Improving the ExKirk Maunsell Kitchen Dining Car 1st.

[Mallard60022]

I have built one of these, more or less as provided but with Baccy Bogies adapted to fit (not that well really) and additional WM fittings to suit 1960ish. Having just got another (now available from several Traders) I'd like to attempt to make a better job of this one. Any tips on how to do that gratefully received. Again it would need to be D2655 (No 7997 or 8) for 1960ish.         

Many thanks 

Phil                   

[Dunsignalling]

I've so far built 4 Kirk Southern coaches, a Bulleid 3-set and an, as-yet unfinished, Maunsell open second that will probably get converted to a Buffet Car as I subsequently bought some Hornby Open Seconds.

 

In all cases, I used Ratio bogies, complete with their own mountings, having removed the blobs from the underside of the Kirk floor and they ran very nicely. Fortuitously, having busted one, I also discovered that the Bachmann bogies fit the Ratio mounts almost perfectly............

 

However, for my next project, I've acquired a Hornby FK, Kirk sides and interior dividers and will attempt to unite them all,  altering or adding roof, underframe and interior details as required.

 

John  

[SRman]

Interesting, John. I have always found both Kirk and Ratio bogies to be rather fragile, although I have been able to get good running qualities out of both types.

I have a wagon (a steel high) full of bits that have fallen off Kirk bogies over the years!

Edited October 9, 2017 by SRman

[Mallard60022]

I've so far built 4 Kirk Southern coaches, a Bulleid 3-set and an, as-yet unfinished, Maunsell open second that will probably get converted to a Buffet Car as I subsequently bought some Hornby Open Seconds.

 

In all cases, I used Ratio bogies, complete with their own mountings, having removed the blobs from the underside of the Kirk floor and they ran very nicely. Fortuitously, having busted one, I also discovered that the Bachmann bogies fit the Ratio mounts almost perfectly............

 

However, for my next project, I've acquired a Hornby FK, Kirk sides and interior dividers and will attempt to unite them all,  altering or adding roof, underframe and interior details as required.

 

John  

I didn't know that Ratio did SR 8' Bogies. Are those from the lovely Bogie van they do?

Phil

[Dunsignalling]

I didn't know that Ratio did SR 8' Bogies. Are those from the lovely Bogie van they do?

Phil

Yes. The individual reference number for a pair is 104. 

 

Or was - I can't find any listed on-line..........

 

John

Edited October 13, 2017 by Dunsignalling

[pete_mcfarlane]

Other options for SR 8' steam bogies are Comet and NNK (in kit form) and Hornby if you can get them as spares. The NNK ones are my preferred choice these days, but they're not always available. 

[Wickham Green]

Other options for SR 8' steam bogies are Comet and NNK (in kit form) and Hornby if you can get them as spares. The NNK ones are my preferred choice these days, but they're not always available. 

While the principal topic of this thread is probably best answered by saying chuck the Kirk RFK bits in the bin and order one that Hornby have announced today  -  I can confirm that Ration bogies* were certainly still available from PECO a couple of years ago and that MJT would be another possible source ............. I still intend to finish my Kirk-based RFK and Buffet Car - one day - having gone to all the trouble of splitting each side into umpteen bits and re-profiling the far-too-flat below-waist bodysides !

 

* no, NOT what I typed ...... amazed it didn't predict it as 'Ration Book' !!

[Mallard60022]

Not 'chunky' Hornby item that can be I am sure will be tweaked to represent about 4 Diagrams; lovely.

End of story really!

Phil

[145 Squadron]

While the principal topic of this thread is probably best answered by saying chuck the Kirk RFK bits in the bin and order one that Hornby have announced today  -  I can confirm that Ration bogies* were certainly still available from PECO a couple of years ago and that MJT would be another possible source ............. I still intend to finish my Kirk-based RFK and Buffet Car - one day - having gone to all the trouble of splitting each side into umpteen bits and re-profiling the far-too-flat below-waist bodysides !

 

* no, NOT what I typed ...... amazed it didn't predict it as 'Ration Book' !!

 

I have found that built as per instructions there is a lot of 'slop' in the Ratio SR steam bogie pivot although the detail is nice. Bachmann SR bogies are freely available as spares and although not as detailed as the Hornby ones (which are also difficult to find as spares) they are cheaper and in my experience very free running with metal wheels - these are now my standard bogie for self builds.

 

Having just read the Hornby announcement in the February Railway Modeller I had not noticed until then that Hornby appear to be producing two diagrams of RFK, a 2651 and a 2656; the visible difference in the RM is the window ventilators and the size of the window to the right of the double doors. One will be in Southern livery and the other in BR livery.

 

Why?

 

Tony

[bécasse]

The main recorded difference between the two diagram numbers was in the detail of the kitchen equipment although the earliest vehicles to diagram 2651 lacked passenger doors which were subsequently added to them in the mid- to late-1930s. The differences between the two diagrams weren't really discernible from the exterior apart from an odd kitchen ventilator. There were, though, differences between individual vehicles within diagrams, notably, as has been noted, concerning the window ventilators.

 

Many of these vehicles were altered, some quite drastically, in the very late SR and early BR period, to better fit them to a changing market for on-train refreshment.

[Mallard60022]

I have found that built as per instructions there is a lot of 'slop' in the Ratio SR steam bogie pivot although the detail is nice. Bachmann SR bogies are freely available as spares and although not as detailed as the Hornby ones (which are also difficult to find as spares) they are cheaper and in my experience very free running with metal wheels - these are now my standard bogie for self builds.

 

Having just read the Hornby announcement in the February Railway Modeller I had not noticed until then that Hornby appear to be producing two diagrams of RFK, a 2651 and a 2656; the visible difference in the RM is the window ventilators and the size of the window to the right of the double doors. One will be in Southern livery and the other in BR livery.

 

Why?

 

Tony

Southern Livery D2656 as is probably correct in exterior detail for the time? It is only a 2656 because of internal fitting modification. So, is it an 'original window' D2651?

BR Livery D2651 has different windows as mentioned. I'm searching hard to find out when that happened. So is it a modified window D2651? I'm hoping Graham will be able to tell us (or any other coach enthusiast).

Both can be, and the BR version should definately be, able to represent several different Diagrams with internal detail differences, as long as one is careful about those windows; but would anyone notice those if yours is a layout that never leaves home? I'm looking forward toseeing the quality not the width window detail!