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Layout Design in Illustration software


Harlequin
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  • RMweb Gold

Hi everyone,

 

This topic is about drawing track plans in illustration software such as Adobe Illustrator, Xara Designer or Affinity Designer. (There are lots of other drawing programs that could be used.)

 

I know that dedicated track planning programs are widely used and are very popular but illustration programs allow you to take a slightly different approach to layout design that is more targeted at creating a visually pleasing end-result, more like the track plans that are published in magazines.

 

I hope this proves to be useful.

 

Phil

 

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  • RMweb Gold

Here's my first contribution: Templates for all Peco Streamline 00 crossings and turnouts.

 

E.g. here's the small radius point:

post-32492-0-33774100-1507013759_thumb.png

 

The PDF or XAR vector files below can be imported into your drawing program where you can copy the point symbols, rescale them and use them in drawings. Use the angles given and your software's snapping feature to join parts together correctly.

 

More detailed explanations and examples will follow later if there's any interest.

 

Latest versions:

Peco OO streamline points and crossings 9.pdf

Peco geometry 9.xar

 

Previous versions:

Peco OO streamline points and crossings 7.pdf

Peco geometry 7.xar

 

Phil

 

Edited by Harlequin
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I like this.  I used the Graphics Package that came with the Star Office Software Package that was bundled with Tiny Computers.  Unfortunately the software is not compatible with Windows 2007 and I cannot find anything that can open never mind modify the old files (they have the extension ".art"

 

Jim

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Here's my first contribution: Templates for all Peco Streamline 00 crossings and turnouts.

 

The PDF vector file below can be imported into your drawing program where you can copy the point symbols, rescale them and use them in drawings. Use the angles given and your software's snapping feature to join parts together correctly.

 

Phil

 

Note: I would have uploaded the original drawing but the forum is blocking it for some reason.

 

Phil,

 

Don't know which software you used, but the PDF imports into Xara Designer Pro without problems.

 

In Xara, the 'snapping' only works to the X and Y axes (and object ends / middle / etc.). Snapping objects on an angle only works by manual rotation of the objects to the desired angle first.

 

What I've found useful is to 'export' key parts of the track alignment (eg: junctions) from the layout software (in my case this turned out to be a bitmap), and then import it into Xara (and then scale it correctly). Bit of a 'faff' but useful to enable me to use Xara to the 'overall' design, and ensure the track junctions actually fit. However, I think I'll complete the drawing eventually in the layout software, once I'm happy with the overall look in Xara.

 

One comment I would add to your Drawing is to ensure you 'mark' the ends of each turnout / diamond / scissors, so that when they are aligned / joined together, each element is still easy to see. That way any short bits of plain track will stand out.

 

On your crossovers, why have you used 55.32mm (that's what it scaled in Xara) as the track centres? I thought Peco turnouts gave 52mm track centres natively.

 

Ian

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  • RMweb Gold

Phil,

 

Don't know which software you used, but the PDF imports into Xara Designer Pro without problems.

 

In Xara, the 'snapping' only works to the X and Y axes (and object ends / middle / etc.). Snapping objects on an angle only works by manual rotation of the objects to the desired angle first.

 

What I've found useful is to 'export' key parts of the track alignment (eg: junctions) from the layout software (in my case this turned out to be a bitmap), and then import it into Xara (and then scale it correctly). Bit of a 'faff' but useful to enable me to use Xara to the 'overall' design, and ensure the track junctions actually fit. However, I think I'll complete the drawing eventually in the layout software, once I'm happy with the overall look in Xara.

 

One comment I would add to your Drawing is to ensure you 'mark' the ends of each turnout / diamond / scissors, so that when they are aligned / joined together, each element is still easy to see. That way any short bits of plain track will stand out.

 

On your crossovers, why have you used 55.32mm (that's what it scaled in Xara) as the track centres? I thought Peco turnouts gave 52mm track centres natively.

 

Ian

 

Hi Ian,

 

Yes, Xara Designer won't automatically rotate symbols or groups when they snap together, but if you hold down Ctrl while you rotate them they will constrain to useful angles, including the angles of the lines in the group.

 

In Xara Designer, snapping inside Groups is turned off by default (on the basis that there would be too many things snapping together otherwise) but you can turn it on by hitting G while you are dragging a set of points around. Then you will see the snap indicators show true snaps between the ends of the lines and the angles between them.

 

To see the size of the pure geometry turn off "Scale Line Widths" in the Selector tool infobar. You will still see that the crossovers are slightly taller than the expected 25.4mm but I think the real Peco parts actually are like that (from the given angles, lengths and by overlaying the Peco templates). I thought about fudging those symbols to make them fit the expected track separation but decided to leave them alone for now.

 

Phil

Edited by Harlequin
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  • RMweb Gold

It's very important to make sure that line widths, arrowheads and end caps (etc.) are not contributing to the sizes and positions of symbols if you're trying to do anything mathematically precise in a drawing program.

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It's very important to make sure that line widths, arrowheads and end caps (etc.) are not contributing to the sizes and positions of symbols if you're trying to do anything mathematically precise in a drawing program.

 

Phil,

 

Thankfully, I normally have 'scale line widths' off anyway. In such circumstances, adding a 90-degree line to the end of a line (not at end symbol) is a useful visual tool to define limits.

 

And thanks for the 'G' trick, hadn't known that one. There is a 'A' (for angle trick) as well (now I've checked the Help file), but I can't fathom that one.

 

Bye the way, it's nice to find someone else actually using Xara!

 

Ian

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In post #2 http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/126780-layout-design-in-illustration-software/&do=findComment&comment=2874563 I have corrected the 3-way point to now use medium radius curves, uploaded a new PDF file and thanks to the site admins I've now also uploaded the original XAR file.

 

 

 

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  • RMweb Gold

Phil,

 

Thankfully, I normally have 'scale line widths' off anyway. In such circumstances, adding a 90-degree line to the end of a line (not at end symbol) is a useful visual tool to define limits.

 

And thanks for the 'G' trick, hadn't known that one. There is a 'A' (for angle trick) as well (now I've checked the Help file), but I can't fathom that one.

 

Bye the way, it's nice to find someone else actually using Xara!

 

Ian

 

Hi Ian,

 

Full disclosure: I actually work for Xara and more than that I've worked on Xara Designer since day 1 (and before that on ArtWorks!).

 

I'm not trying to push it forward here. The competing tools are equally capable, in fact better in many ways, and developing faster than Designer (sadly) - but obviously it's the tool I know best so that's why I'm using it.

 

The RMWeb Admins have now allowed XAR files to be uploaded and so you'll find the original XAR file for the points and crossings in Post #2 now. The points and crossings are all stored as symbols ("LiveCopies") so that changing one will change all the copies.

 

I understand what you're saying about making the ends more visible but those end marks would then be visible in final drawings too and you don't normally see such marks in track plans in books and magazines. However we could perhaps put marks in that only appear in outline mode (view quality 0). (I've already included some invisible lines to make sure that angle snapping has definite angled lines to work with rather than relying on calculating tangents at the curve ends.)

 

Phil

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  • RMweb Gold

Suggested method to transfer a point or crossing symbol into a scaled track plan drawing:

  1. Select the item you want in the points and crossings drawing
  2. Note the actual size width or height that your drawing program reports for the selected item
  3. Copy
  4. Paste into your scaled track plan
  5. Set width or height of the pasted item to the value you noted earlier (making sure that aspect ratio will be kept so that the item is not distorted).

Now you've got the point or crossing accurately to size in your track plan you can make as many copies as you need by copy/paste, duplicate or clone and they can be rotated and flipped as needed.

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Hi Ian,

 

Full disclosure: I actually work for Xara and more than that I've worked on Xara Designer since day 1 (and before that on ArtWorks!).

 

I'm not trying to push it forward here. The competing tools are equally capable, in fact better in many ways, and developing faster than Designer (sadly) - but obviously it's the tool I know best so that's why I'm using it.

 

The RMWeb Admins have now allowed XAR files to be uploaded and so you'll find the original XAR file for the points and crossings in Post #2 now. The points and crossings are all stored as symbols ("LiveCopies") so that changing one will change all the copies.

 

I understand what you're saying about making the ends more visible but those end marks would then be visible in final drawings too and you don't normally see such marks in track plans in books and magazines. However we could perhaps put marks in that only appear in outline mode (view quality 0). (I've already included some invisible lines to make sure that angle snapping has definite angled lines to work with rather than relying on calculating tangents at the curve ends.)

 

Phil

 

Phil,

 

I've used Xara since the mid '90s. I went to get Xara Studio, only to find Xara had been bought out by Corel so my first program was CorelXara. I had CorelXara 2 and then X, X1,  Xtreme, and now Designer Pro - although I'm still on version 10 (a little out of date).

 

So, I've absolutely no objection to you 'pushing' Xara  ...

 

If you want to avoid the 'limit lines' on turnouts, then I suggest using a different colour for the turnouts (as most layout software seems to do). Personally, I like to see the 'junctions' as those are parts for which the geometry is fixed. Straight and curved track can be adjusted, but not ladders of turnouts / diamonds.

 

Ian

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Here's my first contribution: Templates for all Peco Streamline 00 crossings and turnouts.

 

E.g. here's the small radius point:

attachicon.gifPeco example.png

 

The PDF or XAR vector files below can be imported into your drawing program where you can copy the point symbols, rescale them and use them in drawings. Use the angles given and your software's snapping feature to join parts together correctly.

 

More detailed explanations and examples will follow later if there's any interest.

 

attachicon.gifPeco OO streamline points and crossings 7.pdf

attachicon.gifPeco geometry 7.xar

 

Phil

 

Phil,

 

The XAR file imports fine, bus does report a few 'errors' due to me 'only' using Designer Pro X10. I guess you are using a '365' version? I'm assuming these are trivial issues that I can ignore.

 

One question; how did you create curves of a specific radius? Have you drawn a circle and then 'cropped' it to the desired angle of turn?

 

I've been using 3rdPlanIt to draw a layout, but as I'm a dare sight more experienced with Xara, I'm tempted to give it a go - although I can't see how I'll be able to get Xara to create curves with transition curves!

 

Ian

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Phil,

 

I've used Xara since the mid '90s. I went to get Xara Studio, only to find Xara had been bought out by Corel so my first program was CorelXara. I had CorelXara 2 and then X, X1,  Xtreme, and now Designer Pro - although I'm still on version 10 (a little out of date).

 

So, I've absolutely no objection to you 'pushing' Xara  ...

 

If you want to avoid the 'limit lines' on turnouts, then I suggest using a different colour for the turnouts (as most layout software seems to do). Personally, I like to see the 'junctions' as those are parts for which the geometry is fixed. Straight and curved track can be adjusted, but not ladders of turnouts / diamonds.

 

Ian

 

Nice to meet another loyal Xara user!

 

Yes, I agree about seeing the fixed geometry sections during the design stage and I have been using colour to do that. E.g.:

post-32492-0-03437500-1505861502_thumb.png
 

Then, when the design was finalised you might reset them all to black again for a cleaner look.

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Phil,

 

The XAR file imports fine, bus does report a few 'errors' due to me 'only' using Designer Pro X10. I guess you are using a '365' version? I'm assuming these are trivial issues that I can ignore.

 

One question; how did you create curves of a specific radius? Have you drawn a circle and then 'cropped' it to the desired angle of turn?

 

I've been using 3rdPlanIt to draw a layout, but as I'm a dare sight more experienced with Xara, I'm tempted to give it a go - although I can't see how I'll be able to get Xara to create curves with transition curves!

 

Ian

 

Yes, I'm afraid that Xara Designer's tools for creating arcs are not very good so I drew circles, then drew lines at fixed angles from the centres and sliced the circle to get constant radius curves.

 

For some "flexi" track runs I just use bezier curves, make sure that they are smooth with tangential joins at the ends by eye and then check the min radii by dragging a fixed radius template over the top.

 

Similarly with parallel tracks I draw a 51mm circle and drag it along the tracks to gauge the distance between them, making the spacing wider where long vehicles might overhang.

 

I hope you give it a try, I'll do my best to answer any questions and I'm looking forward to seeing what you come up with!

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Phil,

 

Have you any information regarding the capabilities of Xara for exporting SVG files for Cricut / Silhouette cutting machines? Have you heard of anyone successfully getting this to work?

 

Getting a Cricut cutting machine is on my 'list of things to buy', so getting it to work with Xara would be a great help.

 

Ian

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  • RMweb Gold

Here's how to start a track plan in a drawing program:

 

(All of the steps below can be changed later - everything is editable in a drawing program so you're not committing yourself at any stage.)

  1. Create a blank page of the size you want - usually the size of paper your printer can handle.
  2. Work out how big your design will be in the real world and set a scale factor in the drawing so that your design will fit onto the page*. For instance, to fit a design for a 2.5m long layout onto an A4 page you might set a scale factor of 1 : 10. (* I don't think Affinity Designer supports drawing scale factors yet.)
  3. Create a layer for the baseboards.
  4. Draw the baseboards to scale. Usually this means simply drawing some rectangles, setting their sizes and giving them a light neutral fill colour.
  5. Create a layer for a grid on top of the baseboard layer. A grid of a known size helps you and your readers understand how big elements of the design are.
  6. Draw a grid of equally spaced lines, or snapped together squares, of accurate size - most typically 1ft or 300mm.
  7. Create a layer for the track layout on top of the grid.
  8. Start drawing some simple lines to give a rough idea of where the tracks might be laid. Drop in some points templates (see above) to join the lines together.

Now you're up and running!

 

You can add more layers later to hold things like ground surfaces, trees, shrubs and buildings. Layers are a great way to keep the drawing organised.

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Phil,

 

Have you any information regarding the capabilities of Xara for exporting SVG files for Cricut / Silhouette cutting machines? Have you heard of anyone successfully getting this to work?

 

Getting a Cricut cutting machine is on my 'list of things to buy', so getting it to work with Xara would be a great help.

 

Ian

Hi Ian,

 

I think it's just a matter of using the right named colours for the outlines but I'll try to find out tomorrow and get back to you.

 

(Possibly also creating a simple silhouette path by using Combine Shapes => Add shapes and setting a flat fill colour.)

Edited by Harlequin
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  • RMweb Gold

Here's a layout design that started as a response to Bristol Park Street (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/122449-minories-on-the-western-region).

 

After I had simplified the crossovers I wanted to try to get access to the goods siding(s) downstream from the only crossover so that goods traffic could enter on the Down line and leave on the Up.

 

I achieved that in this design and provided a headshunt and sidings so that goods shunting doesn't impinge on the running lines and is operationally worthwhile.

 

By sharing the platform 2 escape road with the goods yard (for space efficiency) the goods yard has the classic "Inglenook" pattern of 3 sidings and headshunt and so it can be used to run the Inglenook shunting puzzle, largely independently of the passenger side.

 

The loco spur allows "Minories" style operation of the passenger platforms: full-length trains where the hauling loco can't escape and a pilot loco is used to remove empty carriages and free up the original loco for other duties.

 

The two baseboards are 1400*500mm each with an imagined fiddle yard perpendicular to the north east side. Min radius 610mm (2ft).

 

I think this design has a good flow and a realistic linearity to it.

 

post-32492-0-88201400-1507708494_thumb.png

(Click to enlarge)

 

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..................

 

The loco spur allows "Minories" style operation of the passenger platforms: full-length trains where the hauling loco can't escape and a pilot loco is used to remove empty carriages and free up the original loco for other duties.

 

The two baseboards are 1400*500mm each with an imagined fiddle yard perpendicular to the north east side. Min radius 610mm (2ft).

 

I think this design has a good flow and a realistic linearity to it.

 

attachicon.gifBristol Park St sketch 3.png

(Click to enlarge)

 

I really like that!  Are they really Streamline curved points?  Wow!  Never seen them used so effectively before!

 

That is so good it hurts.  S...t, I wish I had seen that 2 years ago when I was designing my layout!

Edited by imt
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I really like that!  Are they really Streamline curved points?  Wow!  Never seen them used so effectively before!

 

That is so good it hurts.  S...t, I wish I had seen that 2 years ago when I was designing my layout!

Thanks!

 

Yes, they are Streamline 00 curved points. I find I'm using them more since I added them to my geometry document (at the top of this thread), I guess because I no longer see them as exotic oddities!

 

Even the 3-way point becomes useful now and then... ;-)

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  • RMweb Gold

Thanks!

 

Yes, they are Streamline 00 curved points. I find I'm using them more since I added them to my geometry document (at the top of this thread), I guess because I no longer see them as exotic oddities!

 

Even the 3-way point becomes useful now and then... ;-)

 

Oh yes I use all the others, slips, 3-way the lot, but never the curved points.  I couldn't visualise how their geometry would fit. You have done it amazingly.  A designer's eye I expect!

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Evening All,

 

I use Xara for my layout planning, but have only used it for "roughing out" a track plan.

 

I tend to use Templot for the track plan, export to PDF, then import into Xara.

 

Below is the current plan for my N gauge modern image layout "Bridgtown", although this is looking likely to return to the drawing board for some tweaks to fit a slightly revised footprint:

 

post-4669-0-24602100-1382289778.jpg

 

Cheers,

 

Mark

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  • RMweb Gold

Here's a document containing some useful bits and pieces:

  • Curves of common radii - drag them over your curves to assess if radii are too tight.
  • A rail track brush - apply to any simple line to lay rails and sleepers along it.
  • A couple of points with rails and sleepers - they have the same geometry and snapping centre lines as in the Peco Geometry document above.
  • Spacers - drag them over your lines and curves to assess spacing. Snap to line and snap parallel line to spacer to get exact spacing.

 

OO Design tools.pdf

OO Design tools.xar

 

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