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TEFS visit to West Germany August 1974

Lingen Rheine Emden TEFS



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#26 bingley hall

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Posted 10 February 2017 - 05:43

 

Bingley Hall, are you sure about Bill Alborough's demise? A friend of mine from the 80's TEFS trips got an invite to last September's annual reunion and, although he didn't go, I'm sure he would have mentioned it.

Anyway, 'hope you find the photos interesting.  Cheers, Ray.

 

Not 100% sure. I thought I heard it from a friend when I was back in the UK about 3 years ago. Memory could be playing tricks.

 

Trevor - last 012s was May 75 as I recall.





#27 bingley hall

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Posted 10 February 2017 - 05:48

It would appear I was only 10 days behind you - this was taken on a solo visit at Rheine shed on 28 August 1974

 

6293456354_d6a086d2fa_o.jpg


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#28 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 13:22

Trevor,

Consulting World Steam, it seems that most of the 012s were withdrawn from the start of the summer timetable in 1975, which I suppose started on Sunday 1st June. Certainly I was back there in early May and the 012s were performing as expected on a limited number of diagrams - over two days I saw 012 061/6/75/81 at work (WS records there still being seven serviceable at that time). The one exception was 012 061, retained for railtour duties, and I suppose it could also have substituted for a failed diesel during that summer - WS records the occasional use of a class 042 on passenger duties after May 1975.

Bill


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 11 February 2017 - 13:25 .

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#29 Trev52A

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 15:07

Bill & bingley hall: thank you for confirming those dates.

 

Also bingley hall: ah! Rheine shed. Nice view of an 043 on the turntable. The first working steam shed I visited since Lostock hall back in 1968. Here are some of my pics from 16th August 1974. Any German speakers here to translate the sign, please? Pity the locos are facing the wrong way across the turntable, but helpfully they all had the loco number on the back of the tender.

 

Cheers

Trevor

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • (277c) 043 903-4 Rheine 16-8-74.jpg
  • (1108c) Roundhouse Rheine 16-8-74.jpg
  • (1114b) 042 024-0 + 042 245-1 Rheine 16-8-74 .jpg

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#30 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 16:30

Traverse slowly - although a sign in English would be worded differently.

 

Bill


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 11 February 2017 - 18:53 .


#31 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 19:04

This thread has inspired me to have another look at my shots from 1974. I only ever printed a few of them at the time and although I have since scanned all the negs, I still haven't got round to optimising them in Photoshop, except for the few I've put on Fotocommunity. Here's one I did this afternoon which shows 012 066 romping along near Leschede. The only other details in my notes are that it passed me at 13:15 on Friday 6th September 1974, but referring to the July 1974 edition of World Steam, I reckon it must have been train D1734, 11:07 Emden Aussenhafen to Rheine (probably to a destination beyond Rheine but that's where the 012 came off the train).

 

Bill

 

PS This was taken using a Pentax Spotmatic II with a Takumar 85mm lens on Ilford Pan F film, which was developed in Paterson's Acutol. This allowed the film to be uprated somewhat - probably only by half a stop so it was still a pretty slow film, albeit the grain is virtually invisible.

 

PPS A web search suggests that train D1734 went through to Köln Hbf.

Attached Thumbnails

  • 74_16_12 copy.jpg

Edited by Bill Jamieson, 06 March 2017 - 09:11 .

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#32 Trev52A

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 10:22

Bill - thank you for the translation. Here's another one for you but you'll have to use your imagination a bit - part of the sign is missed off the photo! To be honest, I don't think I was even aware of it when I took the picture at the north end of Meppen station. It's of a southbound freight double-headed rather unusually I think by D-H 212 151-5 and 012 080-8. Apparently something is 'verboten' (forbidden) - hopefully not photography at this spot.

I'm glad you are dusting off your old pics, Bill. Keep them coming! A nice shot at Leschede - do you have any at Meppen or Lingen where I was? Most of my pics of German trains in action also show the continuous escape of steam below the cylinders. Pardon my ignorance, but It seems a waste of steam - not just the drain cocks, is it?

 

Cheers

Trevor 

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • (1132b) 212 151-5 + 012 080-8 Meppen 17-8-74.jpg

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#33 olivegreen

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 10:30

I think it is 'Betreten der Bahnanlagen verboten'  which, if it is, means literally 'entry to the railway layout forbidden' (something I occasionally have to say (in English) to SWMBO, by the way!)

 

What would we say -   'Keep out of railway property' ?  …or something like that !

 

Mike

 

 

Edited to add thanks for posting these pictures - fascinating stuff.


Edited by olivegreen, 12 February 2017 - 10:31 .


#34 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 13:07

Trevor, I agree with Mike's conjectured wording - the equivalent of a 'No Trespassing' sign.

 

I have quite a few shots to the south of Lingen, particularly on the then single track section between Hanekenfaehre and Elbergen, but only one shot I can think of at Meppen, at least in 1974. According to my notes I took a few around Meppen the following year but I haven't scanned all the negs from that year yet.

 

Here's one of a tank train from the refinery at Holthausen (just south of Lingen) crossing the River Ems / Dortmund-Ems Canal behind 042 186 at 17:14 on Friday 6th September 1974.

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • 74_17_1.jpg

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#35 Trev52A

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 16:36

Mike/Bill: thank you for clearing up the meaning of the sign at Meppen. I had a feeling it meant something like that.

 

Bill: that's a dramatic shot of the oil train crossing the bridge. I was not aware of that spot but we must have passed over it on our way from Rheine to Lingen. I think I have found the location on Google Earth.

I didn't know about the oil refinery at Holthausen either - presumably the train in this shot just north of Rheine station (still under the wires) was on its way there.

 

Cheers

Trevor

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • (403eS) 042 113-1 north of Rheine station 16-8-74.jpg

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#36 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 12 February 2017 - 17:16

Trevor, I expect so, and by coincidence I also saw 042 113 working tender first to Holthausen - that was just before a quarter to ten on the morning of Saturday 7th September, with the 2-8-2 working back light engine to Rheine shed just under an hour later - see http://www.fotocommu...mieson/35209550

Regarding the very unusual 212/012 double heading, the former suggests to me that it was probably a pick-up freight (ein Sammler), and I wonder if the 012 had failed somewhere and was being towed back to Rheine shed for attention.

 

Looking more closely at my notes, it appears that I didn't actually take any shots at Meppen in May 1975 - on the 9th, I think it was raining, and I spent the whole day just observing trains, at Lathen in the morning and then Meppen in the afternoon (I was camped at a site in Meppen, as far as I can remember). I spent all of the following day photographing around Lathen.

 

Attached is a shot taken at Rheine MPD on the early afternoon of 7/9/74 - I think 012 066 (left) and 012 063 would have worked in on D715, 09:20 from Norddeich, and D1734, 11:07 from Emden Aussenhafen respectively.

 

Bill

Attached Thumbnails

  • 74_19_21 copy.jpg

Edited by Bill Jamieson, 13 February 2017 - 11:28 .

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#37 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 13 February 2017 - 11:22

74_17_6 copy.jpg

Here's one for today (but I'm not promising a new shot every day!) - 043 903 heading north near Meppen at 07:24 on 7/9/74 with iron-ore empties for Emden (or could it have been export coal?).

 

Bill

 

PS For any fan of Rheine-Emden, I would recommend the EK album "Eisenzeit" by Wolfgang Staiger. I bought it a few years ago from the Ludwig bookshop at Koeln Hbf on the strength of the b&w front cover (it was sealed). I was a bit disappointed to find that it was predominantly in colour inside, but nevertheless it's still a great book (and the colour shots would suit most folk). The author worked as a fireman during 1974 to fund his studies, so had access to a lot of photographic possibilities which wouldn't otherwise have been accessible. There are also some amusing tales, which obviously require a reasonable grasp of German to appreciate, but the text is only a small proportion of the content and the photos alone are still worth the 40E cover price. I believe there are a couple of other albums by Wolfgang on the same theme but I presume these are now out of print. Unfortunately it would appear he died a couple of years ago in his early 60s.

https://www.ekshop.d.../eisenzeit.html


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 22 February 2017 - 19:28 .

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#38 Trev52A

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Posted 14 February 2017 - 17:37

Good stuff, Bill. If I had been there for more than a couple of days I expect I would have found some good spots like you did. Love the location of your shot near Meppen.

 

Thanks for the info on the book, which I had not come across before. On the same theme - have you seen 'All Trains To Stop' by Hans Steeneken, published by Ian Allan in 1979? All b&w, a mix of end of BR steam, NCB, French and German steam. Quite a few on Rheine-Emden. Some brilliant photography, more arty/atmospheric than most picture books. The photographer is Dutch but all the text is in English - a continental Colin Gifford, perhaps?

 

Continuing the original theme, here are a couple of shots of the same loco - 012 100-4. The b&w was northbound at Meppen on 17th August 1974, the colour was northbound (again) at Lingen the following day.

 

Cheers

Trevor

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • (1127cS) 012 100-4 nr Meppen Germany 17-8-74 .jpg
  • (169dS) 012 100-4 Lingen 18-8-74 .jpg

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#39 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 15 February 2017 - 07:12

Trevor, I had the advantage of a car which enabled me to find some out of the way spots but it also meant I neglected station areas where the best chances of a decent exhaust were probably available.

 

While perusing some 1974 editions of WS I came across this advert for the TEFS tour:-

 

RHEINE 15-19 AUGUST 1974: Long weekend by rail and sea to Rheine at the peak of the Summer services, giving one weekday (Friday), a Saturday with all the extras and the full Summer service, and a Sunday when almost anything can happen. Departure London Liverpool Street 2000 Thursday 15 August by rail to Harwich, overnight by boat to Hook of Holland, rail to Rheine, 2 nights B&B, returning the same route to reach Liverpool Street 0915 Monday 19 August. Fare abot £30 to £33 depending upon numbers and rate of exchange at the date of travel, for return journey and  2 nights B&B, 4-berth 2nd class cabins and 2- and single-berth 1st class cabins at various supplements between £2.20 and £8 return available. Travel Insurance £1 extra, deposit £11 (incl Insuance).

 

Finally, here are two shots taken at Bw Rheine on the early afternoon of Saturday 7/9/74.

 

042 308 & 042 168.jpg

042 308 and 042 168, two of Rheine's impressive re-boilered, oil-fired 2-8-2s, originally class 41.

 

044 534 & 043 737.jpg

Emden's 044 534 which had worked in mid-morning double-heading with 042 241 on a 4,000 tonne iron-ore train, and Rheine's own oil-fired 043 737 which I didn't see working on this trip. The tender in the centre belongs to another of the Emden coal-fired locos, 044 481.

 

Bill

 

PS It's years since I've since that Hans Steeneken book and I can't recall now why I didn't buy it at the time (possibly a lack of cash?!) - it's one that if I come across a decent s/h copy I will certainly snap it up.


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 15 February 2017 - 08:20 .

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#40 Trev52A

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Posted 15 February 2017 - 09:11

Two more excellent photos there, Bill. As you will recall from my earlier post all the locos were facing away from the turntable when we went to Rheine shed.

 

Yes, that is the tour I was on, which you found advertised in World Steam. I probably saw the same one in Railway World or Railway Mag around around June 1974.Incidentally, I started this thread to try and locate anyone else from the same tour - no luck so far. Any ideas where else I could try, rather than a model railway site?

 

Regarding the Steeneken book - I bought mine in a PDSA charity shop a year or two ago for about £1 !!

 

Here's another one of mine - northbound ore empties at Lingen station, just below the footbridge at the north end, which Google Earth shows has since been removed.

 

Cheers

Trevor

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • (1134dS) 043 336-7  Lingen 18-8-74.jpg

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#41 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 15 February 2017 - 09:28

That's a great shot, Trevor, which takes full advantage of the 6x6 format.

 

My only suggestion is to try and make contact with Continental Railway Circle members - http://www.trainweb...._newsgroup.html

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

PS That's probably about the best £1 you've ever spent!

PPS Unfortunately HS died a few years back - https://blog.mechani...hans-steeneken/ (this looks like an interesting website)


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 15 February 2017 - 09:36 .


#42 Trev52A

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 09:02

Thanks for the information, Bill. I'll check them out.

 

Glad you liked the 043 shot. It was cropped in a bit, hence the slight telephoto effect.

 

Here is another one - an 042 leaving Meppen with a northbound passenger train (instead of the expected 012), apparently No 042 353-2 according to notes on the negative packet.

 

Keep the photos coming!

 

Cheers

Trevor

Attached Thumbnails

  • (1131c) 042 353-2 Meppen17-8-74.jpg

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#43 Trev52A

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Posted 16 February 2017 - 12:37

I've just come across this shot I took in 1976 of 012 104-6 as preserved, during its spell at Carnforth. Notice the sheet of flames under the firebox. Did anyone photograph a working example as clean as this?

 

Cheers

Trevor

Attached Thumbnails

  • (278aS) 012 104-6 Carnforth 20-6-76 .jpg

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#44 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 13:19

I've just come across this shot I took in 1976 of 012 104-6 as preserved, during its spell at Carnforth. Notice the sheet of flames under the firebox. Did anyone photograph a working example as clean as this?

 

Cheers

Trevor

 

Trevor, I'm pretty sure that I never saw an 012 in this sort of condition during my two visits to Rheine but I wonder if even an ex-works loco would have looked quite like this. My memory is that the black paint used by the works had a sort of bituminous quality to it, so that even when new it didn't have a high gloss and also seemed to attract the dirt (plus all those pipes, ducts and rodding along the boiler must have made the cladding very difficult to keep clean).

 

I like the incipient glint off the class 042 at Meppen (it's obviously too dirty to give a full glint) but the loco can't be 042 353 if you've recorded the control digit correctly as -2. 042 363 would fit though and this was still active from Rheine shed in 1974 (it gets a mention in the book 'Eisenzeit').

 

Bill

 

PS Will upload more shots in due course.


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 17 February 2017 - 13:21 .


#45 Trev52A

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 16:01

Thanks for that, Bill.

Now that I think about it, I agree with you about the non-gloss finish of the black paint as applied pre-preservation. In fact I'm pretty sure those boiler bands were never polished, either. Earlier in this thread there are some shots of other preserved locos and some have shiny bands, others do not. Here's the cleanest loco I saw in 1974 - 042 164-4 near Lingen with ore hoppers - non-shiny black with no polished bands.

 

Thanks for pointing out the discrepancy over the number of the 042 in the b&w shot. My 1974 Rheiner Dampf has a list of allocations and the one you mentioned is on it. Must be that one, then. (That's what I like about the 'check number' at the end - keeps spotters right as well as the computer system!)

 

Looking forward to seeing more of your pics.

 

Cheers

Trevor

Attached Thumbnails

  • (991cS) 042 164-4 nr Lingen 18-8-74 .jpg

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#46 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 17 February 2017 - 20:23

Trevor, agreed about (1) polished boiler bands and (2) the usefulness of check digits, although I confess I never bothered to note them myself. Looking through my raw scans, 042 164 looks to have still been in a clean condition three weeks after your visit and 042 320 was immaculate, so possibly ex-works.

74_16_13 043364.jpg

043 364 heads south with bogie hoppers on the single line section over the River Ems from Hanekenfähre and is seen approaching Elbergen, where double track recommenced. 13:31 on 6:9:74

 

74_17_12 012100 copy 2.jpg

012 100 has just entered the single track section at Hanekenfähre and is about to cross the River Ems / Dortmund-Ems Canal with train E3260, the 07:50 Norddeich Mole to Rheine. 10:08 on 7:9:74

PS I'm no expert on DB passenger rolling stock, but I believe the baggage van behind the loco is a pre-war vehicle.


Edited by Bill Jamieson, 06 March 2017 - 09:06 .

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#47 Trev52A

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 08:52

More evocative shots, Bill. That bridge is quite spectacular - pity I never got there.

Incidentally, my previous shot was of a 2-8-2 on an ore train. Was this unusual? - all my other pics show the big 2-10-0s  working them. Perhaps it was being run in after works(!)

 

Here are a couple of an 012 waiting to back on to a northbound train at Rheine on 18th August. Shows some nice weathering on the wheels. Fortunately this one still had its DB plate on the cabside - they always looked a bit bare without them (a bit like a 'Britannia' without its nameplates, perhaps?) 

 

Cheers

Trevor

Attached Thumbnails

  • (992bS) 012 82-4 Rheine 18-8-74   .jpg
  • (168bS) 012 082-4 Rheine Germany 18-8-74 .jpg

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#48 Bill Jamieson

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 11:09

Keep them coming, Trevor!

 

Regarding 042s on ore trains, photographic evidence suggests it was not unusual to see them piloting on the heaviest trains (indeed I saw an 042/044 combination myself) but I think it would be fairly exceptional to see one on its own, although a load of empties would presumably be well within their capabilities.

 

Bill



#49 EddieB

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 11:55

Whether West German steam suffered from lack of cleaning in its last days (in the same way that British Railways did), it makes an interesting comparison with East Germany where most locomotives were usually kept very clean - albeit without instances of polished boiler bands.  A further comparison can be made with Czechoslovakia, which used a different shade of black(!) - more of a "blackberry black" - that seemed to give their locomotives a much smarter appearance when seen side by side with German locomotives (even in preservation), though their in-service condition did vary considerably.



#50 Trev52A

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Posted 18 February 2017 - 15:13

Thanks for that information, Eddie. Sadly I never saw any 'real' East German steam but pictures I have seen certainly bear out what you say.

 

Two more, both at Rheine on 16th August 1974, the day we arrived. The northbound 043 was north of the station just before the end of the overhead wires, and the electric was in the station waiting to head south. It must have already been standing there as our train got in, as I can't ever recall seeing an 012 being taken off a southbound train. (Certainly don't have a photo of that happening.)

 

Cheers

Trevor

Attached Thumbnails

  • (1120hS) 043 574-3 nr Rheine 16-8-74.jpg
  • (396dS) 104 020-3 Rheine station 16-8-74 .jpg

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