Shap Summit Layout

[cooley_boy]

For a while now I have been wanting to build a layout and have so far built 3 layouts which have since either been sold or dismantled into other projects. In previous layouts I have been a bit free lance in my design moving into a layout based off a location but not true to prototype. So now I am looking at modelling a location as true to prototype as possible space willing. In doing so the search was on for a layout that can be used for both 1960 operations and current day which narrows the field down a bit but the challenge was to find a place that has not really changed much since the 60s so anything near a city was more-or-less out.

 

I therefore moved into the country side and into the LMS region which is where I personally think the best trains were made (ducks for cover) and where some of the most gruelling and dramatic scenery is located. This is certainly true of the S & C but this have been modelled to death and wanting to look into an area where not much has been done in recent years I looked into the West Coast Mainline between Preston and Carlisle.

 

Here we have 2 major Climbs being Grayrigg and Shap both of which are gruelling grades which in steam days required helpers which would be a very neat thing to replicate in operation which with DCC will be very easy to achieve. I have settled on Shap for no real reason other than for several reasons:

 

1- Shap is more open in its landscape and will be in my opinion be more dramatic to recreate.

 

2- I have spent time around the Shap incline and know it better.

 

3- Shap has less of a range of traffic than Grayrigg due to all the Stainmore traffic turning east at Tebay which means there will be less traffic to cover than Grayrigg which from a budget perspective is always a good thing.

 

Having said that last point though there is still a huge amount of traffic on this line:

 

1960's Highlights:

 

The Royal Scot
The Mid-day Scot
The Night Scot
The Caledonian
The Lakes Express
All Freight Traffic

 

Duchess's
Princess's
Britannia's
Royal Scots
Black Fives
8Fs
9Fs
ETC

 

Current Day Highlights:

 

The Caledonian Sleeper
Tesco Train
Virgin Pendalino's
Virgin Super Voyagers
All Container Traffic
All Engineering Traffic
Colas Timber Traffic
Flyash Traffic
Coal from Ayrshire to Wales
Class 66, 68, 88, 57, 92, 90, 86, 60
Colas
DRS
EWS/DB
Frieghtliner
Network Rail
WCRC Excursion Trains

 

All in all a lot to model and consider.

 

I have already accumulated a fair bit of rolling stock in regards to both settings for this layout and as I don't have the space at this time to built the layout I am focusing on getting all the rolling stock ready and running this in at the local club. So what is to follow will be a series of works in regards to the rolling stock and locomotives.

 

Regards
Rand

[cooley_boy]

It occurs to me that I left a few details out in what I am planning so let me add them on. 
I will be modelling in 4mm scale with a optimal layout length of 50' and width of 12' and will comprise of a folded figure 8 track plan. This will be possible as the layout will include the 1:72 gradient that Shap possesses. The fiddle yards will be under the scenic area.
Granted the area modelled will have to be squashed a bit to get it to fit in and at present I do not have a location to build which is why I am focusing on the Rolling stock side of things. I will however work on finalising a track plan.

 

Rolling stock wise I am working on fitting sound to all my locomotive of which I am almost there.

 

I am working on recreating a 11-coach WCRC excursion train with Scots Gaurdsman 46115 on that duty. 
In regards to this I have modified a Bachmann BSK MK1 Coach to be the support coach for this train. Just like to really thing I have blocked up 2 windows on either side and added the roller doors to either side. Now just waiting for good weather to give it a as-close-as WCRC paint job.

 

 

Also most of the way through creating a 15 car KFA Timber train as used by Colas. 
These just need weathering and loads which I will show through my other blog - KFA continued

 

 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2017 by cooley_boy

[woodenhead]

Is it not going to look odd being electrified in the 60s mode?

[cooley_boy]

Is it not going to look odd being electrified in the 60s mode?

That's where the trickery will come in. Looking into designing removable Catenery. 

[Legend]

Sounds massive undertaking. I was wondering how you were going to do 1960s and modern day taking into account catenary . Looking forward to seeing more

[cravensdmufan]

A great idea to model Shap.

But the problem with dual era layouts are the sleepers. Wooden up until electrification?.

Good 60's photo of Shap summit, including signal box (which will also need to be removable) http://cumbrianrailways.zenfolio.com/img/s1/v21/p662738863-3.jpg

 

and also a cracking Duchess shot  https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8116/8657759424_bb7b8931ed_z.jpg

 

(Edited to include photo links)

Edited August 22, 2017 by cravensdmufan

[Joseph_Pestell]

And just generally, apart from the track itself, the track formation would be much reduced in electrified days. Seems to me that the Shap station area would need to be modelled on detachable boards.

 

The plain track areas might just about be OK to run in both eras if the idea of demountable catenary works. But I can't really see that it would. Even fixed catenary is difficult to get looking right. Demountable would be a nightmare unless you go for masts/gantries/headspans only with no wires.

[cooley_boy]

A great idea to model Shap.

 

But the problem with dual era layouts are the sleepers. Wooden up until electrification?.

 

Good 60's photo of Shap summit, including signal box (which will also need to be removable) http://cumbrianrailways.zenfolio.com/img/s1/v21/p662738863-3.jpg

 

and also a cracking Duchess shot  https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8116/8657759424_bb7b8931ed_z.jpg

 

(Edited to include photo links)

There will be a few things that may be a bit of license needed but we will just have to see. From what I have seen in research they seemed to be replacing the wooden sleepers in the early 60s with concrete and by that time most of the line was flat bottom rail which helps too. 

 

Depending how far up to the summit I model yeah the top will be interesting. I know there is a signal box on Scouts Green http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/jrc-shap-eecotype4.jpg

 

This will have to be removable. The idea may be to have scenic modules that can be swapped out. 

 

I shall meet your good shot with another http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/000-0-a-jr-carter-46250-shap.jpg 

North bound this time.

[cooley_boy]

And just generally, apart from the track itself, the track formation would be much reduced in electrified days. Seems to me that the Shap station area would need to be modelled on detachable boards.

 

The plain track areas might just about be OK to run in both eras if the idea of demountable catenary works. But I can't really see that it would. Even fixed catenary is difficult to get looking right. Demountable would be a nightmare unless you go for masts/gantries/headspans only with no wires.

This is very true. I am focusing more on the mainline section of the climb for this reason as you are right in regards to the station at Shap which is no longer there. I am only looking at going to just before the summit on the north end of the cutting. 

 

In regards to the catenary it will be a challenge for sure but I have done something similar in the past and will be looking at transferring it across for this.   

[cooley_boy]

[LongRail]

I started off my layout as dual era being 90's sectorisation/NSE and the second being current day. Over time i found the 90's more fun to model and operate by having less fixed formations so have abandoned current day operations.

[ThaneofFife]

going by the photo above of the length of line to be modelled, how are you planning to achieve this?  I would say its about 1 mile minimum from tebay to scout green probably more and I think the total climb is around 4 miles.

 

is it end to end with fiddle yards or a sort of long roundy helix-esque layout to simulate the climb ?  its of hell of an undertaking to scale that distance down and i think youre modelling in 00 rather than N gauge.  Even in N gauge you would need such a big space (length not width) so it would be great to see a track/baseboard plan.

 

personally I would love to see such a layout in full length based on the early 80s era with all the usual blue and grey suspects and AC locos and speedlinks.........youd need a heck of a long room to house it though!

[ColinK]

Looking forward to seeing the layout.

[cooley_boy]

I started off my layout as dual era being 90's sectorisation/NSE and the second being current day. Over time i found the 90's more fun to model and operate by having less fixed formations so have abandoned current day operations.

I may in time find it similar. Both eras are pretty far apart in my case which will be challenging. 

[cooley_boy]

going by the photo above of the length of line to be modelled, how are you planning to achieve this?  I would say its about 1 mile minimum from tebay to scout green probably more and I think the total climb is around 4 miles.

 

is it end to end with fiddle yards or a sort of long roundy helix-esque layout to simulate the climb ?  its of hell of an undertaking to scale that distance down and i think youre modelling in 00 rather than N gauge.  Even in N gauge you would need such a big space (length not width) so it would be great to see a track/baseboard plan.

 

personally I would love to see such a layout in full length based on the early 80s era with all the usual blue and grey suspects and AC locos and speedlinks.........youd need a heck of a long room to house it though!

I will need some space. The layout will not be exact in length granted as that will require something like 300'!!!!. I would be looking at doing a loop over a loop with one being the scenic area and the lower being the fiddle yard hidden under the scenic area. This would allow for constant running and double the scenic area. As for the size I am thinking it would need to be 45-50' long and 10-12' wide.

There are some big sheds around. Working mainly on the rolling stock at the moment.

[cooley_boy]

Have now got the first 4 Coach sides decaled for my 11 coach WCRC excursion train based on the Cumbrian Mountain Express. Next step is to paint the coach ends and roofs where necessary before placing the sides back on the chassis.

 

 

 

 

[cooley_boy]

Have now finished building all my KFA Timber wagons of which there are 15.

 

Now the next step is weathering which will hopefully happen this weekend.

 

This is one of several of the modern trains I am modelling for the layout. The next one I am about to do is the Coal train of 40x MEA wagons from Killoch in Scotland to Wales. I have all the wagons but will be weathering them and getting loads from wagon essentials.

 

 

 

[beast66606]

There's only one Scout in the Green

 

Looks to be an interesting project, Grayrigg is my favourite place bar none. I bought a book recently just for another photo of Grayrigg box such is my obession with the place and I've made two models of it in my time - a long time ago now though.

 

To do Scout Green (sic) justice you really need to model the tall up home signal which was iconic and sets the scene for a steam period layout (although it was replaced by a 2 aspect colour light in the 1960s. Modern image will all be 4 aspect colour lights controlled from Carlisle. Your choice as to what you model of course.

 

An interesting project.

[cooley_boy]

On a side note I updated the tower case for my computer and this left me with a spare tower with no real use. Then I had a thought, which is dangerous I'll admit, about converting the tower for a new use. Up to date I have been doing all my weathering outside as I didn't have a way of venting the fumes outside from indoors. I didn't have the space or cash to buy or make a spray booth for my weathering projects. Now that I am going to be doing this more often I wanted to move this inside so I wouldn't be at the mercy of the prevailing weather of the day.
With this back story I looked at the computer tower I had spare and had the idea of converting this into a spray booth. It has 4 sides, a top and a base. I have removed one side panel which will be the access side and removed the front aesthetic panel to have access to the front grill which is where I have attached a 200mm extraction fan. I then lined the sides with canvas to absorb any off spray and placed a nice bit of timber in the base to spray on. All I need now is to find a lazy Susan.

 

 

 

[Crisis Rail]

Good stuff going on here - just up the road from us.

 

Ian

[cooley_boy]

Its been awhile but I have now finally had a chance to start weathering my KFA timber carrying wagons. 

 

These are about half way through. There is more detailing in the weathering to do and then next the loads themselves.