potentiometer for train controller

[layoutnovice]

Hi There 

 

I have a dual controller for my analogue layout, but it as became a little faulty, both controls work but very erratically, I've tried cleaning them with WD40 but to no avail. I was thinking of replacing the potentiometers, which are easy enough to do but don't know which ones I would need, there seems to be a big variety on the web or whether it would be better just to buy a new controller, anyone any ideas

 

Mick

[Pete the Elaner]

WD40 is not a cleaner, it is a water dispersant. Is does a rather poor job of cleaning or lubricating but is often better than nothing.

1.1.1 trichloroethane (also used as tipp-ex solvent) was used as an electrical cleaner but this has been replaced with something friendlier & less effective.

 

What controller do you have? A modern electronic controller usually provides much better slow speed running than an older resistance design.

[The Johnster]

For cleaning your old potentiometers, I'd suggest Maplin's Switch Cleaner, in a spray can.   But Pete has a good point; if your controller is so old that it is based on potentiometers (H & M Duette?), then it has a certain retro charm but any electronic controller will run rings around it in terms of performance, and that includes my 30+ year old Gaugemaster: it may be time to look at replacing it!  It has no doubt given many years of reliable service, but needs retiring in favour of something more suited to releasing the full potential controllability of modern motors, and if it is so worn that the pot coils are not performing correctly, may be beyond redemption!

 

Unless you want to get into kit building and amateur electronics, Gaugemaster are about the only game in town as far as DC power controllers go these days, and their 'D' double controller for just shy of £100 beer vouchers would probably be as good a solution as any for you.  I assume you are not considering the DCC alternative; if you are, I know very little about it and can offer no advice that would be worth listening to, though there is a thread here that will!

[ejstubbs]

if your controller is so old that it is based on potentiometers (H & M Duette?), then it has a certain retro charm but any electronic controller will run rings around it in terms of performance

 

 

I think you may be confusing a modern potentiometer:

 

 

which even the latest electronic DC controllers use, with a wire-wound rheostat, such as found in venerable beasties like the Tri-ang P.42:

 

 

Rheostats are, as you say, retro tech for our purposes and probably best replaced with a complete new controller.  Modern potentiometers in an electronic controller are fine, but pretty much non-user-serviceable so if they do go on the fritz then the simplest remedy is to replace them - if you can source the right one.  The OP may be able to find some kind of specification or ID on the existing pots - there's usually something marked on the bottom face of the round body of the pot, which can if all else fails be plugged in to Google to see if it sheds any light.

 

Gaugemaster are about the only game in town as far as DC power controllers go these days

 

Gaugemaster may be dominant in this field, but they're not the only game in town.  Apart from the ones available from foreign manufacturers as listed by Dutch_Master, there's:

• Morley, whose Vector dual controller with built-in CDU works fine for me.  I particularly like the centre-off potentiometers they use - especially now that they have a positive detent at the off position, and it really is off. (I've never got on with reversing switches.)  The Vector is fully self-contained, so there's no separate transformer required.  And it comes with two hand-held controllers included, that plug in to the base unit;
• Modelex, whose single units seem to be liked by some;
• The Pictroller which is an update on the widely admired Pentroller as originally developed for Pendon.  This offers a variety of control modes and settings, as well as having capability for automatic operations.  Quite a sophisticated device, but priced accordingly.
• Hornby still does single and dual DC controllers, though I'm not aware of them having many actual fans.  And Bachmann does a single DC controller which some rate highly for the price (this one is often available second-hand having been split from a Bachmann train set).

There may well be others out there that I've forgotten/not run in to online.  There are plenty of threads on RMWeb and other model railway forums on the subject - again, Google is your friend.

 

(Incidentally, if you can't see the photo of the inner workings of the Triang P.42 controller then the URL for the photo is: http://yourmodelrailway.net/gallery/15/15_251330_350000001.jpg.  It's in the ninth post on this thread on the yourmodelrailway.net forum.  The embedded photo shows up fine when I edit the post, but not when I view it as part of the thread.  No idea why.  Sorry.)

Edited August 30, 2017 by ejstubbs

[layoutnovice]

Hi All

 

Thanks for the replies I know my controller is quite old, I bought it second hand, Its a  dual Tasma 2.5 amp output, I'm new to modelling so don't know of the model, you change the direction by turning the knob to off and then a little further this then switched the switch, underneath there is a small ' vane ' which broke off on both of them, other to that happening it worked very well and was very happy with it, I'm not considering changing to DCC, I might buy a couple of pots, ( if they are cheap enough )  since my last post I have looked closer at them and they are 10 oms if not I think I will consider a new controller.

 

Mick

[melmerby]

There is a previous thread on this controller if you are interested:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/53599-tasma-twin-train-controller/&do=findComment&comment=639960

 

Keith

[cliff park]

The speed control pot is a 10K not 10 ohms. If you search on Google you will find the complete diagram, have not reproduced it here, not sure of copyrights etc.

[melmerby]

The speed control pot is a 10K not 10 ohms. If you search on Google you will find the complete diagram, have not reproduced it here, not sure of copyrights etc.

You can link to it

 

Keith

[BG John]

Loads of choice on eBay, from around 99p. Just search for "10k potentiometer", and find one that looks like the one you've got. You'll need a linear one, not logarithmic.

[DCB]

Someone must know about these units, they have made in England on the label, and lots of pictures on the interweb.

 

The reversing idea sounds weird, 

 

A couple of pots sounds like a good idea. 

 

If you must change try a Morley British designed and made, their hand helds are superb very light, very flexible wires and dead simple with a centre off knob, no fiddly reversing switches.  The NYMR shop had a huge advert for them today.

[melmerby]

Try as I may I can't find a diagram of this controller on Google.

 

Plenty of diagrams appear in the search, but none are correct!

 

Keith

[The Johnster]

I think you may be confusing a modern potentiometer:

 

 

which even the latest electronic DC controllers use, with a wire-wound rheostat, such as found in venerable beasties like the Tri-ang P.42:

 

 

Rheostats are, as you say, retro tech for our purposes and probably best replaced with a complete new controller.  Modern potentiometers in an electronic controller are fine, but pretty much non-user-serviceable so if they do go on the fritz then the simplest remedy is to replace them - if you can source the right one.  The OP may be able to find some kind of specification or ID on the existing pots - there's usually something marked on the bottom face of the round body of the pot, which can if all else fails be plugged in to Google to see if it sheds any light.

 

 

Gaugemaster may be dominant in this field, but they're not the only game in town.  Apart from the ones available from foreign manufacturers as listed by Dutch_Master, there's:

• Morley, whose Vector dual controller with built-in CDU works fine for me.  I particularly like the centre-off potentiometers they use - especially now that they have a positive detent at the off position, and it really is off. (I've never got on with reversing switches.)  The Vector is fully self-contained, so there's no separate transformer required.  And it comes with two hand-held controllers included, that plug in to the base unit;
• Modelex, whose single units seem to be liked by some;
• The Pictroller which is an update on the widely admired Pentroller as originally developed for Pendon.  This offers a variety of control modes and settings, as well as having capability for automatic operations.  Quite a sophisticated device, but priced accordingly.
• Hornby still does single and dual DC controllers, though I'm not aware of them having many actual fans.  And Bachmann does a single DC controller which some rate highly for the price (this one is often available second-hand having been split from a Bachmann train set).

There may well be others out there that I've forgotten/not run in to online.  There are plenty of threads on RMWeb and other model railway forums on the subject - again, Google is your friend.

 

(Incidentally, if you can't see the photo of the inner workings of the Triang P.42 controller then the URL for the photo is: http://yourmodelrailway.net/gallery/15/15_251330_350000001.jpg.  It's in the ninth post on this thread on the yourmodelrailway.net forum.  The embedded photo shows up fine when I edit the post, but not when I view it as part of the thread.  No idea why.  Sorry.)

 

 

I stand corrected.  

Not really, except for those whose world-of-modelling ends at the shores of the British Isles

 

Fleischmann do several:

https://www.modellbahnshop-lippe.com/gruppenliste/Analog+Fahrger%C3%A4te/2-7-0-0-022001-0-0-0-0-0-0-grp-de-p-0/gruppenliste.html

 

Piko:

https://www.modellbahnshop-lippe.com/gruppenliste/Analog+Fahrger%C3%A4te/15-4-0-0-022001-0-0-0-0-0-0-grp-de-p-0/gruppenliste.html

 

Roco:

https://www.modellbahnshop-lippe.com/produkt/Roco/1-7-0-161262-022001-0-0-0-0-2-0-grp-de-p-0/ein_produkt.html

 

Tillig:

https://www.modellbahnshop-lippe.com/produkt/Tillig/4-7-0-84701-022001-0-0-0-0-0-0-grp-de-p-0/ein_produkt.html

 

HTH!

I stand more corrected!

[Junctionmad]

Note , for the pedantics amongst you , a rheostat is a two terminal variable resistor , whereas a potentiometer is a three terminal component , that can be configured as a rheostat . It's matter not whether they are wire wound , carbon , etc etc , high or low power , resistance mat etc

 

The HM Clipper/duette is wired as a potentiometer , from the diagram I have and hence the OP used ther term correctly.

 

Just a point of nomenclature

 

Carry on

Edited September 1, 2017 by Junctionmad

[ejstubbs]

I stand corrected!

 

Note that "for the pedantics amongst you," should be either "for the pedantic amongst you," or "for the pedants amongst you".

 

Just a point of grammar

 

(Actually, "pedantics" sounds like quite an interesting subject for a university course module. Some people on here could probably get first class honours...)

[Junctionmad]

I stand corrected!

 

Note that "for the pedantics amongst you," should be either "for the pedantic amongst you," or "for the pedants amongst you".

 

Just a point of grammar

 

(Actually, "pedantics" sounds like quite an interesting subject for a university course module. Some people on here could probably get first class honours...)

 

I learn something new everyday , much of it useless of course 

Edited September 1, 2017 by Junctionmad

[BG John]

I learn something new everyday , much of it useless of course 

I don't think it's correct to have a space before a comma.

[Junctionmad]

I don't think it's correct to have a space before a comma.

 

Im going through an anarchic phase , Im considering dropping commas altogether, this is a baby step 

[BG John]

Im going through an anarchic phase , Im considering dropping commas altogether, this is a baby step 

And being radical enough to be inconsistent with it, although your lack of apostrophes seems to be consistent. Did you click Post before finishing the sentence, or are you revolting enough to omit full stops too?

[Crosland]

Be thankful no one is over-using the exclamation mark!

 

(prompted by this thread and a feature on R4 Today program this AM).

[dhjgreen]

Be thankful no one is over-using the exclamation mark!

 

(prompted by this thread and a feature on R4 Today program this AM).

Were they writing computer code?

[ejstubbs]

your lack of apostrophes seems to be consistent

 

I thought he'd just run out, after having to hand all his apostrophes over to those who favour it's and their's as possessives.  (I think I even saw theirs' recently <shudders>.)

 

Is this the right room for an argument about of being used in place of have?

[dhjgreen]

I thought he'd just run out, after having to hand all his apostrophes over to those who favour it's and their's as possessives.  (I think I even saw theirs' recently <shudders>.)

 

Is this the right room for an argument about of being used in place of have?

Your instead of you're.

[BG John]

I thought he'd just run out, after having to hand all his apostrophes over to those who favour it's and their's as possessives.  (I think I even saw theirs' recently <shudders>.)

 

Is this the right room for an argument about of being used in place of have?

There seems to be a potential difference occurring in this discussion, as the subject is wandering off the current topic. Of course we all know this happens regularly on RMweb, so resistance to it is futile. No doubt having irritated the OP, we'll return to his question eventually. If anyone objects, I expect some of the offenders will go to ground, while others will be more positive about it.

[RAF96]

I use an iPad on the forums and with my podgy fingers I get commas in all sorts of odd places I never asked for and even with auto correct turned off all sorts of correctly spelled (spelt?) but wrong words in my communiques, except this time of course as I try and fail to prove my point.

Rob

[Junctionmad]

What was this thread about, remind me again ?

Edited September 3, 2017 by Junctionmad