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Dairy Box


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Hello All,


 


I've been lurking and reading this forum for a while ( and impressed how friendly and encouraging everyone is), this is my first post.


 


My model railway bits have been in store for more than 20 years as lack of time/space/money has meant I haven't used any of it, and quite a lot was disposed of during a house move a few years back.  Over the Christmas break, the wife wanted to "sort out" the garage, and in doing so we found we had several box files we don't need any more, and we found a box of old model railway parts.


 


So, having read here about "Box file layouts" - I'm tempted.


 


The resources at hand are as follows:  Three box files (only one has an opening front flap), assorted track and (Peco) points.  Bachman class 03, Hornby class 25 (part converted to 24), Lima 2 car DMU, 4* six wheel milk tanks, unfinished Ratio bogie van kit.  (I also have some SM32 and OO9 bits).  Really old Triang transformer/controller (still works)


 


I put some bits together over the weekend, to see if the loco's still run (they do), see how feasible the idea is and try out some ideas.  What I did discover was that I won't be able to use the points, or at least not many of them: they are medium radius, and I'll need the short radius points to fit the boxes.


 


The obvious choice, given the stock, is a small dairy siding.  So my plan must have a run-round and a dairy siding: a platform would be nice but not essential.


 


First plan looks like this:


 


post-33525-0-74677700-1516001149_thumb.png


 


Which is OK. Operationally, the loop is long enough for the 03 + 2 tanks, but not the 03 + 2 tanks + van.  That's fine, it makes the shunt more interesting.


 


I could add another siding on the other side (plan 2)


 


post-33525-0-51325400-1516001173_thumb.png


 


Which a) adds more shunt possibilities, and b) gives more shunt challenges


 


My third plan (so far) gives a longer siding for the dairy (bottom left) and optionally includes the second siding on the right.


 


post-33525-0-12721900-1516001189_thumb.png


 


I think this is my current preference - it looks more "natural" (if that's the right word) than the first plan, and arguably is more prototypical.  On the other hand it might be a bit cramped in the space.


 


Electrically, all the box joins will be isolating gaps, and each of the six sections (two on each box) will separately fed through switches


 


So what do you think? Any comments on the plan, or other ideas?  Anything I've missed?


 


Thanks,


 


Mark


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Hi Mark.

 

Welcome to the forum, I like your idea for your layout.

 

I prefer not to cram in too much, it looks more natural and to use a well known phrase " less is more ", I tend to try and go for good operating potential without to much track and avoiding craming everything in.

 

A dairy is a interesting choice for a layout, one I have considered myself, I wish you all the best with your project and look forward to more.

 

Jerry.

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The top plan is pretty accurate for a small or medium sized dairy such as the one at Felin Fach on the Aberaeron branch. Check out the sequences below.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/31890193@N08/albums/72157644841434794

 

Having said that, the flow of trackwork on the 3rd plan does look much nicer. Check out the following thread for some good sources of inspiration (as well as calcium ;) ). 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/120441-branch-line-creameries/

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Thanks for those links Karhedron - I particularly liked the link to the Aberayron Dairy photos
Some lovely atmospheric shots there, and much inspiration :)

Welcome to rmweb mrgoodspeed, and welcome back to modelling
Many of us take a break from the hobby, from time to time - often it's "enforced" so to speak
But I think once railways and model railways are in your blood -  they're there forever

I particularly like the last one of your plans. They all "work" well enough, but there's something about the way the last one flows
It just looks great IMHO. You could even add a small (dummy if you like) headshunt on the foreground siding.....

BTW. In your description of the box files, you say only one has the front opening flap - will you modify them so they all have the same flap?
Do you intend to keep them as separate modular units, or will you join them permanently? (this option should produce a more reliable base)

Cheers now
Looking forward to seeing this one develop

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Make sure the mains cable on your "really old" controller is not cracked or damaged, best to replace if there is any doubt. New ones are not too expensive, the Hornby train set type are ok (and cheap)with no mains lead to worry about!!

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The top plan is pretty accurate for a small or medium sized dairy such as the one at Felin Fach on the Aberaeron branch. Check out the sequences below.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/31890193@N08/albums/72157644841434794

 

Having said that, the flow of trackwork on the 3rd plan does look much nicer. Check out the following thread for some good sources of inspiration (as well as calcium ;) ). 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/120441-branch-line-creameries/

Thanks Yes, those pictures of Felin Fach are interesting - although I think arranging my dairy like that would be too easy to operate ;-)

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Make sure the mains cable on your "really old" controller is not cracked or damaged, best to replace if there is any doubt. New ones are not too expensive, the Hornby train set type are ok (and cheap)with no mains lead to worry about!!

Good point. Its nearly as old as me - I can remember playing on my bedroom floor with it.

 

I had a nice little Gaugemaster hand held controller - but I couldn’t find it when I went through the boxes the other day.

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But I think once railways and model railways are in your blood -  they're there forever

Yes, everytime I visit the local model railway show, I come away with ideas. I think this time something might happen. Most of my railway activities have been computerised of late, and I still have some software projects in progress to keep moving.

 

BTW. In your description of the box files, you say only one has the front opening flap - will you modify them so they all have the same flap?

Not sure. The middle of the three will definitely have the opening flap. The right hand probably doesn’t need it as it will be a cutting before the tunnel anyway.

 

The left-hand? Not sure ATM. As much of it will be wall of the dairy anyway, it doesnt need to open, but I have considered if the box can be cut without ruining the structural strength. Or if I can find a suitable box to swap.

 

Do you intend to keep them as separate modular units, or will you join them permanently? (this option should produce a more reliable base)

They will need to come apart for storage.

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Not made a lot of progress beyond acquiring some points and experimenting with cutting the front flap of one of the boxes. Been busy with software projects.

 

I’m wondering about signals.

 

Disclosure: I like signals and I used to be a signalman on one of the preserved railways. Pet hate is layouts a) without signals b) with signals, but signal doing the wrong things.

 

So do I want to put signals on this? If I don’t I can’t really have more than one loco/unit at a time. If I do, will it be too fiddly? But I guess the main signals need only be a home and a starter the rest could all be shunt signals. And on a small layout, confined by box sides, I could tolerate the shunt signals not working.

 

Also, haven’t decided how to work the points. Magic finger, or point motors, or maybe wire rods.

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I went with point motors but I eventually decided they were overkill on a small layout. If you can reach all parts the layout (easy enough on a small one like that), I would probably suggest wire-in-point (assuming you want to avoid the 1/76 "hand of god" descending every time you want to throw a point :jester: ).

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Yesterday I started cutting the boxes.

 

Two of the boxfiles did not have opening sides, but by cutting down the corners with a hacksaw, I was able to make the sides open. When cutting the corners, I found there were staples in the join, but these cut with the hacksaw as well. I could of tried to remove the staples first, but this would have disturbed the finish on the outside of the boxes. Once cut, it was possible to bend the flap outwards, exposing the staples in the long edge, which were then cut with side cutters. This gives me the opening sides, and I intend to stick carpet tape over the “hinge” in the manner of the box with the already opening side.

 

I also cut the holes between the boxes, but found later that I haven’t cut quite enough and the largest stock fouls the top of the hole. So I will need to enlarge the clearance before going any further :-(. It’s difficult to balance adequate clearance with not weakening the box too much.

 

MRG

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My plan for construction is to use pieces of high density fibreboard as a foundation for the track. At least I think it is HDF - I had a lot of pieces stored away, they came from a scrap store years ago, and they are a bit thicker and a lot stronger than what I think of us hardboard.

So I plan to glue these on to the bottom of the boxes, then glue the track to these boards.

 

At the box joins I’m going to glue copper clad board to the HDF and solder the rails to the copper clad.

 

Yesterday, I finished cutting the boxfiles and glued the HDF into the boxes.

 

I’m now wondering if this was the wrong thing to do.

 

For the main straight, I can glue the track/points in place and cut for the ends fairly easily. But I’m worrying about the three curved sections that cross the box joins. If I hadn’t already glued the bases into the boxes, I could of assembled the whole track layout and bases as one piece, glued the track to bases and soldered the rails to the copper clad, then cut the rails at the joins. This should of aligned the curves nicely, and I could of then glued the sub-assembly for each box into the box.

 

But now that I’ve glued the base boards in, I’m not sure how to handle the curved sections. I guess I need to cut them, position them on the boards with pins (drawing pins) and then glue the curves to the board. Not sure this going to be that easy.

 

Any advice please?

 

Apart from, don’t do it this way :-)

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  • 2 months later...

Update: progress is slow as other projects (and life) get in the way.

 

I have now cut the boxes , glued the board in place (as above) and now all the track is wired and glued into place.  Not having glued track before there were a couple of false starts: the first point in glued I spread glue liberally over the board and placed the point, then realised I had now got the tie bar and moving points deep in glue.  Fortunatly I spotted that before the whole thing set solid, so was able to pull it out and clean the point up.

 

After a little bit of trial and error I settled on a method of aligning the track joints by cutting a wood former to the curve I wanted (this fitted between the rails) and held the track on both sides of the join in the correct alignment while the glue set.  I would post a picture, but I can't work out how to do it in this editor :-(  This has worked well and I'm happy with the running over all the joints now.

 

I've also cut and assembled the passenger platform and the dairy dock.  These need to be painted/covered and the dairy buildings added.  Thoughts are developing on how to build the bridge that will cover one of the joins so that it is a) removable b) stowed inside the box when not in use.

 

I've decided to use point motors for point operation (having found I had four such in my stocks) and will be mounting these shortly.  Next big task is to build and wire the control panel. 

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  • 4 months later...

Well progress has been slow (mainly due to other (computer) projects, life etc) but there has been some progress. Sometimes it feels like I’m making progress, other times I look at examples other people post here and feel discouraged by the quality and how my poor imitations look in comparison. But mainly, I’d forgotten how much fun railway modelling is.

 

All the track is now laid and wired up, point motors fitted and wired. I’ve decided to fit signals, which will be operated by relay solenoids, and the first of these (solenoids) are now in place and wired up. There is a little bit of interlocking between signals and points in the wiring.

 

The class 03 I started with has now been joined by an Ivatt 2MT (eBay bargain) and having two loco’s adds a lot to the operational possibilites - but does mean I need to have the signals. The tank is the push-pull fitted variant, so a push-pull coach is on the to-do list.

 

Scenically, a road bridge now covers one box join (Metcalfe kit) and the dairy now has a building and canopy (scratch built card and plasticard). Both of these structures are removable so the boxes can be closed for storage. The dairy needs painting and detailing. I like the look of the dairy canopy, but the downside is that it is dark under there, and not always easy to see to uncouple. I might fit some lights under the canopy.

 

I’ve started experimenting with painting the track (current colour is too bright, so will wash it with something darker) and I intend to ballast the track - but I want to get all the structures in place, and certainly all the wiring and moving parts sorted first.

 

Signal wise, I found I had quite a lot of brass signal parts stored away from previous modelling, so I intend to use some of these. Because they need to fit inside the closed box, the signals will all be quite short, but given the sighting constraints of the tunnel and bridge, this is acceptable. The signals are quite challenging - when I bought these parts 25 years ago, I could see what I was doing!

 

So, quite a bit of progress, a growing list of things to do. But mainly lots of fun and enjoyment.

post-33525-0-20257300-1535394885_thumb.jpeg

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MrGoodspeed

 

It's all looking really good to me, especially the middle box. What's more, you are having fun, and that's the most important thing of all.

 

Look forward to seeing more of this.

 

Regards

 

Bill

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  • 1 month later...

Question about grass.

 

I have a small section of cutting side behind the signal box, which I want to cover in grass.

 

It’s about 10cm * 30cm in size. I’ve seen posts and pictures on here of static grass - and it looks great - but it looks like I would have to buy quite a lot of bits just for this small area.

 

What’s the best (economic) way to cover this small area with grass?

 

Thanks.

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  • 1 month later...

Been busy lately with writing apps ... but needing a break from computers from time to time have made some progress.  Mostly been concentrating on box 3 recently.
 

img_0013.jpg

 

Changes here include:

  • Track has been painted and ballasted.
  • Signal box (scratch build from card and plastikard, and - obviously - incomplete).
  • Former - behind the signal box - covers the wiring and will be grass embankment in due course.
  • The first signals are in place in this box, and operational.

 

 15b.jpg16b.jpg

 

Signal is built from bits of brass kit I had left around from previous projects and is operated by a rod soldered to the moving arm of a relay as you can see in the photo.  The relay will be covered by scenery eventually.  Signals are quite short so that the box lid can be closed.

 

The layout will have three full signals, and three dummy eventually, all working and "interlocked" with the points.

 

Also new on the layout is a class 121 railcar (which I would like to convert to a 122 in time) courtesy of on-line auction.

 

 

There was some discussion elsewhere on this site about software for model timetables or operation. 

I made a quick web-app for my layout:

dbc.jpg

 

The app is designed to run on a tablet (eg iPad) and shows the next train to arrive (on the right) and the milk tanks in the station on the left.  You tell the app when a train arrives or departs and it will generate the next arrival from simple rules and available stock.

 

If you want to have a play with it, feel free at:  https://spotlog.org/apps/dairybox/app.html

 

With the aid of this app I spent over an hour playing this evening - and only stopped because I had other things I needed to get on with ;-)

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