RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted November 14, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 14, 2017 Archers rivet transfers maybe? http://www.archertransfers.com./SurfaceDetailsMain.html Peter They are good, but they just drove me mad trying to get them off of the backing on a GN wagon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 14, 2017 Author Share Posted November 14, 2017 Archer's rivets would make sense however I reckon I would need at least 3 sheets and would prefer to keep the cost to a minimum. I would use my spiked tracing (pounce) wheels, but cannot for the life of me find where I "safely" put them. This is a constant problem in the Trice household. I will probably end up pressing them out with a compass point using a Silhouette template. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 14, 2017 Author Share Posted November 14, 2017 After some experimentation the only practical way to emboss the rivets is with a pounce wheel. I bit the bullet, started moving things around in the garage, and found them. Phew! Just need to get the two rows lined up properly: A jig was printed off from Inkscape, glued to the styrene with a glue stick, against which the ruler was aligned and held, then the rivets rolled: Me thinks there might be some rejects but I can use the misaligned ones to form the single row reinforcement strips. Thinking of using unembossed 10thou initially then adding an embossed 5thou overlay. P.S. Sorry for photo quality. 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 15, 2017 Author Share Posted November 15, 2017 Visited KX again today to take a further 207 photos. Meanwhile I am putting together a prototype roof truss to assess the best way forward. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted November 15, 2017 Share Posted November 15, 2017 Visited KX again today to take a further 207 photos. Meanwhile I am putting together a prototype roof truss to assess the best way forward. A prototype of the model one I hope, not a real prototype one you pinched while you were there . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 15, 2017 Author Share Posted November 15, 2017 I did look to see if one would fit in my pocket: Reminds me of the joke "is that a truss in your pocket or are you just pleased to see me?" 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted November 16, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 16, 2017 You don't fancy doing the original laminated timber trusses instead of the iron ones. You'd only have to swap all those rivets for 1000's of nails. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 16, 2017 Author Share Posted November 16, 2017 (edited) My first roof truss has come out better than I expected. There are things wrong with it so I will need to alter the cutting pattern and I could do with an easier way to put them together, especially as I will need to produce 10 of them. It does not look too bad in situ: The real thing for comparison: Edited November 16, 2017 by MikeTrice 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted November 16, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 16, 2017 Look out Ron Heggs, you have competition !! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper John Posted November 16, 2017 Share Posted November 16, 2017 My first roof truss has come out better than I expected. There are things wrong with it so I will need to alter the cutting pattern and I could do with an easier way to put them together, especially as I will need to produce 10 of them. IMG_3323.JPG IMG_3325.JPG It does not look too bad in situ: IMG_3330.JPG The real thing for comparison: IMG_2933.JPG Hello Mike, Fantastic work. By the above do you mean the large circular bracket at the apex, your looks just a tad low. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 16, 2017 Author Share Posted November 16, 2017 There are far more errors than just that, one of which there should be 4 holes at the top of the cutout not 3 as modelled. Biggest problem is I did not cater for the inner flanges where the main beam bifurcates into two. I really did not think it through fully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted November 16, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 16, 2017 'bifurcate' - definitely word of the day !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 16, 2017 Author Share Posted November 16, 2017 Hello Mike, Fantastic work. By the above do you mean the large circular bracket at the apex, your looks just a tad low. The circular bracket compares favourably to various drawings and is not bad photographically either. I suspect it is an optical illusion: 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 16, 2017 Author Share Posted November 16, 2017 (edited) 'bifurcate' - definitely word of the day !! I will let you into a secret. I had to check that it meant what I thought it did P.S. Sadly not the first time used on RMWeb either. Must try harder next time. Edited November 16, 2017 by MikeTrice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
col_kilgore Posted November 16, 2017 Share Posted November 16, 2017 You say theres things wrong with the test truss but I suspect most people would be glad to get to that stage , never mind make it even better ! Excellent stuff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tref Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 Yep, I'm one of them! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted November 17, 2017 Share Posted November 17, 2017 Don't know if you are covering that area, but there are differences in the trusses that were repaired/replaced after the WWll bomb blast. Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 17, 2017 Author Share Posted November 17, 2017 Thanks. Yes I am aware of the differences but fortunately they are outside of the area being modelled. For anyone wondering what we are talking about this photo shows the replacement trusses behind one of the originals: 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 Second attempt. Much more fiddly to put together but more prototypical, however there are still some simplifications that I can live with: And slightly closer: First attempt on the left with the new version on the right: There are a few minor issues with the new one regarding neatness (or lack of) so I will assemble them all and cherry pick the best for those most visible. Might take me several days. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 Mike An absolute stunning bit of modelmaking Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 I mentioned earlier that I need a method to speed up construction of the remaining roof trusses. I use d-Limonene as a solvent which is slower curing and not such an instant grab. Just building a single truss using my previous method was very time consuming so clearly something had to change - they needed mass production. This is how I went about it. The cross section of the main beam is as shown below: The main arch is laminated from two layers of 10 thou styrene cut on the Silhouette cutter. The sides of the "I" section are added from 10 thou styrene strip then finally rivet overlays are added using 5 thou styrene (all styrene shown in white). In order to get a recess the sides are fixed in place over a jig (shown in brown). But first I had to laminate the two layers of styrene. In the past I have found it can be difficult to accurately align the two pieces and solvent together. A chance visit to a branch of Wilco allowed me to purchase a rediculous quantity of square nuts for £1.99 (in their hardware pick and mix section) Using the square nuts it was relatively easy to align the two layers and apply some solvent in the gaps: With so many nuts purchased I could do several in one go: For the assembly jig itself I needed card around 0.5mm thick similar to the cereal packet. So my first attempt was to try cutting my small remaining stock of cereal packet which was not very successful (the card de-laminates too easily). During a chance visit to Hobbycraft I spotted what was labelled as Oiled Stencil Paper (Daler - Rowney 16257). This looked around 0.5mm thick and also looked as if it would be more robust in cutting as it proved to be. So here is my prepared jig comprising cut trusses glued to another sheet of Oiled Stencil Paper: While the Silhouette was out I cut some 1.8mm styrene strips in 10thou: I could now lay my previously laminated trusses onto the jig and strips of 1.8mm styrene held in place vertical to them using as many square nuts as needed. Solvent was then applied and the whole lot left to cure: Now another length of 1.8mm strip was bent carefully trying to avoid the styrene breaking and glued to the inner face at the bifurcation: Finally the truss was removed from the jig and the ends trimmed back then the whole lot put back in the jig and the end length of 1.8mm strip added. The rivet overlays are now added manually. Laminating and assembling using the square nuts has proved really successful. In hindsight it would be even better if I use magnets on a steel plate as a backing in the future so I have now got some on order. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted November 23, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 23, 2017 That's just nuts! (And also a great job Mike, really good to watch how you do things). Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted November 23, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 23, 2017 Just a thought about the magnets - be careful they don't interact with each other and move out of alignment. But a really good explanation of a well thought out solution. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted November 24, 2017 Author Share Posted November 24, 2017 Just a thought about the magnets - be careful they don't interact with each other and move out of alignment. I have ordered some 5mm * 6mm round magnets and a piece of 300mm*300mm steel sheet. Having done so I began to wonder if what you said would be a problem so some experiments were due. I had some 2mm * 2mm * 6mm magnets on hand and managed to "borrow" one of my wife's baking trays (as opposed to one of my wives' which would have been big o' me ;-)). Providing I oriented the magnets correctly there were no great issues and the alignment and hold is far superior than using the nuts: Placing the oiled stencil card over the tray there was still enough magnetic attraction to hold the items in place: So based on this I don't think I will have any issues and things are held far firmer when applying solvent. 7 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
70b Posted November 24, 2017 Share Posted November 24, 2017 Thanks. Yes I am aware of the differences but fortunately they are outside of the area being modelled. For anyone wondering what we are talking about this photo shows the replacement trusses behind one of the originals: IMG_7629.JPG apart from admiring the stunning and absolutely brilliant modelling here I'd also like to thank you for opening my eyes to the Kings Cross shed roof, hadn't previously noticed these but I was stood under some of the replacments waiting for the doors to be unlocked on my train home this week. I. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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