Closed lines on Modern Image layouts

[Guest nzflyer]

Hi all,

 

It seems to me that there are many closed railway lines in England that would be useful today for freight and commuter traffic across the country. That seems a fairly simple and or obvious statement in itself, but let me explain.

 

I can think of two railway lines in Britain which could have been of use to the economy and the transport industry. The first is the Didcot, Newbury & Southampton Railway metals between Oxfordshire and the port of Southampton, which would ease congestion around the Southampton port area, provide a more direct route to the old Great Western Main Line near Didcot Parkway. The double track backwater railway would see a good mixture of intermodal traffic from Southampton, defence traffic from Wiltshire in the west and commuter services could link the south coast with the tourist centres of Oxfordshire in the north. There could/would also be a considerable amount of coal, oil, construction materials, steel, vehicles, timber and waste traffic as well. Cement trains from Westbury could also feature. I doubt the line would be electrified but it's always a possibility.

 

The second railway is the Great Central Main Line, which opened in 1899 and closed in the late 60s. A double track line from London to Manchester via Rugby would see in my mind a lot of freight and passenger traffic, many different diesel and electric locomotives and a wide range of freight traffic. It would be an impressive modelling achievement for the modern image modeller or railway club.

 

I can only think of so many other railway lines of this length, calibre and engineering achievement that would be of immense benefit today. Can anyone else? The modelling potential makes my head spin.

 

Cheers,

 

Jim. 

[Chris M]

Problem with the real thing is that some idiot allowed parts of the track bed to be sold off and houses and industrial units to be built on this land. 

Something I believe the French have not allowed.

 

For instance at Long Marston - looking towards Stratford we have the Greenway which is a nice cycle path that could be re-opened as a railway one day if required - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289694,-1.7750853,3a,75y,22.62h,82.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXybto4VbniklfcdgY5G3kA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

 

But looking the other way - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289799,-1.7746864,3a,75y,183.56h,83.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHJVpPeaZA-LZqUxIKay1Mw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

[Welly]

What-ifs and "alternate universes/reality" are good modelling themes - no reason why you cannot have modern image on long lost lines but you would need to take some care to create the atmosphere of the line - eg DNSR had a quite distinctive bargeboard design on their station buildings.

[Fat Controller]

The DN&S could have been a very useful line, had it been retained, but the junction arrangements at the ends would have had to be upgraded to accommodate modern traffic levels and speeds. The same applies to the slightly more westerly M&SWJR. It is interesting to consider how things might have evolved differently.

The French took a different approach to us in the early days; their government saw the railways as strategic national assets which could only be closed and lifted after a long-drawn-out process. The authorities often insisted on junctions and chords which seemed to fulfil no commercial role, especially to the lines north and east of Paris; these were intended to allow the rapid transport of troops towards the German border, and other 'sensitive' areas.

[Enterprisingwestern]

Problem with the real thing is that some idiot allowed parts of the track bed to be sold off and houses and industrial units to be built on this land. 

Something I believe the French have not allowed.

 

For instance at Long Marston - looking towards Stratford we have the Greenway which is a nice cycle path that could be re-opened as a railway one day if required - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289694,-1.7750853,3a,75y,22.62h,82.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXybto4VbniklfcdgY5G3kA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

 

But looking the other way - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289799,-1.7746864,3a,75y,183.56h,83.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHJVpPeaZA-LZqUxIKay1Mw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

 

If the cycle path is anything to do with Sustrans, then you've got no chance, the other way shot would be a more likely possibility.

 

Mike.

[Glorious NSE]

For instance at Long Marston - looking towards Stratford we have the Greenway which is a nice cycle path that could be re-opened as a railway one day if required - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289694,-1.7750853,3a,75y,22.62h,82.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXybto4VbniklfcdgY5G3kA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

 

But looking the other way - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.1289799,-1.7746864,3a,75y,183.56h,83.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHJVpPeaZA-LZqUxIKay1Mw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e3

That particular one wouldn't be an issue, as a minor diversion of the route through the rail sidings at the former MOD site would connect the two ends up...

[Glorious NSE]

I can think of two railway lines in Britain which could have been of use to the economy and the transport industry. The first is the Didcot, Newbury & Southampton Railway metals between Oxfordshire and the port of Southampton, which would ease congestion around the Southampton port area, provide a more direct route to the old Great Western Main Line near Didcot Parkway. The double track backwater railway would see a good mixture of intermodal traffic from Southampton, defence traffic from Wiltshire in the west and commuter services could link the south coast with the tourist centres of Oxfordshire in the north. There could/would also be a considerable amount of coal, oil, construction materials, steel, vehicles, timber and waste traffic as well. Cement trains from Westbury could also feature. I doubt the line would be electrified but it's always a possibility.

 

I don't see that it would have made any difference to traffic in the Southampton area as trains would still have used the existing routes in that area (the route didn't actually get to Southampton) - It would have cut a corner for intermodal traffic though and assuming better junctions on the DN&S, then the recent Reading rebuild could have looked quite different.

 

Not quite sure how big a commuter market i'd expect between Oxfordshire and Southampton, but it would be logical that it had a local service, and some (but not all) cross country passenger trains could have used it if upgraded to give enough capacity (my understanding is it was mainly single track?)...

[Fat Controller]

I don't see that it would have made any difference to traffic in the Southampton area as trains would still have used the existing routes in that area (the route didn't actually get to Southampton) - It would have cut a corner for intermodal traffic though and assuming better junctions on the DN&S, then the recent Reading rebuild could have looked quite different.

 

Not quite sure how big a commuter market i'd expect between Oxfordshire and Southampton, but it would be logical that it had a local service, and some (but not all) cross country passenger trains could have used it if upgraded to give enough capacity (my understanding is it was mainly single track?)...

It was built as single track, but was doubled as part of the attempts to improve supply lines prior to D-Day. I think the whole line was done.

[Miss Prism]

Only the northern section of the DN&S was doubled in WWII, but only because the track bed had the potential for this. All that could be done on the southern section was longer passing loops. After WWII, the line went back to sleep again, despite being useful for the occasional oil train.

[£1.38]

Woodhead would be top of my list for revival

[phil_sutters]

With the MOD selling off large sites for housing developments and the resurgence of new garden cities* there are all sorts of possibilities. (or is that one of George Osborne's policies that has been kicked (back) into the long grass?) Add into those options the growth of suburban networks like the Bristol MetroWest and the interest in reopening closed lines for tourism and economic regeneration, like the Borders line and potential scenarios can be imagined for many parts of the country.

[The Stationmaster]

I don't see that it would have made any difference to traffic in the Southampton area as trains would still have used the existing routes in that area (the route didn't actually get to Southampton) - It would have cut a corner for intermodal traffic though and assuming better junctions on the DN&S, then the recent Reading rebuild could have looked quite different.

 

Not quite sure how big a commuter market i'd expect between Oxfordshire and Southampton, but it would be logical that it had a local service, and some (but not all) cross country passenger trains could have used it if upgraded to give enough capacity (my understanding is it was mainly single track?)...

 

As already noted - double line (during WWII and until closure) north of Newbury and single to the south but most crossing loops were lengthened during the war.  After the war it returned to rural sleepiness and the passenger train service was always pretty lightly used, certainly on the section north of Newbury and the only through freight (and in final years the only freight) was occasional oil trains - in about 5 hours of a day spent watching the line in the year before complete closure I saw only one train, of oil tank cars.

 

While retaining it might have avoided some of the recent major rebuild of Reading West Jcn the alternative could well have been need for a  flyover at Didcot in order to get across the GWML.  I very much doubt its appeal as a through passenger route had it survived because it would have missed Reading which is an important centre for interchange, and therefore revenue, on the present day Cross Country route.  and no chance of reopening as some bits of it have been under the A34 for many years let alone that which more recently went under the Newbury bypass while the embankment it was carried on as it approached Didcot was bulldozed away several years ago so completely that you can't even trace where the railway was.

[cal.n]

I have often considered modelling a 'what if' layout on the, now closed, St Andrews branch. It would probably not be electrified, and therefore have 156s and 158s with the regular ScotRail service. The town is busy as it is with American golfers wanting to play the 'old course' at the home of golf, this would allow varied loco hauled charters including the Belmond Royal Scotsman and maybe even preserved steam. It could also include MOD traffic to the Army (ex RAF) base at nearby Leuchars.

[guzzler17]

 It would have cut a corner for intermodal traffic though

Only by 6 miles according to the book by T.B. Sands.

 

To save that distance traffic would have had to negotiate a lot of 1 in 106 grades in both directions.  Unlike the route via Reading I doubt that a 1200 tonne freight would have been able to bowl along at a maximum of 75mph.

 

Perhaps it was best that the GWR and L&SWR "got together" to ensure that the DN&S didn't succeed.

[Miss Prism]

Perhaps it was best that the GWR and L&SWR "got together" to ensure that the DN&S didn't succeed.

 

Even as a deep-rooted DN&S fan, I can't disagree with that. The gradient argument is significant, and manning all those signalboxes got too expensive. It's demise was inevitable.

[Zomboid]

I'm not sure the liners can actually do 75 on the SWML, aren't freights on the southern limited to 2/3 of the posted speed? As that line is largely 90/100, that would mean 60/65 for freights.

Not that they'd go much quicker over the DNS, but if it were open as a freight link then that wouldn't matter so much as they wouldn't be in front of passenger trains.