Shez's workbench

[Shez]

Following my contributions to the North British coaches thread I have decided to tentatively share some of my other projects. As a relatively  inexperienced kit builder I don't expect to be able to pass on much in the way of advice, but I hope my efforts might inspire others to have a go

In terms of subject matter, my main interest is the North British Railway, and I hope that the stock constructed will form the basis of a layout when I can get the loft cleared. However, I am fascinated by pre-group railways generally, especially those which served Northern England and Southern Scotland, so don't be surprised at sudden tangents which could be Caley, North Eastern, Midland or Great Central. Anything form Malliag to Mexborough and all points in between!

 

As for period, we are looking at about 1900 to 1930. I have never had much inclination to model what I can remember my self. I would rather attempt to recreate what I wish I had seen. 

 

First up My current project NBR Class D  

 

This is one of Jim McGeowan's Claymore kits range, originally produced by George Dawson. These locomotives were designed by Matthew Holmes and were later rebuilt by the LNER who classified them as J83. However, mine will be in its original condition with lock up safety valves on the dome, outside brake rods, and the smaller splashers on the front wheels.

 

I have already completed the chassis, and the footplate. I like to get a completed and working chassis as soon as possible with the basic footplate so I can check for clearances as I build the body. 

 

 

This was a straightforward build. The chassis is in nickle silver and I used my Master Chassis from Hobby Holidays to get everything square. The chassis is rigid, with Slater's Wheels and plunger pick ups. ( I don't always use them but they seemed right for this model) and a motor and gear box from Peter Mullen at 62C models. Nothing really departing from the instructions at this stage. 

 

Edited January 5, 2017 by Shez

[Shez]

For some reason the initial post would not let me add any more so I have had to reply to myself. 

 

Once I had fitted the footplate a problem did reveal its self. The buffer beam brackets came right across the middle of the holes in the buffer beams. Neither the white metal buffers supplied in the kit, or the sprung ones I have got from 62C (Peter Mullen is a great source of all things NBR) would  fit so the brackets will need to be bent or trimmed. I then completed the brake gear added the pick ups and motor and painted the chassis. ( Thanks for priming it Jamie)

 

 

 

Next it was off to Wakefield for a spin on the clubs test track. The reverse curves were negotiated with no obvious problems and the clearances were fine. A further run on a rolling road worked the motor and gears in. 

 

I have now started work on the body of the locomotive. When building an NBR tank the next bit is always a bit scary, as the tank tops have to be curved. Jim adds a set of supplementary instructions to the kit, and I used the process he describes. The tanks were bent over a 4mm bar and then worked by hand to shape using the tank ends as a guide.

 

 

 

The tank sides were then cleaned up and I tested them for fit on the footplate. Jim suggests in his supplementary instructions that the tank tops are too wide and need to be filed down by about half a millimetre. I have done this, but having then done a test fitting using some blue tack it seems that they may have to be trimmed further. I finished the session by cutting out and cleaning some of the other parts including the cab front plate and the cab beading. This will be the next job. All good so far. I also have to make a decision as to exactly which loco it will represent before I  fix on the tank ends. Some of the class were fitted with Westinghouse pumps here, while others were simply unfitted goods locos.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Spitfire2865]

Nice to see another pre/post grouping modeler.

Looking nice. Those tank curves look a nightmare to get right. Most have enough trouble with tender flares.

[Shez]

Thanks for the positive comments Spitfire and the likes from others. I don't claim to have the curves perfect ( a bit flat)  but they are symmetrical and will do for me!  Some more progress on sub assemblies today. Done the cab beading, handrails and front spectacle plates, as well as some more filing and fettlling. Hopefully some time in the morning to perhaps move things on before going to watch Huddersfield Town embark on the road to Wembley. 

[Shez]

Good progress over the last couple of days. A session on Saturday morning saw the sub assemblies coming together to construct the first part of the body. I started by soldering the cab front in place as a point  to work from. This departs from the order in the instructions but I felt it enabled me to get the tank sides square. On my first tank loco I ended up with one side slightly too far over. The slots and tabs should be used as a guide rather than simply taken as the locating point. I found I had to file the tabs down a bit to get a good fit.I then soldered the tank sides to which I had already attached the cab beading and handrails the previous day. I like to use 179 solder for running the long seams on tank engines as it flows nicely. I was pleasantly surprised how well everything fitted as Jim's supplementary instructions suggested some filling may be needed. Perhaps he has made some changes to the etches after his initial build of George's original kit. I did a dry run with the cab back and bunker rear and they seemed to well fit too.

 

 

Some days just go well, and a 4-0 cup win made it even better!  However the previous day had not run as smoothly. I fitted the cab beading in the usual way, by making an initial tack solder, and then working it round using a piece of 6mm diameter rod. (if you are new to kitbuilding never throw away any off cuts of rod, pipe or old broom handles!) I used 188 for this job and like the experts tell us did the soldering from the inside. So far, so good. I obviously got a bit slack here as moving on to the second one I managed to put the initial tacks on the outside by mistake. Result a frustrating clearing up session. Moral - always finish a session and pack up when things are going well - so easy to make a slip.However the great thing about brass and solder is you can usually find a way to rectify your mistakes.  I also took the opportunity to add handrails to the bunker sides and footplate. I usually use card spacers under the handrail and again soldered from the back. 

 

I don't envisage much time for progress this week due to family commitments - so it will probably be a week or so before another update. 

Edited January 8, 2017 by Shez

[Shez]

Some further progress over the last few days. Most of the build is proving to be straightforward, but I will just highlight where I departed from the usual sequence.

 

When completing the side tanks I also made up the boiler to check how it would fit. Jim's supplementary instructions were correct. A fair bit of filing was needed to get the boiler to sit between the tanks. If I was building the kit again I would have taken more off while it was in the flat. I also made the decision that this was to be an unfitted loco, so steps were attached at the front of both tanks. 

 

I then turned attention to the rear of the loco and the cab interior. Jim suggests another departure from the build sequence here. Don't fit the back of the cab, or the cab floor yet. Much easier to get the soldering iron in from this direction to fit the cab floor, front boxes, and splashers. I made these up before they were fitted. The small curved part at the back was tricky. I don't usually anneal the metal, but decided to do so in this case. A little bit of filling will be needed as the boxes were not quite large enough to reach the cab walls. I was a little worried about clearances inside the splashers, so the body was attached to the chassis and a quick test run took place. No problem. I tend to check this constantly. I failed to do so on the second loco I built and paid the price - lots of hacking about followed to get it to run!

 

 

I then decided to fit the lamp irons, which might seem a strange decision at this stage. However, NBR loco's even a humble tank like this carried enough lamp irons to decorate a Blackpool tram. No less than twelve, with five on each of the front and rear buffer beams. They etchings were also very small and frail. Cleaning them up was looking a nightmare. So I soldered each in position, made a quick dart into the right angle with the iron to make them secure, and then cleaned them up in position on the footplate with a small file. Off course if you model LNER or BR you don't need them all. I used 188 solder, so if I attach the other body parts with 145 there should not be a problem.

 

Today, I prepared some of the other parts for the cab, and began to fix the bars to the rear windows. Here a problem presented its self, and I think it may be just bad luck with this kit, as Jim's kits are usually spot on. The holes around the rear windows had etched through into a series of semi circles, making the bars difficult to attach. After an afternoon session and only half of them done I needed to call it a day! I needed to use quite a bit of solder, and its not one of my neatest job's so some careful clearing up will be needed.

 

 

The final picture summarizes progress so far. Neither the boiler nor cab back are yet fixed, but the fact they fit is encouraging. A clean up and another quick test run showed that all seems well.

[Shez]

Here is the latest update. 

 

Completing the rear windows took another hour or so. Not my neatest ever job, but a decent coal load should deflect some attention. I then got on with completing the rear part of the loco. What seems like a simple little tank is proving an interesting challenge. The cab and bunker are both quite small and its not always easy to get your iron in where you want it. I made the cab boxes and the rear of the bunker as sub assemblies first, and then attached them with 145 solder. The bunker rear has quite a sharp pronounced flare at the top, and once again I had to resort to heating the metal to form the bend. 

 

 

I then turned to the coal rails. The kit provides an etch for both the NBR open version and the LNER plated version. I opted for the earlier open rails for my loco. I made them up first on a simple jig using a piece of wood, drawing pins, and lots of blu tack. So far so good. However once I tried to fit them they proved to be rather too large, and a good deal of fettling was needed. I attached them using 145 solder, having first built the rail with 188. I then found that the bunker back must have been slightly out, as the corner of the rail didn't correspond to the corner of the bunker.  I the end I attached the back rail and one side first, snipped the other side off and reattached it. Soldering does give you a get out of jail card!

 

With the rear of the loco now complete, except for the cab roof, I now turned to the front end. I rolled the smokebox, using a set of small rolling bars I got for last birthday from KET Designs. This made a much neater job than my previous efforts on smoke boxes using broom handles and a mouse mat! This was then formed around the smokebox front pinned to a piece of wood with a drawing pin. ( I couldn't manage without drawing pins, blu tack, cocktail sticks and wooden pegs) As Jim's supplementary instructions point out, the formers inside the smokebox are too wide and have to be filed down to make the rear part fit. I then tested it with the boiler to check fit along with the extra plate for the wingplates as shown in the photograph. After the tribulations of the back end everything went together well.

 

 

I feel the loco is now starting to show its character, and is building into a really nice model. Another bit of excitement today, was the final arrival of my christmas present from the family. A G7 0-4-4T, from Peter at 62C. Just looking in the box it looks an excellent kit and will be perfect motive power for the six wheel coaches. 

[Shez]

One part of the model that I have been contemplating with some trepidation is another of the signature features of a Holmes tank loco, the hand rails on the top of the tanks. These would not normally present a problem, but in another bit of NBR quirkiness, they form a bend around the tank filler caps. They are in a prominent place, and could really spoil the look of the whole locomotive. Over the last week or so I have been chewing over how I might do this, involving much reading, doodling and wire bending.  I used some 7mm wire, and replaced the split pins in the kit with some small brass handrail knobs from the ever useful 62C.

 

I then made up a small simple jig which involved drawing out the handrail on a piece of of off cut board and fixing two small nails at the points of the bend. Having made the first bend I then wrapped the wire around a piece of pipe of the correct diameter, and then went around the second one. After a bit more twisting and hand forming, I did manage to come up two pieces that were pretty much symmetrical at my second go. It was then a case of fixing them on, which meant sliding the knobs on to the rail and soldering in place.

 

 

I was quite relieved this worked as I will have to do similar rails of the G7 tank I mentioned in the last post. Having got these done, I decided to indulge in a quick test run, to make sure the smokebox doesn't foul the front wheels, so I attached boiler and smokebox with some blue tack and put the body back on the chassis. The castings were put on to add some weight - but are of course not yet fixed. The photo also shows the bits I used to form the handrails 

 

 

Next job will be to detail the boiler. I must say I am thoroughly enjoying chronicling the build. The fact you are going to photograph it and post it, really does stop you rushing, and makes you think about each part of the process. 

Edited January 29, 2017 by Shez

[Shez]

Since my last post, life has been a bit hectic, so any time I have had has been for building rather than photographing and posting. The result, another model joining the ever lengthening queue for the paintshop!  As she is an unfitted goods loco I am probably going to finish her in the later black NBR goods livery. There is a photograph of number 808 in this livery on page 23 of "Scottish steam in the Golden Age" by RD Stephen.

 

 

As for the rest of the build it progressed without any big problems. I finished detailing the boiler with the straps and bands, and replaced the split pins supplied in Jim's kit with brass handrail knobs. The shunters steps with which these locos were fitted from about 1907 were built up separately using 188 solder and then attached with 145. All the steps had bits of scrap etch added at the back as strengtheners. The only hitch was when I realized I had made two left hand shunters steps, so it was de solder and start again. I formed the boiler handrail using a jig like the one I used for the rail at the top of the tank. (technique demonstrated in Geoff Holt's excellent book) For once I got this right, and was able to make the rail from one piece. I drilled holes in the end of the tanks and soldered the handrails in to give extra security. Then it was just adding the castings - the kit giving options for both NBR and LNER. The smokebox dart is a lost wax casting from 62C.

 

Once painted I will add sprung NBR Buffers from 62C. I have stuck these on with blu tack for the photo which is why one looks a bit lop sided. 

 

I think the finished loco shows real character. One of the reasons I like building locos from this period is that they are as designed, before subsequent owners committed crimes against locomotive aesthetics in the name of efficiency. The distinctive Drummond/ Holmes dome with the lock up safety valves suits the loco much more than the lower LNER rebuilt version. 

 

As to kit, I would recommend it to anyone of an NBR, LNER, Scottish persuasion. It was possible for an inexperienced builder like my self to achieve a pleasing outcome, with some interesting challenges along the way. (tank tops, handrails, and the very sharp curves on the bunker and splasher) I might at some stage in the future build another, this time as the dual braked version. Now to do a bit of thinking on whats next.

 

 

[Shez]

I said to expect tangents so here is one. A Caley Pickersgill 4-4-0.

 

I think I might be needing some guidance with this one. Its an Alba Models kit, though looking at the instructions I think its part of the stock that came from Meteor Models, as the instructions still have that heading. I am aware of all the issues with locos of this wheel arrangement, and so this build will be a bit of a learning curve for a couple of future NBR projects. ( a Scot and a Glen) I envisage this being quite a long term build with other stuff along side. As well as the kit which I  have had for some time I have also got together Slaters wheels and an ABC gearbox.

 

 

 

 

So here are some questions I am considering...

 

Should I go with the whole thing just as it is. I am confident that I can now build a working rigid chassis. Is it possible to build a 4-4-0 with a rigid chassis that works well? The "Malcolm Graeme" thread springs to mind.

 

Should I push on a bit and add tender picks ups and perhaps a bit of springing or compensation on the tender. ( Had some really helpful advice from Jazz on this)

 

Be ambitious and adapt the loco chassis. Sprung chassis using hornguides? One axle or both? Or would I be adding expense and risk beyond my competence?

 

I have been really fascinated by Sandy's split axle on tender method, but can I bring myself to saw a Christmas present from my wife and kids in half!

 

While I realise that the final answers rest with me, I would appreciate any thoughts, experiences, or advice from those who have built loco's of this wheel arrangement in 7mm scale.

 

 

[Sandy Harper]

One I did earlier! Actually a rebuild of a rather damaged model.

 

[Shez]

Thanks for that Sandy.

 

Hope mine turns out looking half as good. 

 

What arrangements are there for chassis and pick up on your model?

[Sandy Harper]

Thanks for that Sandy.

 

Hope mine turns out looking half as good. 

 

What arrangements are there for chassis and pick up on your model?

I can't quite recall how I did it but I'm sure I would have put springing on the front drivers but only allowing  about .5mm down ward movement on the bushes. On a 4-4-0 you don't need any upward movement. Pickups were phosphor bronze back scratchers on the drivers.

 

Regards

Sandy

Edited February 21, 2017 by Sandy Harper

[Shez]

So would you elongate the hole in the way you explained, but only at the bottom, and not solder the bearing in place?

 

Is this better than a hornblock on a 4 4 0, as that would mean there was both up and down movement?

 

Sorry to ask what may seem to be obvious questions!

[Sandy Harper]

So would you elongate the hole in the way you explained, but only at the bottom, and not solder the bearing in place?

 

Is this better than a hornblock on a 4 4 0, as that would mean there was both up and down movement?

 

Sorry to ask what may seem to be obvious questions!

You can certainly use  hornblocks if you wish. They are a more 'elegant' engineering solution, and an additional cost, just to provide a small amount of vertical movement on the axle.

 

Elongating the bearing hole in the chassis can be done at no cost and only takes a few minutes to complete. The reason for not extending the hole upward is to maintain your ride height on the loco. On a n 0-6-0 you can extend the centre axle hole both up and down without affecting the ride height.

 

A lot of builders would not bother to spring the drivers on a 4-4-0, instead using the bogie spring, and sufficient weight (not too much), to keep everything on the track. What we are talking about here is maintaining all four drivers on the track for reliable electrical pickup. The other option is to fit pickups to the tender and do away with pickups in the loco. That has the benefit of making the loco effectively electrically dead, no pickups or associated wiring and almost no electrical shorting. The choice is yours!

 

Regards

 

Sandy

[Shez]

I was thinking about having pick ups on the loco and the tender. So if I put some springing on the tender with pick ups - built the loco chassis rigid, with the spring on the bogie that should be a fairly simple and cost effective way of setting things up?

 

I have looked at your set up for split chassis tender pick up - but I am not sure if I am that confident. 

[Sandy Harper]

I was thinking about having pick ups on the loco and the tender. So if I put some springing on the tender with pick ups - built the loco chassis rigid, with the spring on the bogie that should be a fairly simple and cost effective way of setting things up?

 

I have looked at your set up for split chassis tender pick up - but I am not sure if I am that confident. 

Yup!

 

No need to go down the split axle/split chassis route if you don't want to. Springing of the pickups, bearing on the top of the wheel treads, should be sufficient.

 

Sandy

[Shez]

So with the sage advice of Sandy and Jazz behind me, I took the plunge (well, a round file) and set about attempting to elongate the central bearing holes on the tender. I won't go into detail on the process as if you want a better explanation look at Jazz's answer to my question on his thread. I elongated them by just less than 1mm up and down, and am fairly happy with the outcome. I don't think there is any sideways play, but I will probably solder some strips to each side just to be sure. The proof of the pudding will be when the chassis comes together. 

 

 

 

I also cut out and prepared the other bits of the tender chassis. There is a provision for a compensation beam for the front two wheels. However that would mean me elongating two holes and I think I am safer staying with the one if it will do the job. 

 

Jazz recommended 20000 piano wire for the springs, but I cant seem to find that size on either Squires or Eileens website, or are they using a different method of sizing? If I had the pick ups bearing down on the wheels, would I still need springing on the bearing? I was thinking of cutting some notches in the top of the chassis having some strips of copperclad across, and some pickups coming from them onto the wheel treads. I have some 10000 beryllium copper which might be appropriate.

 

Just to thank everyone for their responses - so much advice freely given really does give you confidence. If this thread of mine does one thing I hope it will encourage others to have a go!

Edited February 23, 2017 by Shez

[EKR]

I don't think the gauge of the wire is that important, as long a it's springy.

If you fold it like a hair grip, adjusting  the bend will change the amount of spring.

 

Works a treat. Having followed Sandy and Jazz all my builds use it.

 

ps. The 0 gauge guild have a CD of Sandy demonstrating split axles, definitely worth watching.

[Shez]

Sorry folks - another really obvious question.

 

I have put the tender chassis together and all seems fine - I now just need to add the spring.

 

Still a bit confused here - do I solder it both sides of the hole? Or just one side?. Does it then simply rest on the bearing?

Got even more confused reading an article in an old GOG gazette which seemed to suggest soldering the spring to the bearing unless I have miss understood. 

 

LInk to a picture would be good. Have bee trying to visualize EKR's suggestion.

[EKR]

Tried to send you a photo, but it requires webhosting and I haven't time for that nonsense today.

Happy to email it if you want.

Best is just to trawl through Jazz and Sandy's building threads and you'll stumble across variants of it.

 

Basically you drill a fine hole on one side of the bush and just bend the very end of the spring's tip so it locates in the hole and stops it rotating.

You can solder it in place or not bother.

The spring can be either folded or left straight depending on the chassis. and the space available.

I like bending the spring as it makes adjusting the pressure simple.

[Shez]

Thanks EKR

 

Had a good trawl through as you suggested, and there are a number of variations on the theme.

[Shez]

I have now completed the tender chassis on the Pickersgill, and have taken my first tentative steps away from rigidity into the wonderful world of springs! The chassis appears to run nice and smoothly with all the wheels on the track, so I am pleased with the result. The chassis generally went together well, and I then added the brake gear. Springs are 20 thou piano wire as recommended by Jazz. I didn't find any need to secure it to the bearing as they sat quite happily. I will try that in the next project. If I was being a bit self critical I could perhaps have got the brake shoes tighter to the wheels. However, as I am experimenting with tender pick ups I didn't want to take chances with short circuits. The brake gear is pretty much hidden by the frames anyway. Once painted I have a plan in my head as to where the pick ups will go.

 

 

I have also begun work on the tender body. One thing that quickly became apparent was that the holes in the spacers  for the fixing bolts dd not match up with the ones in the footplate, so quite a bit of filing was necessary. Once that was sorted I cut out, and added the draw and buffer beams along with the valences and frames. I decided to make a small departure from the instructions and add the steps to the valences before soldering them in place. As on the NB tank I used jigs made from wooden blocks to get everything square. I also cut out some notches in the back of the frames where they would otherwise foul the buffers. 

 

 

This was the first time I have built a kit without tabs and slots, so some careful marking out was needed. In many ways I found that the need to do this made me take more care, and I feel I ended up with things aligned accurately. The brass etches are sharp and are of good quality. I have however found the instructions inconsistent. In places they are very clear, in others vague or none existent, so I will be asking for some more guidance!

 

Part of the tender instructions simply say - "make a drawbar"  No parts appear to be provided. I have only previously built one tender loco and I cannot find any similarity to the parts provided in that kit!

[Shez]

Any ideas out there as how I should approach the draw bar?

 

Have some time to think as workbench is temporarily suspended due to the small matter of my daughters wedding this weekend!

[Spitfire2865]

Maybe a couple washers and a center link soldered together?