S7 scratch building

[airnimal]

It is so good to see your work. I am very impressed and I am sure I will learn something new from your wagons. I have built a couple of wagon from the G.N.R many years ago in fine scale.

I am intrigued the way you have set out the express van, I have never seen it done this way. My worry would be getting the 2 sides identical. I try to mark out one on top of the other, so 2 side and 2 ends. I find that that the sides and ends will be identical even if they are wrong.

[Doncaster]

It is so good to see your work. I am very impressed and I am sure I will learn something new from your wagons. I have built a couple of wagon from the G.N.R many years ago in fine scale.

I am intrigued the way you have set out the express van, I have never seen it done this way. My worry would be getting the 2 sides identical. I try to mark out one on top of the other, so 2 side and 2 ends. I find that that the sides and ends will be identical even if they are wrong.

normally yes, but I was on holiday and I'd only got a little 60 thou left!

[Coal Tank]

Hi Doncaster

I rather like your work especially the coke wagons

John

[Doncaster]

Hi Doncaster

I rather like your work especially the coke wagons

John

Thank you. Mind you they're not finished yet lol

[airnimal]

I have not being doing a lot over the past couple of weeks other than enjoying the sunshine.

I am so close to completing the chopper tank its all the little things that need finishing like the sand pipes. So I have made a start on the rear pair using 1.35mm nickel wire and a couple of small split pins. I cut a small piece of brass tube to mount it from the frames at the top.

 

I have revisited the W.& J. Turner wagon going over the lettering. It's still not as I would like but I don't think I am going to get any better.

[Coal Tank]

Hi Mike

The split pins are a nice touch I'll remember that

John

The wagon looks really nice

[N15class]

I often make my own to get finer pins. Either use half round that I've purchased, or by filing any rod needed in half. This can then be wrapped around what it needs to be held and then pinched up tight to make the split pin. I used to do this for handrail knobs in 4mm.

[airnimal]

Only the brake linkage to add along with the front sand pipes, the tank holdings straps and it is nearly finished.

I have made and mounted the shaft from the brake handle today.

Looking at the drawing I have just noticed there is a plate behind the front buffer beam. I think it is to strengthen the open buffer beam.

[airnimal]

Not a lot done for a few days. Daughter number 2 arrived from Aus and is here untill Thursday morning when she flies to Greece then daughter number 3 arrives Thursday afternoon with son in law and grandchildren.

Daughter number 2 pulled so hard on the shower switch and broke it, so i had to go to my local electrical shop to get a replacement. I also spent a couple of hours repairing a expensive pair of sunglasses for number 2. My children think grandad can fix everthing.

 

Anyway enough of the my moaning and back to the chopper tank. I have put the front sand pipes on the same way as I did the rear ones last week. The split pins are over scale but they make for a very strong fixing on a very vulnerable part of the chassis.

 

I need to make the brake stretchers but I am not sure on how I am going to make them. Because I am using split axles they will need some form of insulation. I could use copper clad and gap them but I am wondering if there is a better way.

[Guest curassier]

Airnimal and Doncaster - fantastic modelling !

I would love to have a go at a simple scratch-built wagon.

But what confuses me is the sole bar, floor-height, and bottom plank conundrum !

How the hell do you get that right. I know airnimal you are using your own etched W-irons but is there an equivalent that you would recommend from a small supplier ?
I know it would take valuable time but I would love to see an on-line tutorial here as to how you go from drawing to basic wagon ! I am sure it would be much appreciated.

JM

[wagonman]

Airnimal and Doncaster - fantastic modelling !

I would love to have a go at a simple scratch-built wagon.

But what confuses me is the sole bar, floor-height, and bottom plank conundrum !

How the hell do you get that right. I know airnimal you are using your own etched W-irons but is there an equivalent that you would recommend from a small supplier ?

I know it would take valuable time but I would love to see an on-line tutorial here as to how you go from drawing to basic wagon ! I am sure it would be much appreciated.

JM

 

 

Bill Bedford and Exactoscale do very nice sprung W-irons. BB also does various brake etchings. Work from a good GA drawing if possible and you shouldn't go far wrong – plenty of advice available on RMWeb if needed.

[Compound2632]

But what confuses me is the sole bar, floor-height, and bottom plank conundrum !

 

I'm puzzled as to why this is a conundrum. The floor height (above rail level) is the height of the bottom of the solebar above rail level (often 2'11" on older wagons) plus the height of the solebar (usually 11") plus the thickness of the floor planks (2 1/2"); giving a typical floor height of 4' 0 1/2". This is also the level of the top of the curb or side rail, which is usually 4 1/2", so the curb rail overlaps the solebar by 2", meaning that the apparent or visible height of the solebar is 9".

[Caley Jim]

And the purpose of the curb rail is to cover and protect the ends of the floor planks.

 

Jim

[airnimal]

curassier, where to begin. I model a time period between 1870's to 1900 after seeing lots of hand built models at the famous Manchester show in the 1950's when my dad took myself and 2 brothers after buying us a Hornby railway for Christmas.

I went back every year by myself when my brothers went and did other things. I was curious to see boxes of photographs of old rolling stock on the various society stands and seeing the models made by people like Ross Pochin and Sid Stubbs.

 

What period of time would you like to make a wagon from ?

What scale do you wish to model in ?

I am happy to help anybody to gain the skills needed to scratch build.

What part of the world do you reside in ?

The reason for the last question is because I live in the North West of England and I am doing a couple of demo stands this year at the Poyton and Wigan shows and it would be easy to show you how to do face to face.

 

Failing that the first thing is a good drawing along with a chart of dimensions to convert full size to model size complete with a scale ruler.

As I model in 7mm it is easy to go to the chart and look at 11" which is the solebar hight and see that equates to 252.62 thou.

So I use Evergreen milled 250 X 100 strip. I can live it is slightly under size.

It is better to have these few basic bits along with a good variety of Evergreen sizes that you can laminate together to produce nearly any size required. Plus of course the usual tools and glues.

[Caley Jim]

For a detailed description of the anatomy of a wagon, the articles by Chris Crofts in a couple of early MRJ's are hard to beat. I'm on grandparent duties at my daughter's just now, so can't quote you the issue numbers. I'll try to remember to do it when I'm home this evening.

 

Jim

[Guest curassier]

Thanks airnimal and to all those who pitched in with helpful information.

I suppose the only answer is to have ago....

It would be in 7mm and pre-group.

A fascinating thread all round.

curassier, where to begin. I model a time period between 1870's to 1900 after seeing lots of hand built models at the famous Manchester show in the 1950's when my dad took myself and 2 brothers after buying us a Hornby railway for Christmas.
I went back every year by myself when my brothers went and did other things. I was curious to see boxes of photographs of old rolling stock on the various society stands and seeing the models made by people like Ross Pochin and Sid Stubbs.

What period of time would you like to make a wagon from ?
What scale do you wish to model in ?
I am happy to help anybody to gain the skills needed to scratch build.
What part of the world do you reside in ?
The reason for the last question is because I live in the North West of England and I am doing a couple of demo stands this year at the Poyton and Wigan shows and it would be easy to show you how to do face to face.

Failing that the first thing is a good drawing along with a chart of dimensions to convert full size to model size complete with a scale ruler.
As I model in 7mm it is easy to go to the chart and look at 11" which is the solebar hight and see that equates to 252.62 thou.
So I use Evergreen milled 250 X 100 strip. I can live it is slightly under size.
It is better to have these few basic bits along with a good variety of Evergreen sizes that you can laminate together to produce nearly any size required. Plus of course the usual tools and glues.

[daifly]

For a detailed description of the anatomy of a wagon, the articles by Chris Crofts in a couple of early MRJ's are hard to beat. I'm on grandparent duties at my daughter's just now, so can't quote you the issue numbers. I'll try to remember to do it when I'm home this evening.

 

Jim

 

To save you the trouble Jim, it's MRJ 12, 13, 14 & 15. A series called 'Scratchbuilding Model Wagons'.

Dave

[airnimal]

i was a bit concerned that the sand pipes were a little over scale so I went back to the drawing and checked. Although there are no dimensions on the sand pipes it easy to work of the drawing of a known size and I believe they scale out at 2".

That works out at 1.17mm. I made them from 1.36mm wire so I have decided to replace them with the correct wire.

Unfortunately I do not have any small spilt pins left so I am going to make my own.

 

I needed to file some .45mm brass wire to half round to make them.

So with the help of my home made filing jig a few lengths of wire were produced ready for bending in to spilt pins.

I haven't the time today to do the work necessary.

 

Number 2 daughter was flying to Greece this morning and had to be at the airport at 3 for her flight at 5.55.

Look in her bedroom at 4.50 and she is still asleep.

Panic !

Dad you will have to follow me to the airport in my hire car and pick me up and take me to the departures.

Follow me. Bad move. She follows the sat nav. Motorway down to one lane because of road works and 50 limit.

Sat nav take her miles out of her way. Drop her of at 5.30.

I use to work there and could have saved her 15 minutes if she told me where she was dropping the hire car of at.

She phone about a hour ago from Greece.

 

Number 3 daughter is on her way to stay overnight with the grandchildren and is also going to the airport the next day.

Number 1 daughter does the same on Monday.

No wonder I have grey hair.

I may require a beer tonight .

Edited July 26, 2018 by airnimal

[airnimal]

Not a lot of modelling done over the past couple of weeks due to family being here from different parts of the world.

Still managed to start a new wagon rather them finish all the others. This one is a bit different as it is a end door only and the brake lever is at the other end. This a private owner wagon from Tyldesley Coal Company near Wigan.

I only have a poor photograph so there will be a bit of guess work on this one.

The first photo was taken before I replaced the brake rack with a better one from Ambis.

[wagonman]

Bored? A bit stuck on a wagon? Start a new one. I do (did) it frequently. So you end up with a shelf full of unfinished models...

[airnimal]

A small amount of progress on the end door plus a photo of the start of this build I forgot to include in the post the other day.

Edited August 10, 2018 by airnimal

[airnimal]

I have put some of the nuts and bolts on the side and ends, but there is is still a long way to go.

[Doncaster]

That looks very nice. Do you build box sections for the large end stanchions and dumb buffers or file from solid? Cheers V

[airnimal]

Doncaster, the stanchions are made from 100 X 156 thou of Evergreen milled plastic and filed down to size. The dumb buffers are just the solebar doubled up with a extra bit in the middle to pad them out to the right size.

A little extra work with the ironwork and bolts. Not to much to do now.

[airnimal]

A bit more progress. I have applied the red oxide to the body which shows up all the imperfections. I will blacken all the axle guards and brake gear and paint the interior next.