brossard Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) I'm building the Parkside PS114 LMS Banana Van. Originally these were fitted with steam heat to help ripen the bananas. After 1951, BR discontinued the use of steam heat but I just read that through steam pipes were kept until 1963 so that other steam pipe fitted stock could be used with them. My layout is in the 1962ish era. Could a wise person please elucidate with more details. I will install a steam pipe if required. John Edited March 17, 2018 by brossard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 17, 2018 Author Share Posted March 17, 2018 Wanting to get on with my build, I've assumed that through steam pipes were present in 1962 so installed them: Vacuum and Steam pipes are brass tube, the actual dia was something like 2". I used 0.032" brass wire for clips. I cobbled up a drain cock for the steam pipe from bits of plastic tube. This is based on a drawing of a meat van in Bob Esserys LMS Wagon Drawings. Phosphor bronze wire is the vac pipe connection to the cylinder. I glued a stip of plastic to the back of the brake handle ratchet and made a reinforcing bracket from scrap brass. Oddly, these vans didn't have tie bars between the axleguards. John 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandwich station Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 I don't know the answer to your question but would like to see more photos of the build, as it go's along to completion please. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 17, 2018 Author Share Posted March 17, 2018 Apparently you're not the only one to not know , but I'll continue to document the build. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bigbee Line Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 (edited) Curiosity Killed the Cat..... John, the comment regarding lack of tie bar between the axleguards grabbed my attention. 'Normally' when unfitted wagons receive vacuum cylinders on 'pusher' brakes a tie bar is fitted to stop the axleguards being pushed outwards, not necessary on 8 shoe clasp brakes as they grip the wheel. However I found a picture of an LMS fish van http://www.alextrack.co.uk/model_railways/2mm_finescale/non_passenger_carrying_coaching_stock/fish_vans_lms_d2107.html where it has a 10'6" wheelbase, pusher brakes and no tie bar... It may be that the tie bar fitting came later (after a problem had been perceived). Looking on the internet it appears..... that LMS fitted 9' pushers do not have the tie, whereas LMS fitted 10' pushers do. Maybe the 9' wheelbase were not XP rated and as such the brake force required to stop at Freight Train Speeds.. A real conundrum.... Edited March 18, 2018 by The Bigbee Line Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 18, 2018 Author Share Posted March 18, 2018 Well Ernie, every picture I could find had no tie bar. I know that tie bars were used to stop axle guard spreading and to optimise brake force. All my other 9' WB 4 shoe wagons have tie bars so this was surprise. The WB is 9', so in the BR era, (those that survived) were certainly not XP rated. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgeT Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 Love your attention to detail John, with me if you can't see it l don't bother Hahaha cracking job mate.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bigbee Line Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 Well Ernie, every picture I could find had no tie bar. I know that tie bars were used to stop axle guard spreading and to optimise brake force. All my other 9' WB 4 shoe wagons have tie bars so this was surprise. The WB is 9', so in the BR era, (those that survived) were certainly not XP rated. John It might have been a nice to do at the time. The LMS bean counters would have rubbed their hands at the saving in materials... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 18, 2018 Author Share Posted March 18, 2018 Love your attention to detail John, with me if you can't see it l don't bother Hahaha cracking job mate.. I think that some of these details, while not seen all that clearly, add that certain something to the model. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 18, 2018 Author Share Posted March 18, 2018 This afternoon I assembled the body to the underframe. I got a good fit but care is really needed to ensure this. In particular the solebar ends need to be fettled to slot in the end buffer beam. Some construction methods that I use. Corner brackets to ensure body squareness and reinforcing bars to stop the body from bowing in.Also self adhesive weights to raise the wagon weight to the requisite 1gm per mm of length. I think ~150gms. Anyone who has built a Parkside kit in 7mm will be familiar with the whitemetal cast vacuum and steam pipes. I really don't like them and, in the past, have substituted Slaters lost wax items.This time I thought I'd see if I could do something with the kit parts. My biggest beef is that the "bag" looks crude and oversize. I cut the bags off and substituted Slaters springs, a much cheaper option.You can see I drilled and glued a piece of wire in the vacuum pipes. This will locate the pipe to van end. I also drilled and glued some wire where the the hose connection meets the standpipe. I also drilled the hose connection enabling me to join them.John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hal Nail Posted March 19, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 19, 2018 Funnily enough with a bit of fettling I’ve found the Parkside pipes are a lot better than some! I have a few wagons that needed pipes and tried all sorts of other cast types without being impressed. I also resorted to slaters springs over a guitar string core as they are pretty fragile if left hollow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 19, 2018 Author Share Posted March 19, 2018 Hi Hal, I don't think they're all that bad with the Slaters springs. I installed them today and had to tie the end of the steam pipes to stop them dragging on the ground. Glue is drying at the moment and I'll post a pic later. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 20, 2018 Author Share Posted March 20, 2018 Things moved quickly over the day or so: Coupling is Dapol. I know these don't "work", but they do look good. Parkside only ever supply 3 link couplings and sometimes a plastic instanter link. John 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bigbee Line Posted March 20, 2018 Share Posted March 20, 2018 Things moved quickly over the day or so: Coupling is Dapol. I know these don't "work", but they do look good. Parkside only ever supply 3 link couplings and sometimes a plastic instanter link. John The Dapol Couplings do hang nicely. Just been to my secret store to get a set for a 10' wheelbase Minfit.. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin.a.ball Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 (edited) Hi John I'm also building the same kit and have just reached the stage of adding weight, pipes and sending to the paint shop. Excellent photos and very useful to help me finish off. Martin Edited March 21, 2018 by martin.a.ball Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 21, 2018 Author Share Posted March 21, 2018 Great to hear Martin. Glad this helps. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bigbee Line Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Things moved quickly over the day or so: P1010001-002.JPG P1010002-002.JPG Coupling is Dapol. I know these don't "work", but they do look good. Parkside only ever supply 3 link couplings and sometimes a plastic instanter link. John What paint is used for the bauxite? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Gristwood Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Great to hear Martin. Glad this helps. John Hello John, I too am just about to start building this kit. I was wondering if you or anyone else knows if this kit a suitable prototype to convert without too much effort to the type that replaced the end vent with an external duct. This type is described in 4mm Wagon (part 2) by Geoff Kent - pages 94-96. I think this type is shown in a photo of Mersey docks in the first photo in this topic? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/60700-is-this-doncaster-green/ I was thinking of building a second wagon, and having two wagons that aren't identical always adds to scene. Robin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 What paint is used for the bauxite? It's a concoction I mixed up Ernie. The van will be weathered so exact shades aren't important. Can't get proper paint shipped over here so I have to make do. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted March 22, 2018 Author Share Posted March 22, 2018 (edited) Hello John, I too am just about to start building this kit. I was wondering if you or anyone else knows if this kit a suitable prototype to convert without too much effort to the type that replaced the end vent with an external duct. This type is described in 4mm Wagon (part 2) by Geoff Kent - pages 94-96. I think this type is shown in a photo of Mersey docks in the first photo in this topic? http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/60700-is-this-doncaster-green/ I was thinking of building a second wagon, and having two wagons that aren't identical always adds to scene. Robin I think I know the picture you are referring to in Geoffs book (very useful set). Seems to me you could just add some Evergreen plastic strip. Worth understanding the use though - I don't recall if Geoff explains. I agree about different wagons. I don't think I have two the same, even my "standard" BR vans are all different. John Edit: Just had a look at Geoffs book as well as Essery's LMS Wagons. The ducted vans were built in 1946. The picture you refer to , that of M570075 is marked 10' WB and has 8 shoe clasp brakes. Geoff doesn't think it is 10', but comparing it to my van the end spring brackets are much closer to the buffer beam in the picture, so I think it is 10'. Definitely a challenge. Just to confuse the issue even further, the van you linked to appears to have 4 shoe brakes making it 9' WB. Slaters 7060A Underframe for 10' WB BR Shoc wagon might be a suitable stand in. John Edited March 24, 2018 by brossard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted April 3, 2018 Author Share Posted April 3, 2018 I got around to weathering the van today: You'll notice the Fyffes poster. I found it on Google, adjusted the size and printed on sticky address label. John 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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