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When TT3 was the next Big Thing


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Hi Garry,

 

Are these any help?  http://www.tri-angtt.org.uk/ttService%20Sheets.htm

 

I would assume they are force fitted from the back of the wheel, like the 00 crank pins. Brute force will shift them* and then the crank pin can be sorted on the side it leans the wrong way.

 

*I prefer a press to a hammer, The latter will work, but care is needed to not damage the pin (or lose it when it flies out of the wheel!).

 

David

Edited by Il Grifone
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Hi David,

 

I have all the service sheets but they only mention the wheel assembly with the pin.

 

If they are like the 00 ones then there will be an oval recess on the back of the wheel which goes against my plan.  I was hoping it was something easier so I could convert some Castle or Jinty wheels to accept a return crank.  As it is it looks like I will have to use the tried and tested method of a screw/bolt through the rods and solder a return crank on the top.

 

The 00 ones were a brass part that took a screw through the return crank, TT has a steel one with the top threaded for a nut and the sides narrowed for the return crank to locate onto.

 

Garry 

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Garry

 

I assume it's still a press fit however, but I don't know for certain. I would be inclined to the bolt method myself/

 

There is this on EBay at the moment - I'm not interested, as I already have one.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TT-3-GUAGE-K-S-SOUTHERN-RAILWAY-CATTLE-VAN-WHITEMETAL-BUILT-KIT/142624789743?hash=item21351994ef:g:cfYAAOSwGwlaJUh-

 

I don't know where the seller got the idea it's an SR wagon. It's a late MR design.

 

Southern cattle trucks were nothing like this.

 

David

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Hi David,

 

Its not K's either, it is an ESANEL one as I have recently built one and painted it in a similar colour.  It is still awaiting couplings but is nice.  The ESANEL kits (part of BEC) were some of the best, especially in TT.  I have 4 of their Parcels vans and a few loco bodies.  The wagons and coaches had a nice interlocking system to help assembly. It is like dovetails cast in the floor/sides/roof and works well holding it all together before soldering.  I did not put the bars in mine either.

 

Someone has told me they think the Brit wheels had a cast T slot on the inside with the crank pin having a T tail which goes along with non turning, and, not being able to replicate.

 

Garry

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Possibly from Hornby?

 

True!  I'd forgotten their aberration. I could never understand why they sold it as a sheep wagon.

 

 

Hi David,

 

Its not K's either, it is an ESANEL one as I have recently built one and painted it in a similar colour.  It is still awaiting couplings but is nice.  The ESANEL kits (part of BEC) were some of the best, especially in TT.  I have 4 of their Parcels vans and a few loco bodies.  The wagons and coaches had a nice interlocking system to help assembly. It is like dovetails cast in the floor/sides/roof and works well holding it all together before soldering.  I did not put the bars in mine either.

 

Someone has told me they think the Brit wheels had a cast T slot on the inside with the crank pin having a T tail which goes along with non turning, and, not being able to replicate.

 

Garry

 

Looking at it more closely, I think you're right Garry. The K's wagon doesn't have the angle irons on the end posts. I saw the K's box and the skew axle and put 2 and 2 together and made 5. I also see that's where the Southern came from - the end states SR (SECR) TARP WAGGON (sic)  so obviously it's not the correct box.

 

* I always use 'wagon' for a railway vehicle and 'waggon' for a  road vehicle with 4 wheels intended for equine etc. haulage, but I don't think the Oxford Dictionary is so pedantic.

 

David

Edited by Il Grifone
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Hi Garry,

 

Are these any help? http://www.tri-angtt.org.uk/ttService%20Sheets.htm

 

I would assume they are force fitted from the back of the wheel, like the 00 crank pins. Brute force will shift them* and then the crank pin can be sorted on the side it leans the wrong way.

 

*I prefer a press to a hammer, The latter will work, but care is needed to not damage the pin (or lose it when it flies out of the wheel!).

 

David

Hi David,

 

I been told the the crank pin maybe splined at the bottom end and pressed in like an axle which stops it turning. That may help slightly.

 

Garry

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Garry

 

I assume it's still a press fit however, but I don't know for certain. I would be inclined to the bolt method myself/

 

There is this on EBay at the moment - I'm not interested, as I already have one.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TT-3-GUAGE-K-S-SOUTHERN-RAILWAY-CATTLE-VAN-WHITEMETAL-BUILT-KIT/142624789743?hash=item21351994ef:g:cfYAAOSwGwlaJUh-

 

I don't know where the seller got the idea it's an SR wagon. It's a late MR design.

 

Southern cattle trucks were nothing like this.

 

David

Eee, that TT guage is gettin' right popular! :locomotive:

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Someone on another site was talking about full brakes so I photographed mine although it is not quite finished.  All it is made from is the rear ends of two mainline Mk1 brakes.  I know there are too many windows but it is too much hassle to start filling and sanding some of them down.  Strictly speaking it is also slightly too long for a Mk1 but I did not want to start cutting a roof down either.  At least it is something different at the end of a train.

 

Garry

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have had a little time thinking of fitting a Jinty chassis to "small" locos but the large magnet/motor does limit what you can do. Therefore today I removed the motor assembly from one, modified the chassis and fitted an XT60.  The result is a good runner and with a narrow motor hopefully I will be able to make smaller locos with a better shaped firebox etc fit. It may be a little high for some boilers but it would be a little harder to lower the angle.  All I need to do now is start looking at a few possibilities.  If I had done this with the N7 then I could have had a round top firebox although others may not have then bought any bodies.

 

I had hoped to use an XT60 in my LNWR 0-8-0 but lowering the motor only left 0.5mm material thickness above an axle slot, and, the motor could still have been too wide for the boiler.

 

Garry

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I have just bought a January 1958 Railway Modeller (unread properly as yet) and it has a nice TT layout built.  It has an express size turntable yet at this moment in time the Castle was only just advertised as per later in the issue.  The layout looks to have all 0-6-0's some with different bodies (kit or scratchbuilt) but does have the main line coaches which I thought only came out with the Castle.

 

Garry

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Two thoughts from those scans. One is that Bachman and Hornby wouldn't dare bring out a loco these days with so many compromises to make the mechanics fit as that Castle.

 

The second is how interesting the design of the layout is. With its reversing loop it's a true out and back terminus. Now as the electrics of a reversing loop are a right pain in 2-rail DC but were straightforward in three rail I wonder if the reversing loops fall from grace in the 50s had something to do with the transition from 3-rail (Hornby Dublo, Marklin, Trix etc) to 2-rail supply (Triang, later HD, Fleischmann and the rest). I wonder if the reversing loop will make a comeback now that it's possible to buy some DCC gizmos to swap the polarity automatically

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Two thoughts from those scans. One is that Bachman and Hornby wouldn't dare bring out a loco these days with so many compromises to make the mechanics fit as that Castle.

 

The second is how interesting the design of the layout is. With its reversing loop it's a true out and back terminus. Now as the electrics of a reversing loop are a right pain in 2-rail DC but were straightforward in three rail I wonder if the reversing loops fall from grace in the 50s had something to do with the transition from 3-rail (Hornby Dublo, Marklin, Trix etc) to 2-rail supply (Triang, later HD, Fleischmann and the rest). I wonder if the reversing loop will make a comeback now that it's possible to buy some DCC gizmos to swap the polarity automatically

Reversing loops are not really a problem with 2-rail, I have done many and my TT one on here has one, the video shows it being used. All my 00 layouts in the past contained a reverse loop as each one was out and back with continuous run. You don't need DCC to do it. I admit on all mine you have to stop on an isolated section to throw a reverse polarity switch but even in the 80's or 90's someone brought out a device to do it automatically while the train was running.

 

Garry

Edited by Golden Fleece 30
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An interesting advert from October 1957 advertising the Kirdon controller, anyone remember them?  It had a button to press to help start a stationary loco, sounds a good idea as opposed to turning the knob further then turning it back slightly.

 

What I noticed though was the advert mentions TT wagons but I have never heard of any at shows, in books etc.  Has anyone seen any and what were produced?

 

Garry

 

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At last I know what Dudley Dimmock's layout looks like!  At the time I saw a pic in MRN of it being built and thought it looked pretty impressive; the pic was of the right hand end and included a Jinty on a goods train climbing the gradient towards the station, but there was nothing of the station itself. The track was all hand built, and in the raw; as I said, impressive. Must have been one of the first TT3 layout pics ever.

 

Having now seen the above pic of the station, must confess I'm a little disappointed. Rather expected something with more presence.

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At last I know what Dudley Dimmock's layout looks like!  At the time I saw a pic in MRN of it being built and thought it looked pretty impressive; the pic was of the right hand end and included a Jinty on a goods train climbing the gradient towards the station, but there was nothing of the station itself. The track was all hand built, and in the raw; as I said, impressive. Must have been one of the first TT3 layout pics ever.

 

Having now seen the above pic of the station, must confess I'm a little disappointed. Rather expected something with more presence.

In what way do you mean more presence?  Tri-ang TT had only been out about 7 months and the only loco at the time was the Jinty.  Coaches and wagons were fairly limited too although that never increased much in total, apart from livery the only other coaches were the Utility vans and Pullmans.  I guess loco building was difficult with only the one chassis to choose from so no larger wheels for a big loco.  The track work was really good and all to use Tri-ang standard wheel sets including a slip and a three way point.

 

Garry.

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In what way do you mean more presence?  Tri-ang TT had only been out about 7 months and the only loco at the time was the Jinty.  Coaches and wagons were fairly limited too although that never increased much in total, apart from livery the only other coaches were the Utility vans and Pullmans.  I guess loco building was difficult with only the one chassis to choose from so no larger wheels for a big loco.  The track work was really good and all to use Tri-ang standard wheel sets including a slip and a three way point.

 

Garry.

 

As I said. Probably using too much imagination as to what the station would look like if I actually saw it. But the trackwork at the station throat looked superb.

 

Wonder if there are other pics around. Had a look for the one I remembered but it seems to have gone. Might have been RM rather than MRN.

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I have had to slightly modify my track plan for the upper station for various reasons but I think this is the best I can do for what I want.  Due to no access to a release point in the station without cutting a chunk out of a platform this is designed for holding the loco at the buffer stops and the previous loco would now be on a loco road in line with the platform (no line showing at the moment) can come in and work tender first.  This allows the loco at the stops to go onto the "shed" road for the next train.  Obviously if operating times allow the light engine could always go down to the reverse loop.  There is a run round for the goods with sidings in both directions.  As the maximum amount of wagons going up will be usually be 5, possibly 6, there should be sufficient  room for everything.

 

As the station building will be a low relief one I have made some 1/4 curves to give a wider platform.  Hopefully the photos will help understand.

 

It is amazing what you can get in such a small space and have proper shunting/operating interests, no wonder Mike Bryant called it " a quart in a pint pot".

 

Garry

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https://reader.exacteditions.com/issues/50801/page/71

 

A couple of photos which may be of interest.

 

Garry

Only just found this thread, so lots of catching up to do. 

 

I describe myself as a TT modeler. Tri-ang based with the white metal bodied locos. One of my layouts Thorpe Road is a 1960's TT gauge with nothing later than 1970. It was described in RM back in 2016.

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