Another Challenge ?

[Clive Mortimore]

Suzie, on 16 Feb 2018 - 20:38, said:

No greater incentive to finish a layout than it being judged.

 

I can easily think of other ‘incentives’ to get a layout finished, principally for the pleasure of the builder(s), who have invested a significant amount of mental and emotional energy into it, plus time and (probably) money.

 

 

Suzie, on 16 Feb 2018 - 20:38, said:

Any layout might take ten years to finish, but 95% will be done in the first fortnight anyway.

 

I’m glad to see that interplanetary travel has advanced to the stage that you are able to come to Earth from whatever planet you were on, when you made that statement (but apologies for my sarcasm if you are actually one of those talented people who can actually work with such speed and 'right-first-time' accuracy).

 

 

Beacon, on 16 Feb 2018 - 23:30, said:

I think the format could easily resemble the recent Lego challenge.

 

And there’s another hobby activity demeaned by the TV cameras and production companies’ desire for ‘drama’ and ‘tension’.

 

 

rue_d_etropal, on 19 Feb 2018 - 22:25, said:

Modelling against the clock, is not the problem.

 

Perhaps not for you and others, but for me, and I suspect a great many of us, imposing any kind of deadline to what is supposed to be a relaxing and pleasurable hobby is a complete turn-off.

 

 

rue_d_etropal, on 20 Feb 2018 - 12:18, said:

Like the idea of some international teams. I wonder if they underestimated the potential for this program. Maybe it could lead to something bigger, with regional heats and then a final with the best from each region.

Oh dear. Oh dear. Really?

 

Perhaps everyone involved should all wear T-shirts or some kind of sporting attire with their regional or national flags/logos on them. A podium, perhaps, where the Lostwithiel winner of that particular heat can stand in all his or her earnest solemnity and salute the flag of St Piran, as the off-screen orchestra plays ‘Squire Trelawny’.

 

 

Huw Griffiths, on 20 Feb 2018 - 17:29, said:

the tone of this thread seems to have turned more positive again - instead of an irritating cacophony of negativity

 

I’m sorry for feeling the need to share my views, Huw, as I normally find your posts elsewhere on the forum informative and interesting. I can do 'irritating' and 'negativity' quite easily, however, having trained for it all my life.

 

 

bryherw, on 20 Mar 2018 - 18:30, said:

Our aim is to bring this beloved hobby to a wider audience

 

Interesting word for you to use, Bryherw, to whom is it actually ‘beloved?’ To us, here on this forum, certainly, and in the wider world of ‘model railways’, but to you and the others in the production team? How many of you in ‘television land’ were actually interested in this hobby before someone decided to do a reality TV programme on it? (just wondering).

 

 

I fully appreciate that many of the posters on this thread seem to be very enthusiastic for this TV programme. That is indeed your right to feel that way and I hope it brings you much pleasure.

 

Perhaps those who, like me, feel concerned about the way this could end up portraying our ‘beloved hobby’, together with those who (also like me) are increasingly dismayed at the desire of profit-seeking TV executives to turn innocent past times such as painting, needlework, cookery etc. and now model railways, into stress-inducing competitive activities, are staying away from this thread?

 

Let’s not kid ourselves here – the TV company is out to make money. This kind of programme, as evidenced by previous shows featuring hobbies/activities like pottery, needlework/clothes making, interior design, painting, Lego, cookery, gardening, music, Kirstie’s Christmas challenges (have I missed any others out) thrives on tension and, consequently, stress. There is almost always that ridiculous wait at the end of each ‘heat’, to some supposedly tension-inducing background music, for the unlucky loser to be declared and then ejected from the competition.

 

Why do we need to introduce tension and stress into our hobby? Why does everything have to be competitive these days? Who really gets into this hobby to become stressed and experience tension? I know I am not alone in wanting my modelling to take me away from the tension, stress and general competitiveness of many aspects of everyday life.

 

I strongly feel that programmes like this usually end up demeaning the hobby or activity that is being featured. Not necessarily in every case, but good quality modelling is hardly something that benefits from being done against the clock.

 

I admire those (relatively few, I would have thought), who can produce high quality models accurately and quickly, ‘right-first time’ if you will. I am surely not the only one who needs to (and likes to) take his time, to ensure that each stage of the modelling process is done correctly and to the required standard? How can having a ticking clock help that? (exhibition deadlines, by the way, is something that I have done in my time and now reject. I would rather not exhibit something, than risk rushing it and ending up with something ‘sub-standard’).

 

Perhaps the winner of ‘The Big Painting Challenge’ receives well-earned praise for his or her work. But perhaps he/she also thinks that the work could have been so much better without the ticking clock? In which case, as far as I am concerned, I would consider my time and effort to be largely wasted, if it didn’t contribute towards achieving the very best that I might be capable of. In other words, that painting might well have won that competition, but if it was me doing it, I would probably consider it a ‘second best’ effort and, therefore, not representative of what I would otherwise know I am capable of.

 

Fair play, though, to the RTR manufacturers, if this gives them some additional publicity and perhaps helps a few new people into the hobby. That is possibly the only advantage I can see for ‘the hobby’ itself but my gut feeling is that, on balance, the risk of negative outcomes is higher.

 

I certainly do not intend to insult any individuals on this forum who are keen on this programme, but I fear for the way the participants could get portrayed, when the filming is finished and everyone has gone home. The editorial process of putting each final programme together is going to be completely outside of your control. Each person is going to have to be very careful indeed about everything you say and do on camera, because that is what the rest of the TV-viewing public is going to see. Trying to be mindful of never putting a foot wrong in that respect just seems to add an additional layer of stress. But if that really doesn’t bother you, then fine.

 

When I told CTMK that model railways was now also to be the subject of one of these ‘challenge’ shows, she just guffawed with laughter because we’ve talked about the possibility of model railways getting targeted and how I always dismissed the idea as ridiculous. Well, that’s put me in my place, hasn’t it?

 

But at the end of the day, to those who really are fired up by this and end up taking part, I hope it goes well for you and that you derive enjoyment from the process.

Hi Tim

 

I am hoping our team are picked by the TV company.

 

All the Knickerbockerglory TV team seem nice people. 

 

I am up for a bit of infighting and making up, sorting non-relevant problems out. And most of all winning...... :locomotive:

[rue_d_etropal]

 

The Ally Pally shuttle bus was like an OAP outing.

Sounds like many buses these days. Those with young family don't tend to visit exhibitions/events by bus. Despite growing up down south, and having visied the old exhibition at Central Hall9and when it temporarily moved) as well as Model Engineer exhibition at Wembley andother venues/museums,I have never visited Ally Pally. Given its location, families with youngsters might prefer to go by car.

There is quite often a difference in typedepending on day. Also last week in the snow, at Rochdale Town Hall, there seemed to be more young than old. More difficult stopping youngsters wanting to hold their parents/grandparents to promise of a visit to see trains.

 

I am not sure if the hobby is dying, just changing. Look ar old magazines over past 60 years, and there always seems to be similar comments. Diesels taking over from stea(yet increased interest by young in pre-grouping), DMUs taking over loco hauled trains(more interest in computer based 'model' railways. There might not be a model shop in your town, but now we have online shops. A bigger problem for exhibitions is venues upping prices beyond what is sustainable. In an attempt to keep ticket prices lower, costs for traders are going up, and some are pulling back, and having a rethink on whether it is worth while.

TV programs will help the hobby.

Does anyone know if Model Railways is still an option in the DoE award , or the scout badge collection?

Edited March 25, 2018 by rue_d_etropal

[Blobrick]

Is there anyone else putting a team togeher. Maybe a group from north west. Many of us might be in clubs, but we also know a lot of other club people around the region. I did email the productio company a few days ago, but no reply so far.

 

There's a team that's been put together with members from  the track laying "Team A" from Channel 4s Biggest Little Railway. The team members have each had to submit a self made video presentation, addressing preset questions from the Production company.  The team member come from Scotland down to the south coast.

Edited March 25, 2018 by Blobrick

[HillsideDepot]

 

Does anyone know if Model Railways is still an option in the DoE award , or the scout badge collection?

 

As an Explorer Scout Leader (14-18 age group) and a Duke of Edinburgh Award Leader I can answer "yes" to both.

 

The Scout (10-14 year olds) Badge requirements says:

 

Model Maker Activity Badge

 

How to earn your badge

Choose one of these five options. Then complete all steps for your chosen option.

 

Option 5

1. Build a model coach or wagon. Show that it can run properly behind a scale locomotive.
2. Build a scaled scenic model, such as a station or farmhouse for a railway layout. You can use a kit if you like.
3. Talk about the experience of building your models with a knowledgeable adult.

For Explorer Scouts (14-18) there is the

 

Creative Arts Activity Badge

 

How to earn your badge

You should be aiming to work toward your Creative Arts badge over 6 or 12 months.

1. Demonstrate involvement and improvement in a creative activity of your choice. Show evidence of your work.
2. Perform or exhibit the work you have completed. Examples of possible activities might be:

• art
• photography
• writing
• model making
• any other creative activity agreed by the leadership team.

It is then noted that

! This badge can count towards the Chief Scout's Award, Queens Scout Award, or the Duke of Edinburgh Award.

 

For the Duke of Edinburgh's Award Skills requirement, under Creative Arts it says:

 

Model construction

• Hand-paint fantasy games models and enter them in a competition
• Design, build and furnish your own dolls’ house
• Build a working model of a plane or helicopter, using a construction kit, and fly it
• Create a detailed model of a famous building of your choice, with advice from an architect

Remember, these are just a few ideas. Chat to your Leader, family, friends and people who’ve already achieved an Award to see what they’ve done and what opportunities are available in your local area.

Don’t forget to check with your Leader that what you choose to do meets the DofE’s requirements for this section and your level.

So no specific mention of model railways, but railways would certainly fit if done at the right level.

[Satan's Goldfish]

Ref the line 'UK's best modellers' and that putting folks off from creating a team as they don't class themselves in that bracket; While there are some mighty fine modellers out there, I don't particularly class myself as one of them. A lot of very good modellers are also very modest and would see a line like that and dismiss themselves from the competition because of it.

 

I've tried to ignore that line on the poster (although it does play on my mind at times) and I suspect others may have too, and I'm treating this as an opportunity to try something different, and hopefully learn something new. The way the hobby is portrayed in the final edit will happen whether people from here either do or don't take part, I'm not going to lose sleep over that.

[Captain Kernow]

Hi Tim

 

I am hoping our team are picked by the TV company.

 

All the Knickerbockerglory TV team seem nice people. 

 

I am up for a bit of infighting and making up, sorting non-relevant problems out. And most of all winning...... :locomotive:

Well, I wish you all the best, Clive.

 

If you are in it, I'll have to watch it, won't I, if only to keep up with the chat on our various social clubs layout threads? 

[Suzie]

No one will be good at everything, but most people will be very good at at least one aspect. For a competition like this it is not the most obvious skills that will be required - excellent time management and planning will be the foremost requirements.

[Mallard60022]

Hi Tim

 

I am hoping our team are picked by the TV company.

 

All the Knickerbockerglory TV team seem nice people. 

 

I am up for a bit of infighting and making up, sorting non-relevant problems out. And most of all winning...... :locomotive:

Yo, go for it Mortybomb. I'd enjoy watching you being diplomatic and supportive and at least your past experience will be useful for mending damaged bodies after handbag contests.

A. Consultant

[5050]

 excellent time management and planning will be the foremost requirements.

So what's that got to do with modelling?  Possibly the complete antithesis in many cases.

[bgman]

Yo, go for it Mortybomb. I'd enjoy watching you being diplomatic and supportive and at least your past experience will be useful for mending damaged bodies after handbag contests.

A. Consultant

 

 

So what's that got to do with modelling?  Possibly the complete antithesis in many cases.

 

 Sorry, I misread that as Anaesthetist, which is probably something Clive could also explain to us !   

B.Eerbottul

Edited March 28, 2018 by bgman

[TEAMYAKIMA]

So what's that got to do with modelling?  Possibly the complete antithesis in many cases.

 

I'm not saying that planning and time management are the # 1 issue when building a layout but they are very important.

 

This competition is about getting something built against a deadline - not unlike many of us building exhibition layouts. I am building an exhibition layout and I have a self-imposed dealine of May 4th 2018 (Bristol) - time management and work planning are very important to me to get my layout ready in time. Those two issues are important to me and my modelling.

[Robin Brasher]

Daniella has contacted me about the Great Model Railway Challenge and I have passed the information on to the Wimborne Railway Society and the South Dorset Modellers. Not much interest shown so far and I found it difficult to find this post on the RM Web.

 

One problem is that most railway modellers I know tend to build their own layouts rather than get together on a team project.

[Clive Mortimore]

 Sorry, I misread that as Anaesthetist, which is probably something Clive could also explain to us !   

B.Eerbottul

  AH!! Anaesthetist, I do rememeber being in the middle of a conversation between a surgeon (old school, thought he was a second only to god) and a gas man. It ended with the anaesthetist saying "As fast as you are trying to f'ing kill the patient I am trying to keep him f'ing alive". The following day the patient said to me how wonderful he thought the surgeon was. If only he knew.

 

 

Back on topic, I am still looking forward to winning with the motley but excellent mob we have formed. I think they have all built the layout in their heads before we even know what we are doing, how is that for forward planning? Go Diesel Dynamos. :locomotive:

Edited March 28, 2018 by Clive Mortimore

[Andy Y]

Phil caught up with the producers at the weekend where you can get an insight into what some of the content may be.

 

[bgman]

A good interview there and having started this thread ( wanting it to be a positive for Railway Modelling ) I hope that it produces some worthwhile layouts and friendships from the challenge.

 

I wish the contestants and the programme the very best of luck and enjoyment !

[DJM Dave]

Just come across this thread.......... read the last 2 pages first......yes , I know, and first thoughts are ‘oh dear’, not another one.

 

However ‘bake off with railways’?

 

Strewth.

 

Wonder if there’s much money to be made, if we all got together and started a production company to do it ourselves?

 

Not keen on the idea at all to be honest.

[PMP]

Just come across this thread.......... read the last 2 pages first......yes , I know, and first thoughts are ‘oh dear’, not another one.

However ‘bake off with railways’?

Strewth.

Wonder if there’s much money to be made, if we all got together and started a production company to do it ourselves?

Not keen on the idea at all to be honest.

Bake off is simply the way of getting the idea across,

Contestant = team

Ingredients = materials and stock

Cake = layout

Type of cake, Swiss Roll = Theme, Mountain Railway

Expert Judge = Expert Judge, someone with the skill set to comment and appraise the team effort.

Timed challenge to complete the task.

Winner = Team that does the best.

 

Who is ‘we’? for all getting together and why do ‘we’ need to make money from it? Knickerbocker’s already done the pitch and got the commission, Epic fail already in the timing element of providing an alternative production, out in the first round unfortunately.

 

You may not be keen on the concept, fair enough, Pat Doyle has mentioned Bachmann, Hornby, Gaugemaster and Peco are in the mix, so they clearly think a bit of prime time TV might be a good idea. I think I’d probably be on the same page as them.

[Clive Mortimore]

Just come across this thread.......... read the last 2 pages first......yes , I know, and first thoughts are ‘oh dear’, not another one.

 

However ‘bake off with railways’?

 

Strewth.

 

Wonder if there’s much money to be made, if we all got together and started a production company to do it ourselves?

 

Not keen on the idea at all to be honest.

Had you read the first page then your comment would have been valid.

 

If you are not interested butt out.

[DJM Dave]

Had you read the first page then your comment would have been valid.

 

If you are not interested butt out.

How very polite, many thanks for that.

 

I would have hoped that my opinion was as valid as the next persons irrespective of whether you think i'm right or wrong, but it seems not. what a shame!

[Captain Kernow]

A good interview there and having started this thread ( wanting it to be a positive for Railway Modelling ) I hope that it produces some worthwhile layouts and friendships from the challenge.

 

I wish the contestants and the programme the very best of luck and enjoyment !

Well, I've watched the interview right through and it was interesting to hear the TV rep saying what he had to say.

 

I haven't changed my views on this and if anything, I wish even more strongly that this had never seen the light of day and wasn't going to happen.

 

However, I am not unaware of the existence of potential positives and Grahame has succinctly summed these up, so my personal views notwithstanding, I still wish all those who are chosen to take part, the best of luck.

 

If it gives the hobby a boost and improves it's public image, then that's probably an even greater prize.

 

It doesn't sound like the kind of modelling I would enjoy, but then again, I'm an awkward and pedantic old farrt, who's views will sooner or later belong in the history books.

[Clive Mortimore]

How very polite, many thanks for that.

 

I would have hoped that my opinion was as valid as the next persons irrespective of whether you think i'm right or wrong, but it seems not. what a shame!

It dosen't help when there are ten negative replies to each positive one especially when one comes from a manufacturer.

[DJM Dave]

It dosen't help when there are ten negative replies to each positive one especially when one comes from a manufacturer.

Does that make the 10 right or wrong mate?

 

you could look at the possibility that the negative ones are possibly correct as they outweigh the positive ones, but i will defend the right for people to have a different opinion to myself without such a strong dismissal of others opinions that don't agree with yourself.

[Andy Y]

From my post in the Ally Pally topic regarding the Biggest Little Railway.

 

 

It was evident one of the stars of the show was 'Silver Lady' on the MRC stand with kids and families wanting their photo taken with the TV star. Sniff all you like at the TV series but if it stimulates interest then it's a good thing, the evidence I saw throughout the weekend was that it's a very good thing which we all ultimately benefit from.

 

 

It wouldn't appeal to me, personally, to be a participant but good luck to those who may enjoy doing so. It's unlikely to be something to stimulate the finescale modeller but if it cultivates more interest in the hobby, prompts a few returnees and maybe a little more appreciation or understanding of the hobby and possibly bring a bit more money in then it can't all be a bad thing. Bashing it just for the sake of it (without any caveat that it may be of interest to some) is somewhat misguided until any output has been seen, more a case of "you will hear my opinion" and trying to cultivate negativity. You know what? I don't care if someone doesn't care, I'll make my own mind up in due course.

[BlackRat]

I'd give it a go, but after a few social sherbets I have a propensity to take my clothes off and do the dance of the flaming ars*holes atop the bar or a convenient table....or layout. ( it's a Marine thing).

 

Makes great telly,....... but.......possibly not good for the hobby.

[Satan's Goldfish]

I'd give it a go, but after a few social sherbets I have a propensity to take my clothes off and do the dance of the flaming ars*holes atop the bar or a convenient table....or layout. ( it's a Marine thing).

 

Makes great telly,....... but.......possibly not good for the hobby.

At least it would show it's not just a hobby enjoyed by 'stereotypes'.