S & B Productions

[5050]

In the TT3 topic there has been mention of S&B who were around in the 50's as manufacturers of mainly scenic items in cast metal - but they did in the early 50's manufacture an 00 sprung wagon axlebox/guard/W-iron featuring a sliding axlebox and a wire leaf spring above, all cast as one.  I don't have a magazine with me at the moment with these featured but I may later in the week.

 

Here are a selection of S&B adverts from the RM and MRN from 1957/8/9.  There was generally a quarter page advert towards the back of each issue illustrating a selection of their range.

 

 

This takes us up the around the end of 1959 when they seem to disappear.  May 1960 this announcement is made -

 

 

The Ships Propellor and Gearwheel are still available (I think) from the current GEM company.

 

I'm still using some of the point levers that I bought at the time on my HO American layout operating Peco points.  Do GEM still supply them?  I could do with a few more!

Edited July 30, 2017 by 5050

[APOLLO]

Thanks, brings back memories. Not cheap (for me) back then in the 60's on 2 shillings a week pocket money !!!

 

Brit15

[Il Grifone]

I must have some of the S & B point levers in the relevant box. The 3/16" throw is enormous and intended for 'universal track' capable of taking Trix and Tri-ang's steamroller flanges. More civilised track was happy with the 1/8" one, here sold as TT.

 

The signals have more than a passing resemblance to the Dublo ones.

 

I have the yard crane. When we lived in Diano Marina in Italy there was the real thing on the platform, brightly painted in yellow and red. Stupidly I never took a photo of it! (Illegal in Italy I believe as railways count as a military installation, or at least did then. One could serve one's national service working on the railways, or in the police or taxes*.)

 

* The dreaded 'Guardia di Finanze' - the Italian version of the Spanish Inquisition.

Edited July 31, 2017 by Il Grifone

[locomad]

Thanks it solved where the water crane came from, in the photo it's in front of the more common triang one but very similar.

 

The yard crane is interesting, the later GEM one had a metal base. My base is awaiting repair it's easy to snap the shaft, I've a few from car boots which have this common fault.

 

It was generally rumoured that George Mellor copied the yard crane at the end of Conwy quay, just a few miles from Rhos-on-Sea,for those trainspotters in the 60's it even had the nick name it's "the GEM crane", it's still there, well few weeks ago it was.

 

Is the ground signal an S & B? As for the point lever I've a dozen but can't locate the box

[Il Grifone]

It certainly looks like an S & B ground signal. It came with several variations of the arm. I had one with a small yellow 'semaphore' arm.

 

My crane has a vertical shaft with a small disc under the crane itself and a small extension presumably to plug into a hole drilled in the platform.

 

The local crane would seem a logical choice of prototype. I presume it's a standard product of some industrial concern but don't know any more.

 

IIRC the Italian one had a guard over the large gear which was the part painted red, but it was over thirty years ago that I last saw it. From Google, I see that the station has lost its goods facilities (they weren't used much when we lived there) so I would expect the crane has gone too.

 

I had a 'Dermic' oiler (basically a small glass hypodermic syringe - no 'one-use' stuff back then!). The rubber perished under the action of the oil. so it got thrown out.

[locomad]

It certainly looks like an S & B ground signal. It came with several variations of the arm. I had one with a small yellow 'semaphore' arm.

 

My crane has a vertical shaft with a small disc under the crane itself and a small extension presumably to plug into a hole drilled in the platform.

 

The local crane would seem a logical choice of prototype. I presume it's a standard product of some industrial concern but don't know any more.

 

IIRC the Italian one had a guard over the large gear which was the part painted red, but it was over thirty years ago that I last saw it. From Google, I see that the station has lost its goods facilities (they weren't used much when we lived there) so I would expect the crane has gone too.

 

I had a 'Dermic' oiler (basically a small glass hypodermic syringe - no 'one-use' stuff back then!). The rubber perished under the action of the oil. so it got thrown out.

 

Yard crane is an LNWR type, one in Conway is listed grade 2, type in Google " yard crane conwy" can't do link, the other is about 300 yards on the quay. It's very distinctive from the train looking south, I've never got to it, don't think access is easy, next time in conwy will have a wonder.

 

I've quite a few ground signals including the yellow bar type, on the layout prefer them as they don't get in the way, like nearly all my stuff they came from a toy fair, " box of bits stuff". The water cranes got for almost nothing, typical dealer comment, it's not Dublo its not triang, not worth anything. Been local to Rhos- on-sea come across quite a lot of ex GEM products.

[5050]

Query - why would S&B who were based in London model a Conwy crane?  Unless it was possibly George Mellor who made the masters and did all their casting.  There was obviously a close relationship between the 2 companies.

[locomad]

Query - why would S&B who were based in London model a Conwy crane?  Unless it was possibly George Mellor who made the masters and did all their casting.  There was obviously a close relationship between the 2 companies.

Interesting, before I saw this thread I've always assume it was unique to GEM, it's a standard LNWR yard crane, once very common, found in most station yards, fact 2 have survived within 300 yards is again remarkable.

 

The quay one is right next to and below the tubular Bridge built by Brunel, there's a spur from the junction, the other is in the old station yard below the castle, it's now a park.

 

The model was produced by GEM, it was the first white metal kit I ever built, I was about 10 when myself and a friend were on a train coming from Bangor and I spotted it. My friend mentioned GEM made them and I though it would be idea for my childhood layout as it was a prototype model up to then everything was either "toy like" from dublo or triang. In those days you could call on GEM and purchase it from his "yard". The model has been on every layout since

[Il Grifone]

Yard crane is an LNWR type, one in Conway is listed grade 2, type in Google " yard crane conwy" can't do link, the other is about 300 yards on the quay. It's very distinctive from the train looking south, I've never got to it, don't think access is easy, next time in conwy will have a wonder.

 

I've quite a few ground signals including the yellow bar type, on the layout prefer them as they don't get in the way, like nearly all my stuff they came from a toy fair, " box of bits stuff". The water cranes got for almost nothing, typical dealer comment, it's not Dublo its not triang, not worth anything. Been local to Rhos- on-sea come across quite a lot of ex GEM products.

 

The dealers seem a bit more 'savvy' around here    One occasionally gets a bargain, but exorbitant prices for junk are the rule. It does not seem quite as bad of late. Perhaps the bottom is really dropping out of the market.

[5050]

I've found one S&B advert in the Jan 1960 MRN then they stop.  In February this appears -

 

 

There was a note in a previous RM that he was ill.

 

No more adverts until the GEM announcement appears in both RM and MRN (and probably MRC as well).  I hadn't realised that The 'S' was the same man as Leeds Model Co. as he always seemed such a staunch 7mm man.  Prior to S&B, his enterprises were in Leeds, so the move to 4mm and London seems surprising.

 

BTW, who was the 'B' of S&B?

 

I've found an ad for the sprung axleboxes (and there is an editorial about them somewhere) so I'll try and scan next week.

 

And how did he become a Test Pilot during the war?  He must have been flying as a pilot for some time prior even though he is stated as being a 'Technician' at Farnborough during WW1.  Seems to have been a very interesting chap.

[locomad]

Found one of his point levers recently, think I came across them years ago and thought they were "O" guage, very chunky levers anyone know are they based on a prototype?

[Il Grifone]

If anyone wants an S & B crane

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/OO-GAUGE-KIT-BUILT-METAL-CRANE/263128343715?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D45565%26meid%3D8fdc78d522374f6b96aa13021642deeb%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D202006454430&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

 

 

Found one of his point levers recently, think I came across them years ago and thought they were "O" guage, very chunky levers anyone know are they based on a prototype?

 

I seem to recall seeing a real lever like this somewhere, but can't remember where - possibly abroad?

Edited August 9, 2017 by Il Grifone