Hercules - A Great Western Story

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Apologies for the delay in posting any updates. I have attached the crane arm locators to the tank body. This works better than expected as it also secures the arm from moving when in transit as, I guess, the prototype.

Was unable to obtain the correct wheel sets from the recent local show and drawing a blank on sites I visit.

Whilst considering the addition of the jib locators and then the sizing etc. I kept noticing various other smaller missing details that I had either overlooked or disregarded in my initial planning. I have re-evaluated some of the missing details and now included them and they, in my opinion, have made an improvement to the overall look of the model compared to the prototype pictures I have. I have increased my use of the rivet transfers to add front detail to the tank, I have used only one row of rivets around the smoke box door rather than the two pictured. Small pieces of brass have been shaped by eye and soldered in place to create the extra lip to the base of the tank. This is one detail I had previously disregarded as I believed it beyond my skill to satisfactorily produce and more importantly attached without destroying other detail features. Further to this I decided to add the extensions to the crew foot-steps under the cab, made again from brass and soldered in place. I was unable to produce a smooth curve into the footplate. To this I melted a small piece of solder to the brass and white metal then filed to shape. The close up picture will does show more detail than is obvious to the naked eye and once primed and painted visual joins and build material differences will disappear. Details added from moulded plastic off-cuts to represent the stabilisers and again rivet transfers used.

Extra details have been fashioned from the nickel silver waste, from the chassis kit and some plasticard offcuts and attached along the footplate. Pipes are represented by wire used for handrails. Not all the details have been added as on a 'OO' gauge locomotive representation is better than completely over-detailing and cramming.

Whilst having the crane and jib in place to site and fix the jib locators I have unfortunately noticed (and now can not get away from) the fact the original chimney is too short. I had originally thought/hoped it would not be much deferent but for me now it is far to obvious. Show I need to think about how the extend this. I have looked at removing it but first site suggests I my lose a lot of detailing and potentially damage the other white metal castings if I try to remove it via soldering iron. Something more to ponder and just when I thought it was ready for priming!

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Since the last post I have been building the courage up to attack the chimney. The issue is that I have soldered it too well, I can not apply heat to the inside and outside of the smoke box simultaneously to melt the solder and I fear if I apply enough heat to do this from one side I will destroy the castings along with any other neighbouring joins. The only solution I have come up with is to cut the chimney stack and insert an extension.

Idea; Thought about using some plastic tubing to do this and attach using epoxy but potential risk of weak joints (in the future) have put me off this idea. Discarded.

Idea; Use brass tube to create a small extension. I don't have any tube to hand to try this and seems extreme to purchase an entire rod for 1cm or so. Back burner!

Possible solution; I have made an attempt to create my own small tube from some brass sheet I have left over from the footplate build. Cutting a measure length of brass sheet and wrapping this around a plastic tube I have for a load and could have used for the initial idea. Then solder the two meeting ends creating a lovely tube ready to extend the existing chimney.

Niggling problem; I still have to cut the chimney and this, frankly, worries me, a lot.

Whilst plucking the courage to attack the chimney I considered my manufactured tube and although the seam is almost invisible to the touch (obviously not the eye) I am very concerned it will still show. Solution would be to apply filler across the join and smooth to completely hide but am I going to be completely happy with this once completed or is it likely to ruin to the entire appearance (especially as it is so prominent). It would also have to be epoxied as the metal transfers heat so quickly the vertical join will open immediately on fixing and destroying the whole thing.

 

So there is nothing for it..........run away and build some wagon kits instead!

Well after a few kits semi completed (paint/transfers etc) still couldn't decide on exactly the best way to extend the chimney. I certainly can not leave it now as I had original hoped, the sizing difference to far too obvious. I know understand why so many modellers have numerous kits in varying stages of build around their work benches, drawers, cupboards and so on.

 

Decision made; (I think) I have been looking at this problem from the wrong angle, i.e. cutting a break and adding an extension. I need to completely remove the stack leaving the tapered base and cleanly removing the chimney top. Then just buy some appropriately sized brass tube and cut to length. I am sure I can find something else to use the remainder for so it wont be wasted although it can be said an expensive wagon load. This tubing will not have the vertical seam and can be soldered top and bottom using the original white metal detailing. (Fingers and toes crossed!)

 

Any other views or suggestions are welcome before the amputation takes place. I will probably have to make an online purchase so a little time will be available before the deed will be done.

[Darwinian]

If you used low melt solder 70 to 80 degree melting point then the kettle may be your saviour. Hold the loco vertically over a washing up bowl. Carefully pour freshly boiled water over the funnel. With luck you'll be able to get it hot enough to drop off. I've done this when I didn't get a funnel on vertically.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Thank you Darwinian, I had forgotten about the boiling water technique. I recall now you mention it using it to completely deconstruct a badly build tender.

I will experiment with this method this method before any other attempts. I am worried about all the other joints in close proximity and all the rivet detail I have added. Although this has been fixed with micro-set they are still water based and may come away.

 

I have been able to speak to my local model shop and have been able to obtain some suitable brass rod to use as the complete extended funnel instead of using an extension and having a potential seam running vertically. I am feeling brave today so will attempt the remodelling tonight (unless the situation changes) and post the results for interest.

[81C]

I bought a copy of GWR REFLECTIONS by Beck & Harris, there is some good photo's of one of the cranes at work at Paddington.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

I bought a copy of GWR REFLECTIONS by Beck & Harris, there is some good photo's of one of the cranes at work at Paddington.

Thank you for the heads up, have found a copy and got on ordered. Appreciate your posting.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Firstly to try the less brutal way, the boiling water technique. This, I think, could have worked if I didn't have so many rivet transfers around. I could not get enough water in the right places without risking those details and other soldered joints. 

So I tried the brutal approach. I say it in pictures.....................................................

 

 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

So I had to clean up the remaining stump on the loco body and the top hat type piece. The middle straight part of the chimney is the section to be replaced and extended to gain the required height. With the brass tube measured and cut to length and lots of flux and a little solder (low melt) the top of the chimney was attached to the tube. I had to use a makeshift clamp so not to burn fingers. (I had previously measured the width of the funnel using a pair of flat tweezers and a steel rule in a make shift set of callipers).

 

 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

The filler caps had to be cleaned up and unfortunately a little detail has been lsot there but the pictures do make it look a lot worse than it actually looks.

More flux and solder the chimney arrangement is soldered into position, checking to make sure it sits vertical from all angles. Once completed clean up with fine files, papers and a scratch pen for good measure. I am very pleased with the outcome and glad I took so long to plan and decide a line of attack although I would have preferred it if the boiling water method had removed it prior to the surgery.

 

Having thought this being the final piece to the jigsaw before painting would commense I am now left with another dilemma! Having studied these close up pictures for a while now deciding on what action to take I am now thinking the rivets I made on the crane body are crude and oversized. I am thinking about stripping the paint off to remove the 'glue rivets' replacing with the rivet transfer as used for the rest of the locomotive. With the introduction of plastic safe paint remover this is a definate possiblity, even if only used for the crane sides carefully leaving the rest of the crane painted. Have more reflecting to do whilst I wait for my copy of Beck's and Harris' GWR Reflections arrives. Views always welcome for anything. Thank you to everyone that has contributed.

 

Edit for typos only

Edited April 30, 2017 by No46

[Darwinian]

That's very smartly done . I don't know that I would have been that brave.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

That's very smartly done . I don't know that I would have been that brave.

 

Thank you. It took a week's worth of convincing myself and then you reminded me to try something else (thank you) first. Then just closed my eyes and hoped. Now I have a similar situation regarding the removal of the rivets on the crane and replace them with rivet transfers. I know what I need to do but just have to convince myself I can do it and it will be worth the potential risk.

 

Edit; The risk is that I will have to remove the paint but to what extent i.e the areas that have rivets only or the entire crane which could prove very tricky to completely remove/clean and ruin any future paint finish.

Edited April 25, 2017 by No46

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Decision made. I will remove the rivets that I made on the crane body. After a little research I have some plastic safe paint remover on order that should allow to minimise the 'damage' to the surrounding paint. I am hoping to only need to clear the sides and the rivets and then carefully repaint the area. Hopefully it will arrive before the bank holiday and I can get started whilst still feeling brave. Whilst that is on order I can now prime and paint the loco body. A quick clean around the chimney area before priming.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Unfortunately my chosen painter remover did not arrive before the bank holiday actually it still has not arrived. How ever I was able to prime and paint the loco body;

 

 

I do (oddly) like it in plain grey but it can not stay that way;

 

 

Pleased with the end result, now just hope the removal of the crane rivets and replacement with transfers will be a success.

 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Had a little extra time so started making the load for the sleeper wagon built as one of the kit distractions during the Hercules build. Each wooden sleeper has been coloured individually using an ink wash. The chairs are also individually painted with an acrylic then an ink wash. Each then glued in place on the sleepers. These will create the load of new(ish) sleepers for the chair sleeper wagon, just visible in the background.

 

 

Also readied the beetle for it's transfers and couplings.

 

 

That nicely brings the wagon total to 2 Tube Cs, 1 Beetle, 1 Chaired Sleeper and 1 Mink G, all ready for transfers and couplings. Excellent distraction builds and some beautifully manufactured kits. I certainly appreciate the skill of the kit designers and manufacturers from having a go at making my own parts for Hercules. It has also encouraged me to add extra detail or to cut something away or reduce it's size of the kit parts rather than just put a kit together as directed.

[57xx]

Quietly following this thread, Hercules is coming on great. you done a briliant job with the chimney. I keep having to go back to the original prototype pic to remind myself it was that tall!

 

Had a little extra time so started making the load for the sleeper wagon built as one of the kit distractions during the Hercules build. Each wooden sleeper has been coloured individually using an ink wash. The chairs are also individually painted with an acrylic then an ink wash. Each then glued in place on the sleepers. These will create the load of new(ish) sleepers for the chair sleeper wagon, just visible in the background.

 

Where are the sleepers from? I have a load to build for my wagon too and those look just the job. Unless you fancy doing another set

Edited May 2, 2017 by 57xx

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Quietly following this thread, Hercules is coming on great. you done a briliant job with the chimney. I keep having to go back to the original prototype pic to remind myself it was that tall!

 

 

Where are the sleepers from? I have a load to build for my wagon too and those look just the job. Unless you fancy doing another set

 

Thank you and yes the chimney is much taller than most.

The sleepers are from; scalemodelscenery.co.uk, pack of 52  code LX080 and no thanks you are welcome to have a go  . I look forward to seeing your wagons, very happy for you to post them here.

I used some very old Warhammer brown ink on them and they have turned out very nice. The white metal chairs I got a long time ago in preparation for such a load from eBay, sorry can not remember if they have a product name. I seem to remember them being described as decorative chairs for loads etc. I don't think they would suit actual rail construction especially as each one needed cleaning up and shaping.

Here's a pic of the wagon loaded. All the sleepers are now fixed in place to the supporting timbers, the load is one piece and is currently removable but once I get the chains on that will be it fixed. I'll see what chain is left over from Hercules before continuing.

[81C]

Don't forget to chain those sleepers on, it's my pet hate unchained loads and containers on open wagons. (Roxey do some nice etched parts) 

 

 

 

 

It's Roxey mouldings http://www.roxeymouldings.co.uk/product/485/4a135-side-chain-eyes-and-hooks/

                                        http://www.roxeymouldings.co.uk/product/480/4a130-screw-shackles-for-wagon-loads/

Edited May 4, 2017 by 81C

[57xx]

Don't forget to chain those sleepers on, it's my pet hate unchained loads and containers on open wagons. (Roxey do some nice etched parts) 

Can't quite pin point it, but something makes me think he's got it covered

 

All the sleepers are now fixed in place to the supporting timbers, the load is one piece and is currently removable but once I get the chains on that will be it fixed. I'll see what chain is left over from Hercules before continuing.

 

 

[81C]

 Specsavers for me I guess, I must admit I don't read the text on a lot of the posts. 

Edited May 5, 2017 by 81C

[57xx]

The sleepers are from; scalemodelscenery.co.uk, pack of 52  code LX080 and no thanks you are welcome to have a go  . I look forward to seeing your wagons, very happy for you to post them here.

I used some very old Warhammer brown ink on them and they have turned out very nice. The white metal chairs I got a long time ago in preparation for such a load from eBay, sorry can not remember if they have a product name. 

 

Thanks for the info on that. I have some chairs (from C&L I think for an old RMWeb challenge that never got anywhere) that I can use, but the sleepers I have are too thin to use really (ok for making track and hidden with ballast) so I'll hop over to your link and have a look.

[81C]

Just an idea for a wagon & load, a pieces of Peco platform edge cut into a sensible size loaded in a 7 plank as per the photo's of a crane working on the platform extension at Paddington. 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

It has been a while since my last post and unfortunately no further work on Hercules has taken place. I am still waiting for plastic safe paint remover I ordered. I have however started work on a pair of Parkside GWR Banana Vans. I do love Parkside kits they go together with little/no fuss but allow the modeller to adapt as/if required. I had previously made a number of the O gauge GWR kits (years ago), those too were a joy to construct. I remember purchasing them just to build and then sell on as they were so enjoyable to construct.

It seems that it will be the next bank holiday now before I can make a decent start on the paint and rivet removal.

[Bluemonkey presents....]

As promised I have found an hour or two on this bank holiday. The plastic safe paint stripper arrived a week ago so I have had plenty of time to build up some courage and make a mental plan of attack.

Firstly I practiced on some painted plastic using the same types of paint and plastic to ensure the stripper was safe. Then I started but removing the rivets I have produced with a fine chisel ended knife.

 

                                    

 

After taking a deep breath I washed a load of the stripper over the crane body using a paint brush. This has to be worked in using the brush. The paint starts to become watery and eventually can be wiped off. careful here as the paint is tacky and using kitchen towel (like I did) can lead a 'fluffy' finish. Any large deposits left from the paint collection in corners of other hard to reach areas can be easily removed using a cocktail stick or similar. This is what I am left with;

 

                                    

 

This is the kit that was used, nothing special but one note to make is don't use one of your nice paint brushes like I did. The bristles get a little clogged and even after cleaning with hot soapy water as directed they seem stiffer and have that water repellant appearance. I hope I have not ruined it, we'll see.

 

 

Now to replace all the rivets that have been removed with the proprietary transfers. Then to make a template for each side to surround the body and mask off the warning sign on the right hand side. Then to prime and re-paint in black.

 

*Edit; to add the pictures I foolishly removed them when posting.

Edited May 29, 2017 by No46

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Here's the results. The pictures look a little messy but this is just the dirty wash left after the paint remover. Most of the rivets are in place as per prototype but I had to leave a few off.  Just need to sort that masking template out and prime and paint. Will post end results;

 

 

 

 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

Thanks for the info on that. I have some chairs (from C&L I think for an old RMWeb challenge that never got anywhere) that I can use, but the sleepers I have are too thin to use really (ok for making track and hidden with ballast) so I'll hop over to your link and have a look.

 

Hope you have found some suitable sleepers. Looking forward to seeing your loaded wagons, feel free to post on this thread if you like. Same for everyone please feel free to post what you like (with in reason  ) I am not too precious.