Copperclad pointwork construction

[ianathompson]

I have been asked about the methods used to construct the points on my main layout (the AFK) on another forum. I use copper clad sleepers as the basis of construction.

 

Whilst I would definitely not claim to be an expert at constructing points there seem to be a number of people vaguely interested in the subject but who are hesitant to dip their toe into the water,

.

The techniques are basically the same in any gauge or scale, although I model in 7mm narrow gauge, which is effectively OO gauge.

 

I hope that some-one may find something of interest, even if only as a subject of mirth!

 

If some-one as ham fisted as myself can construct the things then I am sure than nearly any-one can!

 

The site is at http://myafk.net/building-pointwork

 

Ian T

 

[Kelly]

Useful and interesting, thanks for sharing.

[Junctionmad]

I would say that the method used are not suitable for mainstream mainline track , the switch blade filing etc is not correct and is not the way to construct it , equally the crossing Vees not filed correctly 

 

There are some very good tutorials on track construction that deal with this correctly , google is your friend 

Edited October 5, 2017 by Junctionmad

[Regularity]

I would say that the method used are not suitable for mainstream mainline track , the switch blade filing etc is not correct and is not the way to construct it , equally the crossing Vees not filed correctly 

 

There are some very good tutorials on track construction that deal with this correctly , google is your friend

 

How do you know what the Railways of Thalnia did? Maybe they didn’t follow conventional construction methods?

 

I have often seen these methods suggested in North American magazines, and on websites, so a Google search may simply turn up something similar.

 

I am all for doing things more accurately, but I am also in favour of people encouraging others to have a go.

Not so keen on pouring cold water on enthusiasm, and coming up with platitudes like “Google is your friend”. Some actual recommendations rather than, “That’s not right, but find out the right way yourself,” might be viewed in some circles with rather more positivity.

[Junctionmad]

How do you know what the Railways of Thalnia did? Maybe they didn’t follow conventional construction methods?

I have often seen these methods suggested in North American magazines, and on websites, so a Google search may simply turn up something similar.

I am all for doing things more accurately, but I am also in favour of people encouraging others to have a go.

Not so keen on pouring cold water on enthusiasm, and coming up with platitudes like “Google is your friend”. Some actual recommendations rather than, “That’s not right, but find out the right way yourself,” might be viewed in some circles with rather more positivity.

I meant nothing derogatory with my google reference, merely that there is a huge amount of existing web material on track construction and it would be ridiculous for me to paraphrase it in a thread

[Regularity]

Provide us with some example links, at least, and then your helpfulness will be demonstrated.

[hayfield]

I meant nothing derogatory with my google reference, merely that there is a huge amount of existing web material on track construction and it would be ridiculous for me to paraphrase it in a thread

 

 I looked at the link especially as I am interested in both track building and narrow gauge modelling. I decided it was best not to comment. There are a few things if building a standard gauge turnout that may cause a few problems, with narrow gauge you could say the builder has captured the rustic style of modelling, but full marks for effort in making modellers aware of the ease of building your own track

 

Provide us with some example links, at least, and then your helpfulness will be demonstrated.

 

I sense a bit of friction with your reply, here is a link which if you are truly interested in the subject might help, though I think you may well be aware of this area, but the link could assist others

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/160-handbuilt-track-templot/

[Signaller69]

Copperclad point construction is of passing interest to me so thanks to Ian, Regularity and Hayfield for the various links.

 

My own experience of soldered copperclad construction thus far has been limited to rebuilding some Peco large radius 'N' gauge points to match their 009 track (the over-centre spring was left well alone), and building a curved 00/009 crossover from scratch, both of which I'm happy to say worked well, although this was some years ago. The future project which is somewhat more daunting is a long double slip in code 75; I have never felt the need for Templot but may give it go for this. . . . I am fully aware about getting the relationship of the various components correct from my previous efforts, but it is always pleasing to see how others have tackled the various aspects.

 

Edit: OP link not acknowledged, oversight corrected.

Edited October 12, 2017 by Signaller69

[ianathompson]

Notwithstanding the preceding comments, the original article was produced in response to requests on another forum about my construction methods. I simply included on this site because, as I noted, there seem to be many modellers who also express interest in this method of construction without seeming to take the plunge

.

I appreciate that the article has a long pre-amble that many readers probably skipped. I did point out that, "I would by no means claim to be an expert or a paragon of virtue in using good practice. Having said that the AFK has around 100 points which are expected to perform consistently without problems."

 

 

Regarding replicating SG track, the method has been used on Auchintoul, my N gauge layout, about which I have very occasionally posted on this site. It had to be used here because the pre WWI GNoSR used interlaced sleepers.

 

The AFK is a freelanced continental NG railway unlike any found in this country. Its inspirations included intensively operated lines such as the Rhaetian, the Roglasbanan in Sweden and many others which acted as quasi mainline systems.

 

I accept that this is probably of little interest to readers of this forum. Those straying from the track construction page on the website might have noted that the AFK runs similarly intensive operating sessions underpinned by reliable operation.

Be that as it may it was always intended that the article would be supplemented with a second part looking at more complex pointwork. This has now been published at http://myafk.net/complex-trackwork

 

As a taster I have posted one photo of the layout's 'party piece' below.

 

005 - Copy - Copy by Ian Thompson, on Flickr

 

Ian T

[sp1]

It’s great to see someone having a go and encouraging others!

I think the best explanation of copperclad construction is on the ‘Eastwood Town’ thread on here: I think it’s on about page 42/3 of the thread - I’m sure a pm to Gordon would point you to the right page.

[Regularity]

I sense a bit of friction with your reply,

 

I looked at the link, and did think, “That’s not how I do it,” but was pleased that some had had go and developed a method which worked for them, and also shared it to encourage others.

Constructive criticism which suggests alternatives is good. Criticism which doesn’t suggest anything at all is useless, and simply suggesting to use google to do a search, rather than a few helpful links, is at best rather lazy, and at worse only one step up from negativity. Forums are at their best when we have constructive criticism, which my second comment demonstrates: a suggestion of how the reply could have been more helpful. User-feedback means moderators need not get involved.

 

Friction? If so, you have read far more into it than is there. No idea who the other posters are.

here is a link which if you are truly interested in the subject might help though I think you may well be aware of this area, but the link could assist others

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/160-handbuilt-track-templot/

There is a lot of good stuff in there.

 

Incidentally, there are times when “Google is your friend” is fully justified, e.g. when a poster is looking for information and hasn't even done that much themselves. I didn’t think this was one of them.

The AFK is a freelanced continental NG railway unlike any found in this country. Its inspirations included intensively operated lines such as the Rhaetian, the Roglasbanan in Sweden and many others which acted as quasi mainline systems.

 

I accept that this is probably of little interest to readers of this forum. Those straying from the track construction page on the website might have noted that the AFK runs similarly intensive operating sessions underpinned by reliable operation.

 

As a taster I have posted one photo of the layout's 'party piece' below.

Ian T

I thoroughly enjoyed my visit to your site, and that photo is great.

 

Keep on sharing!

[hayfield]

Copperclad point construction is of passing interest to me so thanks to Ian, Regularity and Hayfield for the various links.

 

The future project which is somewhat more daunting is a long double slip in code 75; I have never felt the need for Templot but may give it go for this. . . . I am fully aware about getting the relationship of the various components correct from my previous efforts, but it is always pleasing to see how others have tackled the various aspects.

 

Edit: OP link not acknowledged, oversight corrected.

 

Making a slip in Templot has just become very easy as it has been automated, as for the build using the Exactoscale chair components especially their Common crossing (E4CH 502A) and Slip chairs (E4CH 504A) not only look good but do assist with the build process, and depending of the gauge chosen the Check rail chairs (E4CH403A)

 

One tip for double slips cut the switch rail in to 3 sections using the metal fishplates as the hinge, this frees up the switching dramatically 

[ianathompson]

Re the last point about using metal fishplates as a hinge.as advised by Hayfield.

 

I am interested in this suggestion.

 

I personally moved away from this procedure in my general method of construction because I could not control the rail alignment at the hinge and this led to derailments.

This was why I moved to soldering the switchblades to a solid base. I assume that the fishplates that you use are more rigid than the Peco ones that I used for code 100 track.

 

 

My own approach to modelling a double slip has been to fabricate the central obtuse nose (for want of a better term, but doubtlessly I will be corrected (!)) as one piece but to solder the adjacent switch rails as outlined.

I must admit that this results in a stiff set of blades which would probably not take very well to anything other than the simple rods that I use to operate points.

 

Thanks to Regularity for the encouragement but it seems unlikely that I will be sharing too much about the AFK on this forum.

That's not because of any problems with the forum but simply because I have enough on my plate posting in Narrow Gauge Modelling On Line.

I only included the original post on this thread as an afterthought to posting on that forum.

(In fact I did not even realise that this forum did overseas railways until this comment prompted me to look at the indices!)

 

I suppose that I could be persuaded to notify of updates to the web site as this is how I avoid long posts on the NGM site.

 

As anyone who has visited the site will quickly have gathered building points is simply a means to an end.

The AFK is built to operate trains to a time table whilst simulating the demands placed upon it by the local (imaginary) economy.

 

 

In the fullness of time I will resume posting about Auchintoul but as that layout has been moribund for some time there is not likely to be anything in the near future!

 

Ian T

[hayfield]

Re the last point about using metal fishplates as a hinge.as advised by Hayfield.

 

I am interested in this suggestion.

 

I personally moved away from this procedure in my general method of construction because I could not control the rail alignment at the hinge and this led to derailments.

This was why I moved to soldering the switchblades to a solid base. I assume that the fishplates that you use are more rigid than the Peco ones that I used for code 100 track.

 

 

My own approach to modelling a double slip has been to fabricate the central obtuse nose (for want of a better term, but doubtlessly I will be corrected (!)) as one piece but to solder the adjacent switch rails as outlined.

I must admit that this results in a stiff set of blades which would probably not take very well to anything other than the simple rods that I use to operate points.

 

Reply

 

Ian, I use the Exactoscale E4XX FP11 cast metal fishplates. The central part of the switch rail is built the normal way within the obtuse crossing, what I do is to solder the cast fishplate to each end. The switch rails just slide in and are soldered at the tip to either s tiebar or turnout actuator. I think I got the method from a demonstration by Norman Solomon. No need to solder the switch rail to the fishplate , as this will lock everything up, the movement at the fishplate end is minimal and I guess you could use an etched fishplate, (soldered at one end only).

 

Do look into the Exactoscale special chairs as they do assist in the build and look terrific to boot

[Junctionmad]

I now realise the trackwork post was intended as purely an illustration of a fictional narrow gauge prototype , so I accept it can be anything the OP desires. My issue was where it might be interpreted as a valid construction approach for main line railways, but clearly now , that's not the authors intent

[hayfield]

 

I personally moved away from this procedure in my general method of construction because I could not control the rail alignment at the hinge and this led to derailments.

This was why I moved to soldering the switchblades to a solid base. I assume that the fishplates that you use are more rigid than the Peco ones that I used for code 100 track.

 

 

 

Ian T

 

Ian

 

I built a turnout using code 100 flatbottom rail to a similar size to a Peco small turnout, as the rail is so stiff and the blades too short to get any flex I used a Peco plastic rail joiner as a hinge. It works very well, Code 75 can be built this way using N gauge rail joiners. However using the cast metal fishplates work a treat with bullhead rail

[dhjgreen]

I use a narrow strip of soldered phosphor bronze as a hinge, narrow enough to fit snug to the rail web.

Edit: ensures good electrical continuity

Edited October 16, 2017 by dhjgreen

[bertiedog]

The filling of the rails is an accepted model railway method, after all copying the prototype closely is really for P4.

 

Personally I assemble the switch blades solid, soldered at the V crossing, and get the point running and tested, before parting the switch blade to add a PB strip as a hinge. The electrical breaks are between the hinge and the v crossing.

 

There are dozens of other methods, some nearer the real thing, but no more or less reliable than basic PC construction

.

On the soldering , it will help if 60/40 lead solder is used, not the pure tin.solder.

 

As sleepers stand heat better if fibre glass board is used, then you can pre tin the whole sleeper, use a tiny clip of solder to get consistency.

 

The rails are simply attached by heating, with flux. You can add more to get a chair effect, but there are other ways.

Stephen