Jump to content
 

Repainting 4mm RTR Locomotives and Stock


Recommended Posts

Evening all,

I've just acquired my first 4mm Scale locomotives in many years, and im looking to do some detailing work, along with a respray into a different livery. I've never tackled anything like this before, so am looking for some help/advice from those willing to share.

 

In terms of respraying locos. Railmatch seem to have the appropriate colours, has anyone used the spray cans for reprinting locos? Is enamel paint ok for this? As I've never done anything with this, I want to know I can achieve a good result on a model before investing in an airbrush. Also, is there any difference between Precision Paints and Railmatch? Does anyone have any experience with either and a preference at all?  
 
Do people paint the yellow ends first or last?  I presume taking the cab interior and windows out of the model, along with any lights is necessary before touching the paint?
 
I've been recommended to use Railtec for any transfers, although I know there are others.  How do people go on with things like the orange cant rail stripe - do you transfer it for ease?  Once i've tackled adding some detailing, such as changing grills and that, and resprayed it, then im going to try and fit a full DCC lighting set up, along with a Zimo sound decoder.
 
If my first loco, a Class 56 in BR blue with small arrows, works fine, then i am hoping to progress onto some carriages.
 
Any thoughts/comments/advice/polite suggestions(!) would be most welcome.  I've been reading on a few threads, but still not totally sure of the above.
 
Richie 
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Hi Richie!

 

I'd recommend getting an airbrush for repaint work, and then try it out on some old wagon bodies before tackling your more prized locos! Paint-wise, Precision is my favourite, it just seems to spray better for me, but everyone has their own preference! The Railmatch aerosol sprays are OK but can block easily, and I've not always found that you get a good consistency, yellow for example can be very wishy-washy! Same with Precisions aerosols too, just avoid!!

 

For technique, I apply a base undercoat of Halfords primer grey or white, then generally work from light to dark, normally either the Rail Grey or Yellow shades go first, just depends on your livery and the masking technique you want to go for, anything is possible really and I've sprayed onto black in my time as well!

 

Transfers - anything goes - for me, the old masters Fox are giving way increasingly to Modelmaster or newcomers like Railtec, so whatever works best and looks best to you,

 

Good luck!

 

Cheers,

James

Link to post
Share on other sites

Richie, the advice generally given is to spray the lighter colours first and that is usually the route I take - yellow ends, then roof and finally bodyside ( for a large logo BR Blue loco at least - more complex liveries obviously need more masking and have more stages to go through). Spray cans can give very satisfactory results and I have used both Precision and Railmatch in the past. However, it is very frustrating when a blockage occurs in the nozzle or in the can - and this occurs with alarming regularity. There are many discussions on various forums about this, check them out and read about it, it's not just me! I and others have said in the past that they are not fit for purpose - I've lost count of the number of part-used or even nor even started cans that I have thrown away because no matter what I tried I could not get any damn paint out. These frustrations led me to invest in an Iwata airbrush a couple of years ago but to my eternal shame I have not got around to using it yet - it is the cleaning up operation afterwards, thinners, airbrush cleaners, etc, that puts me off.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

Have to agree with the above comments - with  the addition of Humbrol varnish rattle cans to the frustrations, very prone to blocking....

 

Phil

Link to post
Share on other sites

Also it should be mentioned that paint from a rattle can really does go everywhere - a lot is wasted in overspray - it is best done outside in my opinion. With an airbrush you have much more control over the amount of paint coming out, the pressure, and the area covered by the jet of paint coming out - it is a much cleaner process - or so I am led to believe, I've not got round to it yet, as I mentioned in my previous post, but I'm sure someone will back me up.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

Hi Ritchie,

 

Totally agree JM's comments above. Precision paints applied through an airbrush such as an Expo airbrush are far superior and by the time you've spent pounds on rattle cans you could have bought one of these.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AIRBRUSH-COMPRESSOR-PACKAGE-DEAL-AIR-TANK-WATER-TRAP-BRAIDED-HOSE-EXPO-AB602/310366156306?_trksid=p2385738.c100677.m4598&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908110712%26meid%3D35b30597fc6a4c6db04001d2ff6620e9%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D9%26sd%3D310783472595

 

I've had mine for 7 years with no problems whatsoever. Just use cellulose thinners to clean it and Vaseline to lubricate the tip :O.  Always use Halfords white/grey primer before spraying main colours and build up light to dark.

 

Also don't overlook the acrylic paint ranges from the likes of Tamiya/Vallejo.  Use Halfords car windscreen wash to dilute Tamiya acrylics.  Also Tamiya masking tape is your friend!

 

Like JM said practice on something less precious and build up your experience/knowledge.

 

HTH.

 

Cheers,

 

Mark

Edited by 46444
Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys,

Many thanks for the quick replies!  Ok, so stay clear of the cans, and look towards an airbrush is what I brought away from that!  There's a 'Toy & Train Fair' swapmeet at Doncaster Racecourse in a couple of weeks, I can see me having a wander to scratch around some boxes for some old crap cheap wagons to decimate!

 

I'd recommend getting an airbrush for repaint work, and then try it out on some old wagon bodies before tackling your more prized locos! Paint-wise, Precision is my favourite, it just seems to spray better for me, but everyone has their own preference! The Railmatch aerosol sprays are OK but can block easily, and I've not always found that you get a good consistency, yellow for example can be very wishy-washy! Same with Precisions aerosols too, just avoid!!

For technique, I apply a base undercoat of Halfords primer grey or white, then generally work from light to dark, normally either the Rail Grey or Yellow shades go first, just depends on your livery and the masking technique you want to go for, anything is possible really and I've sprayed onto black in my time as well!

 

James,

Many thanks for the detailed reply.  Something has occurred to me, do you just spray primer over the original paintwork, or is there someway of sanding down.  I was just going to sand the bodywork, but on thinking about it that is likely to leave a rough finish and take some of the detailing off??  You mention masking technique in your response, do you mean the type of masking tape used - or are there ways of masking? I am something of an idiot when it comes to all this, as its all totally new to me!

 

I know Mark mentioned one airbrush, there seems to be different types such as some that take the paint from below, others from above - is there a best method for model spraying or just what suits one doesnt suit another kind of principal?

 

Hi Ritchie,

 

Totally agree JM's comments above. Precision paints applied through an airbrush such as an Expo airbrush are far superior and by the time you've spent pounds on rattle cans you could have bought one of these.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AIRBRUSH-COMPRESSOR-PACKAGE-DEAL-AIR-TANK-WATER-TRAP-BRAIDED-HOSE-EXPO-AB602/310366156306?_trksid=p2385738.c100677.m4598&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908110712%26meid%3D35b30597fc6a4c6db04001d2ff6620e9%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D9%26sd%3D310783472595

 

I've had mine for 7 years with no problems whatsoever. Just use cellulose thinners to clean it and Vaseline to lubricate the tip :O.  Always use Halfords white/grey primer before spraying main colours and build up light to dark.

 

Mark

 

Mark,

Many thanks.  A few mates have mentioned about Iwata air brushes and the like - do you think that thats overkill or is it each to their own?  I note you say you've had one of those that you kindly linked to for seven years, and I presume its done everything you want it to do?  I think part of my hesitation is that i've always seen airbrushing as something of a dark art, what with paint and thinners and technique and what you do when and where - think its getting over that mental block in my head is the biggest issue, something that will probably resolve itself once I actually get on an have a go!

 

Richie

Link to post
Share on other sites

I will say that the cans are a good way to start before getting a airbrush. I have just painted a HJ tubby duff into LL using halfords primer, halfords Vauxhal mustard yellow for the yellow and rail match blue for the body. As for masking, it depends on the model. The tubby was done light to dark, but some 45s I've been painting I have had to do it the other way round due to the problems of trying to mask the noses on them and keep the line straight. So they did blue first, mask the noses, then undercoat again and finally the yellow.

 

Rubbing down the body is good in that it removes any raised printing that will show through the paint you apply, as you want multiple thin coats, and it provides a key for the new paint. Just a quick rub down with some fine grade wet and dry will do.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Guys,

I'm going to look at repainting this 56 i've acquired, so a couple of questions:-

 

a) I've seen reference to soaking the body in IPA to take off the original paint - is that the best thing, and im assuming IPA is not the type that is supplied over the bar :) Can anyone give me any pointers on what it is and where to get it from?

 

a) I'm planning on replacing the grills with etched brass ones - is it best to do that before the old paint is taken off, or after .. or doesnt it matter?

 

Richie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Hi Guys,

I'm going to look at repainting this 56 i've acquired, so a couple of questions:-

 

a) I've seen reference to soaking the body in IPA to take off the original paint - is that the best thing, and im assuming IPA is not the type that is supplied over the bar :) Can anyone give me any pointers on what it is and where to get it from?

 

a) I'm planning on replacing the grills with etched brass ones - is it best to do that before the old paint is taken off, or after .. or doesnt it matter?

 

Richie

I'd recommend putting the grilles on after you strip the body, as some liquids used for stripping can attack the superglue that you will use to apply the brass detailing parts (though I've never tried IPA - Dot 5 [EDIT: or do I mean Dot 4?- see two posts below] brake fluid from Wilco is my preferred method). 

 

Regarding spluttering aerosols from Railmatch, it's about 15 years since I've used them, but I did get very good results. The instructions do say that after each session you should hold the can upside-down and spray until nothing comes out, in order to clean the nozzle, but that always seemed a bit wasteful to me. However, between that method and keeping a spare nozzle, I don't remember ever having clogging. 

 

Although many beginners start with aerosols they're actually harder to use than airbrushes as you are essentially "thug spraying" at a very high psi, something that with the pressure control on an airbrush you don't need to do - you have a much more controllable paint flow. Having said that, if you can learn the foibles and limitations of aerosols, they can produce a good finish, especially on boxy diesels, where the whole body side is at the same distance from the nozzle.

Edited by Daddyman
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Evening all,

 

Daddyman, forest2807 and Crompton33 - thanks for the replys and your input.  I've found some dot 3 brake fluid in the garage so i've given that a try before going and buying more!  How long do you leave it to soak is it a matter of hours or a couple of days?

 

I think i'll take the plunge and get an airbrush like suggested, although that might just have to wait until next month, money wise.  I presume they are all pretty much of a muchness?  Id like to be able to try weathering at some point too, hence acquiring this class 56 from a fellow rmweb member cheaply, if it all goes wrong, i've not lost anything!  There's a toy and train fare need me in a couple of weeks time, so might go and have a nosy around for a spare power bogie, so i try doubling the power bogies up as well.

 

Richie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
  • RMweb Gold

Evening all,

 

Daddyman, forest2807 and Crompton33 - thanks for the replys and your input.  I've found some dot 3 brake fluid in the garage so i've given that a try before going and buying more!  How long do you leave it to soak is it a matter of hours or a couple of days?

 

I think i'll take the plunge and get an airbrush like suggested, although that might just have to wait until next month, money wise.  I presume they are all pretty much of a muchness?  Id like to be able to try weathering at some point too, hence acquiring this class 56 from a fellow rmweb member cheaply, if it all goes wrong, i've not lost anything!  There's a toy and train fare need me in a couple of weeks time, so might go and have a nosy around for a spare power bogie, so i try doubling the power bogies up as well.

 

Richie

I was in the same boat as you a year or two ago - not sure which to buy or use. Aerosol versus Airbrush. I purchased a cheap kit from the BRM offer to start with. It was just a spray craft one with a very cheap compressor but I used it quite a bit and practiced on an old wagon and loco. I then had the bug and purchased a Sparmax 4 from Eileen's emporium. Much better Airbrush than the cheap Spraycraft one, so to answer your question, no, they are not all the same. Best idea is to go to a large show or a shop which specializes in airbrushes and try them out and seek advice from the experts. Iwata was too pricey for me, but the Sparmax was on budget and very good quality. I then got a decent compressor from Ebay which again, makes a huge difference.

 

Cleaning up takes under a minute when swapping paint over, and under 3 minutes for a full strip and clean at the end of the session.

 

I just use humbrol aerosols for the primer. Not tackled a full on loco yet, but I am working on it!!! I did spray the below tank (a training aid for work) with the Sparmax 4 airbrush and I was very pleased with the results.

post-21193-0-50220200-1501754541_thumb.jpg

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...