Hornby TTS Sound Class 31

[Izzy]

I bought one to replace a knackered Lima chassis but I can't really recommend. The chassis is very primitive (old gearing that is too tall, traction tyres - is this 1973??) and it is difficult to eliminate stuttering at slow speeds. It is cheap for a reason. I know it is aimed mainly at youngsters but poor quality stuff like this will only put them off.

 

And if you actually want it to represent an early 60s loco?

Apart from the wrong body, wrong bogies, wrong engine sound and poor performance it is great...

 

I would agree the slow speed performance isn't great which IMHO is down to the motor. It got a very strong magnet, is quite coggy, and as a result gives out a fair bit of noise/vibration through the track, which is generally masked by the sound. I have not been able to find any decoder from those I have spare, Zimo/Lenz/CT/Digitrax/Bachmann besides that fitted into it by Hornby, which can overcome/eliminate the juddering which occurs at a particular slow rpm band. I had thought that I just had a poor/duff motor example but from reports like yours it would seem not. When time allows and I can obtain a couple of spare worms I will try installing another size/type/make of motor to see what results. The low 16-1 gearing ratio doesn't help either.

 

I tended to find way back when I used to detail and repaint old Lima diesels of which the 31 was probably the best that they often benefited from extra weight and where possible extra pickups too.

 

I don't yet know what the pick up arrangement is on the Limby version but I am sure some tweaking would still be possible.

 

It's got a stack of steel slab weights piled high in the fuel tanks - I may try and add more weight - and has pick-ups on all wheels in both driven and un-driven bogies. Of course you do have to allow for the traction tyres on two wheels - well I don't any longer but that's another story - but still gives five wheels a side if you offset the traction tyres.

 

It is what it is, a Railroad model made to a price, not without faults, but with potential if you choose.

 

Izzy

[MikeParkin65]

I bought one to replace a knackered Lima chassis but I can't really recommend. The chassis is very primitive (old gearing that is too tall, traction tyres - is this 1973??) and it is difficult to eliminate stuttering at slow speeds. It is cheap for a reason. I know it is aimed mainly at youngsters but poor quality stuff like this will only put them off.

 

Haven't got the latest 31 but bought the TTS 40 and 47 for their chips and sold the loco's as 'DCC ready'. Tested them both with TTS fitted and then with the blanking plate fitted and was pleasantly surprised at what good runners they were - smooth and controlable. So I can only surmise either the 31 is mechanically different in some way or you have been unlucky with yours. 

[fezza]

With care it is usable but just not up to 21st century standards. It is basically a modified Lima-age chassis with all that comes with that. Unless you need sound (which I did) you may as well pick up a good Lima original for £25 instead.

[fezza]

A little more testing suggests most low speed stuttering occurs on downhill sections or when passing over summits. It suggests weak motor/ gears are the main issue but there could be a problem with the default back emf setting I guess. I also wonder if the very heavy central weight is actually counter productive at low speed causing a downhill surge that the bemf struggles to cope with?

[davetheroad]

Long live the Hornby Railroad range, especially those based on the old Lima designs. They make ideal candidates for conversion to battery power/radio control because there is lots of empty space inside. Power bogie and traction tyres, no problem. My conversions have good haulage capability and my track gets cleaned about twice a year!. For smoothness re-motored Lima ones have better low speed performance with simple PWM battery power.

 

I just bought a de-chipped Class 31 from Rails... Lucky to get one as they are going like hot cakes. Hopefully it does not have the same problem running through points as my just converted older Railroad model.

[John Tomlinson]

FWIW I've run both the new D5551 TTS and an older Railroad 31, both on analogue, and found the slow speed performance to be identical, with what to me seems quite mild juddering to start. On DCC operation the performance of D5551 was slightly, but only slightly better than on analogue, and as its my only DCC loco that's as far as I go.

 

As I mentioned earlier, the performance of my Lima 31's on analogue with the Gaugemaster DCC75 Tech 6 was the best ever for Lima locos, I'd say not a lot different for slow speed than the Railroad 31's with the new Hornby powerbogies.

 

This does, as many have said, seem to be a case of getting what you pay for, and with any new full fat Hornby 31 likely to have a discount price in the £130 area, maybe more, it seems as if the Railroad ones are excellent value for money, plus being a better shaped body. It would be far easier to make a buffer beam cowling than cut out and inset the cab windows. But then each to their own...

 

John.

[Enterprisingwestern]

FWIW I've run both the new D5551 TTS and an older Railroad 31, both on analogue, and found the slow speed performance to be identical, with what to me seems quite mild juddering to start. On DCC operation the performance of D5551 was slightly, but only slightly better than on analogue, and as its my only DCC loco that's as far as I go.

 

As I mentioned earlier, the performance of my Lima 31's on analogue with the Gaugemaster DCC75 Tech 6 was the best ever for Lima locos, I'd say not a lot different for slow speed than the Railroad 31's with the new Hornby powerbogies.

 

This does, as many have said, seem to be a case of getting what you pay for, and with any new full fat Hornby 31 likely to have a discount price in the £130 area, maybe more, it seems as if the Railroad ones are excellent value for money, plus being a better shaped body. It would be far easier to make a buffer beam cowling than cut out and inset the cab windows. But then each to their own...

 

John.

 

Careful, you'll be getting accused of being a modeller!

 

Mike.

[Izzy]

I must confess I don't have any real knowledge of what might be right or wrong with any of the 4mm 31's produced over the years, not ever having any of them, and I will do a thread in the RTR modification section of RMweb, but just to show what I believe is the basic potential of this loco here is a shot in it's current state-of-play with an awful lot still to do body wise, having been converted to P4 and had the bogies and chassis portions re-worked a bit.

 

 

Izzy

[Pint of Adnams]

I must confess I don't have any real knowledge of what might be right or wrong with any of the 4mm 31's produced over the years, not ever having any of them, and I will do a thread in the RTR modification section of RMweb, but just to show what I believe is the basic potential of this loco here is a shot in it's current state-of-play with an awful lot still to do body wise, having been converted to P4 and had the bogies and chassis portions re-worked a bit.

 

Izzy

This thread might help then... http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/115213-Hornby-brush-type-2class-31-models-differences/

[Izzy]

This thread might help then... http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/115213-Hornby-brush-type-2class-31-models-differences/

 

 Many thanks. That's a very interesting and informative thread.

 

Izzy

[Pint of Adnams]

Well, it may only be a Railroad TTS loco, but Hornby have sold out, though some retailers still have stock. 

 

Amazing!

Still 4 left at Bure Valley Models, Aylsham: http://www.burevalleymodels.com/p/10096/R3592TTS---Class-31-BR-Green---TTS-Sound

[Izzy]

Just about finished now, a couple of small details to sort, speedo cables etc, followed by a bit of weathering, the bogies and lower bits seemed to take on a brownish tinge even if the rest was reasonably clean from the colour shots I have seen.

 

 

Worth getting I think. Sounds quite good to..........slippery slope etc.........

 

Izzy

 

 

[MGR Hooper!]

Just about finished now, a couple of small details to sort, speedo cables etc, followed by a bit of weathering, the bogies and lower bits seemed to take on a brownish tinge even if the rest was reasonably clean from the colour shots I have seen.

 

RMweb HRRTTS 31 08.jpg

 

Worth getting I think. Sounds quite good to..........slippery slope etc.........

 

Izzy

I'm assuming that's your detailing work on a RailRoad Class 31?

[Izzy]

I'm assuming that's your detailing work on a RailRoad Class 31?

 

 Yes. To show it's well worth getting if you like doing things like that. Cost was zero apart from the wire, plasticard etc although as you might expect there was a fair bit of time and effort involved.

 

Izzy

[Hilux5972]

I honestly think the TTS is far better suited to diesels than steam locos.

[John Tomlinson]

Just about finished now, a couple of small details to sort, speedo cables etc, followed by a bit of weathering, the bogies and lower bits seemed to take on a brownish tinge even if the rest was reasonably clean from the colour shots I have seen.

 

RMweb HRRTTS 31 08.jpg

 

Worth getting I think. Sounds quite good to..........slippery slope etc.........

 

Izzy

 

That's a cracking piece of work, it looks as if you've even done the tiny handles on the roof!

 

Does show how well this model can be made in the right hands.

 

John.

[SDJR7F88]

Well, I've bit the bullet and just purchased 2 of the stand alone R8101 TTS sound decoder, which have just come into stock. Looking forward to fitting them to my two Bargain RailRoad 31, which I purchased in the sales last year. Should be interesting to see and hear how they turnout. If it's anything like the factory fitted model, they should be fun 

[John Tomlinson]

There's a short and informative piece dated 31st August in the news section of Hattons website, about the TTS system.

 

It lists the sound decoders that will be available separately, at a cost from them of £36 each.

 

By way of an anecdote, my wife wandered into the layout room yesterday, when I was trialling my second TTS Brush 2. That sounds good she said, a lot better than much of the racket you hear at exhibitions!! An interesting comment from someone whilst not an enthusiast knows quite a lot about railways, and has photographed them on three continents.

 

John.

[Hroth]

I'm just hoping that the TTS decoders are easier to produce compared with locos!

 

My current capital expenditure budget is up against the buffers so although I'd like a couple of Class 31 TTS decoder sets for my two blue railroad 31s, they'll have to go on the back-burner until at least November... 

 

The only bright side is that when (if?) I do get the TTS decoders, the DCC decoders currently fitted can be cascaded down to other locos.

[Izzy]

 I've now started the thread on altering this loco a bit for anyone interested;  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/124592-some-rtr-rolling-stock-for-all-saints-east/

 

Izzy

[Robby S]

I've made a comment in the DCC questions area in a topic about ECoS, but feel I should note it here as well. The class 31TTS decoder that's sold separately works correctly on Hornby controllers but once you change number from 3, then using most other controllers such as Roco Z21, Sprog, ECoS and Bachmann it only seems to work correctly when facing one way but turn the loco round on the track and it's dead. A real puzzle!

[SDJR7F88]

I've made a comment in the DCC questions area in a topic about ECoS, but feel I should note it here as well. The class 31TTS decoder that's sold separately works correctly on Hornby controllers but once you change number from 3, then using most other controllers such as Roco Z21, Sprog, ECoS and Bachmann it only seems to work correctly when facing one way but turn the loco round on the track and it's dead. A real puzzle!

Not got around to fitting my two yet. Will hopefully see what happens when I try and fit them on Monday

[jamesg]

I've made a comment in the DCC questions area in a topic about ECoS, but feel I should note it here as well. The class 31TTS decoder that's sold separately works correctly on Hornby controllers but once you change number from 3, then using most other controllers such as Roco Z21, Sprog, ECoS and Bachmann it only seems to work correctly when facing one way but turn the loco round on the track and it's dead. A real puzzle!

Yes, for whatever reason, the Class 31 is very particular about the DCC signal.  Perhaps the Hornby controllers generate the signal differently to the Roco and others.

 

I haven't found that setting the address to 3 or doing a hard reset makes any difference, though I had set a few CVs on mine already before testing.

[Marcoblanco]

does a 31 sound the same as a 37..?

[John Tomlinson]

does a 31 sound the same as a 37..?

 

In a word no.

 

Funnily enough I was listening to an EE engine 31 yesterday at Loughborough on the GC diesel gala. It was raining so hard I had to sit in the car and have the window open a bit, so couldn't see the train!

 

Someone cleverer than me will need to explain why they're different , but they are.

 

John.