 80s type warflat and some side door type 20 ft containers now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 Did these run in mixed rakes with Warflats or were they kept separate ?Any mix is fine it was purely down to what needed transport on that day. You often saw lots of one type together when a big batch of vehicles was moved to or from one of the big depots for deployment. Are Hattons going to produce any military vehicles that will form a suitable load for these wagons? Suitable vehicles may already be available from Oxford Diecast or some other supplier, but my knowledge of tanks isn't that great. They were originally built to carry Sherman tanks, but presumably post refurbishment, other more modern tanks would be more appropriate.The Centurion was finishing development as WW2 ended and was too big as we're all its successors. Post WW2 it would be armoured cars, tracked personnel carriers with turrets or missile systems, lorries and the biggest they take is the current Warrior on the special cradle mentioned above. The single type of MBT dominated post WW2 to keep costs down so there wasn't much variety to transport. Modern times have seen the bigger armoured trucks for Afghanistan carried too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 So at the moment we occasionally trundle a Grammodels FV432 APC around on a lowmac Suspected it was overweight for a lowmac but googling suggests a weight of 15 tons against Lowmac tare of 25 tons so OK... A good load for a warwell though.... Scimitar tank only 7.8 tons but probably also needed warwell or lowmac to be within gauge ... what other armoured vehicles were around in the 60s/70s ? Seems to be a bit of a quiet period.... Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 I've seen the GWR registered version of the Warwell in 'Freight Wagons and Loads in Service on GWR' but can one find pictures of the LNER or LMS registered examples? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 (edited) Two fv432's were a common load on warflats rather than in the warwell. Vehicles were carried on the warwell due to size mostly as I've seen various trucks as common loads due to their height. I find these better mouldings with less bubbles than the gramodels or Britannia kits. http://sandsmodelsshop.com/what-is-new-this-month/ Edited October 15, 2016 by PaulRhB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
25901 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Here's on conversion to be done https://www.flickr.com/photos/46120187@N08/26688957816 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveb860 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Scimitar tank only 7.8 tons but probably also needed warwell or lowmac to be within gauge ... what other armoured vehicles were around in the 60s/70s ? Seems to be a bit of a quiet period.... Phil Saladin's, Saracens, Scorpions, Humber pigs, would all be suitable loads. Modern support vehicles most likely. Most modern tanks are too wide to fit our loading gauge so generally go via either road using the Army's own transporters or by air using the range of available transport on the part of the RAF (Chinook, Hercules, Galaxy etc). MBT's tend to go by sea due to their size and weight. Although I did see a USAF Galaxy loaded with several MBT's at Greenham Common in the 80's when I was attached there. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted October 15, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 15, 2016 I don't think you'd get a Challenger into a Hercules or underneath a Chinook.. The biggest vehicle you'd get on a Warwell would be a Warrior, an Infantry Fighting vehicle. These have to be loaded on to a special platform on the deck of the Warflat to keep them in gauge. The asymetrically-mounted turret has to be on the 'six-foot' side, to avoid fouling things like platform valances and signals. Loading is a skilled job; as a driver found out during the press launch of the facilities at Redmire; the inverted vehicle was captured for posterity by a Tyne-Tees cameraman. The heavier stuff goes by road, either on the Army's fleet of tank transporters (I think the current tractor is an American Oskosh), or increasingly on hired-in trailers. One of the latter made the news when a Challenger fell off during a run down the M4; I saw it in my rear-view mirror. Cheers Brian - MBT road transport used to be Antars in the early 70s....was let loose in a tractor unit around the parade ground at Bielefeld in 1971....great experience! Phil 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 I believe JLTRT are doing some suitable tank kits as they are also doing this wagon as a kit in O gauge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Cheers Brian - MBT road transport used to be Antars in the early 70s....was let loose in a tractor unit around the parade ground at Bielefeld in 1971....great experience! Phil I remember the Antars; they were superseded by Scammells; firstly the Crusader ( http://ccmv.aecsouthall.co.uk/p358872034/h1ca93e11#h1ca93e11 ), then the Commander ( http://ccmv.aecsouthall.co.uk/p432494450/h13a6d3aa#h13a6d3aa ). The current tractive power are these ugly beasts:- https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=oshkosh+tank+transporter+british+army&espv=2&biw=1600&bih=780&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwji46Hwx93PAhWiCMAKHZO5B2MQsAQILA Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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