Advice for someone thinking of starting modelling American

[Mike Boucher]

Micro layouts are described as "within four square feet"

 

I'm thinking... 2' x 2' O scale, with a fiddle stick to represent the rest of the world.

 

I'm convinced it's not only doable, but operationally viable.

I have built two 2'x2' modules (actually 30" deep, but 2' long, but its the right ballpark)  Not much room for anything other than a diorama.

 

The purpose was that my club had two members who had built modular layouts, and we wanted to combine them.  Problem was that one had 3.5" track centers, the other had 4" track centers.  This 2' was to convert between the track centers.  There were two, one for each end, and we made a 4' straight module for the opposite side of the layout.  (The modular layout was an oval)  and presto, we could combine them and make the layout 4' longer.

 

This is a simple diamond junction.  The structures are removed, but there's a tower (a.k.a. - signal box) closest to the diamond, the other two are a speeder shed (closest to the track) and another storage building

 

 

This is a gas station diorama.

 

 

The building looks like the "40's service station" seen here:  http://www.crusaderrail.com/bv-s.html (but mine is the "Flying A" version, not Mobil)  It has a full interior.

 

In O scale, 4 square feet is much better done as 4' x 1', IMHO.

 

[Talltim]

My advice for modelling American is to start thinking in American railroad terms, cars, trucks ties etc. It helps greatly when you are trying to research stuff

Edited April 12, 2018 by Talltim

[Jerry1975]

Hi Everyone.

 

Thanks for your replies, I have been very busy lately so not much time for modelling.

 

I am looking for something small and simple for the moment, Jacks plan looks good and i am thinking of doing something similar, I also like Selah fruit, my version would have to be slightley bigger.

 

I will do some more research, sketches etc soon.

 

Jerry.

[shortliner]

This is a gas station diorama.

 

20180412_141928_HDR.jpg

 

The building looks like the "40's service station" seen here:  http://www.crusaderrail.com/bv-s.html (but mine is the "Flying A" version, not Mobil)  It has a full interior.

 

Mike - your link is giving a http404 Not found

[Mike Boucher]

 

This is a gas station diorama.

 

20180412_141928_HDR.jpg

 

The building looks like the "40's service station" seen here:  http://www.crusaderrail.com/bv-s.html (but mine is the "Flying A" version, not Mobil)  It has a full interior.

 

Mike - your link is giving a http404 Not found

 

Weird.  When I follow the link, I get a 404.  When I copy the link text and paste into my browser, I see it.

 

But, just to be safe, I screen cap-ed the image:

 

[shortliner]

Thanks Mike - that is rather nice. Who understands the vagaries of the internetty-webby-thingies?

[Jerry1975]

That's a nice kit.

 

I have a fondness for tank wagons so maybe a small unloading siding could be incorporated into a micro layout.

 

Jerry.

[davefromacrossthepond]

Jerry,

 

If you are looking for a siding to unload tankers, you may want to try either Walters Interstate Oil

 

 

 

or Walthers McGraw Oil

 

 

For planning purposes, I believe walthers.com has "footprint" diagrams for many of their kits.

 

Dave

[shortliner]

This is the Logo for my multi-state, chemical conglomerate, Premier Chemicals (trading as PremChem) which operates in the South Eastern USA. This particular sign is for the entrance and fences of a gated area . The company has various divisions, such as Agricultural, Manufacturing, Petroleum, Confectionery, Drinks, Drilling, etc. If anyone wants to use the logo for their layouts, we will be delighted to open a branch as part of our expansion plans - so feel free to copy, resize and use.
There are various ways of unloading Tank Cars such as direct into road tankers - so that can be as simple as some pipes on a hard-standing alongside a siding , eliminating the need for tanks and becoming a minimal-space industry, that takes up no room or expense.
An excellent example of a multi-use siding for unloading boxcars,tankers, and hoppers can be found on Reinhards post here https://bigbluetrains.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=9554&start=90#p172186

Edited April 15, 2018 by shortliner

[F-UnitMad]

I read that sign as "Keep Premier Chemicals out!!", & was wondering either 'out of what?', or was it a sign from some 'Eco' protest group...??

 

D'oh!! Must try harder

[Allegheny1600]

That was exactly what I thought, Jordan!

Thanks for the offer though, Jack - could be just the job.

[shortliner]

Speaking of signs - I notice (whoops! PUN!) that we have quite a few layouts with scrapyards - so if anybody needs one (or several) - feel free to resize and use 

Edited April 15, 2018 by shortliner

[Jerry1975]

Hi Everyone.

 

Once again thanks for all of your replies.

 

I have been very busy but I have finally decided on a plan.

 

There will be a fuel tanker unloading siding and another siding for the loading/unloading of box cars and one more as a possible scrap metal siding.

 

Thanks to shortliner for the scrap signage.

 

I just need to find the time to build it now, as I have another layout to finish first.

 

Jerry.

[rogerfastlane]

Hi, I have also recently become hooked on US Railroads and there is a phenomenal amount of data available online for free. Most of the RR companies have dedicated enthusiast groups with free published data, photos and histories - as have specific locomotive, coach and freight car types. There are also great Kalmbach (and others') publications at reasonable prices documenting all eras of US Railroading available on Amazon Books - try to buy from UK sources or shipping + duty can make "cheap" books very expensive.  Youtube is an invaluable source of original railroad company, archive and enthusiast videos.

 

I have stuck with n gauge (n scale in the US?) because I already have UK experience in this gauge and think that the generally larger US freight cars, coaches, locos and trains need the extra room available in (nom) 2mm if running prototypical train lengths. 

 

Often you read of confused "scale" information, but if running HO no problem (?), but in "n" people often confuse the sizes, so US n scale (this should really be n gauge - eg 9mm track gauge) is 1:160th scale - the same as most European modelling, while UK is 1:148 scale, This means that for the same prototype, the UK model would be about 10% bigger than the US.  Of course few rolling stock models translate for use across the Atlantic so not really an issue. The US loading gauge is generally much bigger than in the UK so locos and rolling stock are much higher and wider there - obvious from the pre-war images of the Coronation Scot visit to the US vs the Royal Blue () - just to confuse the modeller!  

 

US Railroad models are available from a few suppers in the UK new and several second hand and the private vendors seem to do particularly good deals as US outline models appear to be a niche market (unless brass models that are very expensive everywhere), but if you go to ebay and use ebay.com as your search engine, you get full access to US vendors - often substantially cheaper than UK  but beware of the shipping and duty charges. I buy about 25% from the US and 75% from the UK - using the dotcom site for models or parts that I cannot easily get in the UK. Private US vendors seem as good or better than the UK and when I have had minor problems they have been very generous trying to resolve and had a few great conversations via  ebay with the vendors about the hobby and original railroad history.

 

I got into US modelling through reading about steam loco development in "The Steam Locomotive a History" by David Ross (Tempus Publishing) - incidentally, in my opinion  a very well written book  - and found out that American development is quite undervalued by most UK railway history writers while my photography interests were stimulated by O.Winston Link's images of the last steam on the Norfolk and Western. As I also like American blues & folk, these have a lot of railroad songs and sounds associated with them, as well as the railroads providing one of the main routes for people migrating from the South up to Chicago where the electric blues started.  Also a fan of noir movies, there are often great background shots or even parts of the story closely associated with railroads and they were filmed and used as plot drivers from Buster Keaton's "The General" (1926) to Hitchocks "Strangers on a Train" (1951) and more, so an endless supply of enjoyable historical source material contained in some compelling movies.

 

Although fascinated by the steam era, I can see the appeal - particularly of war-bonnet Santa-Fe - diesels and the different (for us) infrastructure, scenery and rolling stock. There were many more companies running in the US until much later in the day before Amtrak took over (compared to the big 4 & BR) so there is a massive range of options in terms of prototypes, although as some respondents  have already warned, a lot of model manufacturers just badge locos for different lines and often these are wrong in quite major detail features, so worth checking with the prototypes first to see if the railroad you want to model and buy-for is actually available and locos/rolling stock reasonably correct. 

 

Spares may be an issue for US prototype models in the UK, though Gaugemaster can get many parts you can often go direct to the manufacturers like Atlas, Bachmann etc via their websites and spares are often available though sell out quickly for old models and then become super expensive or just not available at all, so buying any second hand loco can be bit of a lottery. Kato do sell some parts direct from Japan and really set the standard for running quality, though some finishes look a little "plasicky" the detail is often very good . Model Power make very good models as well that have also gained a good reputation, while Rivarossi  can be quite cheap, look pretty good but the older motors were not that durable.

 

As the US market size is around 10x that of the UK and the level of disposable income is much higher in the USA, the number and range of models is amazing and the modelling standard can be phenomenal. Although I do tinker a bit I do use mainly RTR and do some repairs/refinishing and on that basis you can certainly get quickly hooked. Layout plans still in my head rather than on the baseboard due to imminent move - hope you get something running and enjoy the jump to American Railroading. 

 

 

 

 

[multivac]

Jerry, welcome to US Outline!!

 

If your locos look like this=

 

F is for UNIT...x 4 !!.jpg

 

 

and your track looks like this=

 

5348.1331879562.jpg

 

You can be my friend for life!!!

 

You can never have enough F-units & E-units. Goodness where was that picture taken. As for the track picture; if you tried to model track like that and make it work.

[multivac]

When making purchases from the USA does anyone have a legal way of reducing the shipping cost? Since the ending of surface mail the shipping cost has become quite significant; especially with heavy items like locos.

 

I suppose dealing with UK shops and ordering through them would  be a way.

Edited April 16, 2018 by multivac

[steve1]

Multivac,

 

You can get anything in the Walthers catalogue via a U.K. dealer like Model Junction. That way saves a lot of hassle.

 

It's just the smaller or more obscure stuff that you need to go for direct.

 

steve

Edited April 16, 2018 by steve1

[F-UnitMad]

You can never have enough F-units & E-units. Goodness where was that picture taken.

Illinois Railroad Museum.

 

As for the track picture; if you tried to model track like that and make it work.

One does one's best...

 

https://youtu.be/DwSLBjfbd2A

[Regularity]

That’s a confident engineer, travelling at that speed!

[Regularity]

Often you read of confused "scale" information

 

There iS, of courSe, one exception to thiS meSS...

[Nearholmer]

Did anyone mention car-floats?

 

In case not, they were, are indeed, real life ‘fiddle sticks’ in some places, barges carrying cars to otherwise isolated bits of railroad. Sometimes an island, sometimes a knot of tracks serving an industrial area. If I was to go US H0 again, I’d strongly consider using a car float or two instead of a FY for a small layout.

 

When I did spend a decade in US H0, c1986-96, I based my layout quite firmly on a real old-type shortline, The Belfast & Moosehead Lake, in Maine, but transplanted it to serve a different harbour town. The advantage of this only-slightly-freelancing was that it gave me industries, traffic patterns etc that were plausible. The big industry in the area in the 1950s was poultry raising, which gave the real shortline enough incoming traffic in grain to keep it going, and gave me the excuse to invent a slogan to put on the side of my grain elevators: “Our Business is Chicken Feed”. Feed elevators, by the way, are quite unlike those enormous elevators seen in pictures of the prairies, much less layout-dwarfing. The postcard photo below looks remarkably like my old layout.

[jjb1970]

Ah, American trains and water, a splendid combination! I did some work for the CG Railway once:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CG_Railway

 

Unlike European rail ferries which tended to operate short routes, the Banda Sea and Bali Sea operate a 900 mile route between Mobile and Coatzacoalcos. Ugly ships though, converted heavy lift ships. Converted twice, once to single deck rail ferry, then to twin deck rail ferry. The SE Asian names may give people a clue they're not US registered, since they operate an international route they're outside the Jones Act and thus do not have to be coastwise qualified, they were registered in Singapore when I did work for them.

[298]

Hi Everyone.

 

Thanks for your replies, I have been very busy lately so not much time for modelling.

 

I am looking for something small and simple for the moment, Jacks plan looks good and i am thinking of doing something similar, I also like Selah fruit, my version would have to be slightley bigger.

 

I will do some more research, sketches etc soon.

 

Jerry.

 

A bit later than I intended, but this is the trackplan with Selah Fruit Row but extended to suit an average four axle road unit and 50' Boxcar. If you allow 7.5" for each and sufficient clearance then the layout needs an extra 5" on the left side and 3" on the right and that is just the useable track area, adding room for scenery makes the layout about 3' in length.

 

[Jerry1975]

Hi Everyone.

 

Thanks for your replies.

 

I do like that postcard photo, giving me ideas.

 

Thanks 298 for the trackplan of Selah, it's a lovely little layout.

 

One question I have is, if you were to model a train ferry how would you go about simulating the boat leaving/arriving at the port/s?

 

Thanks again everyone.

 

Jerry.

[ianathompson]

Re car floats.

 

I thought they had all gone, but no!

 

Trains February edition covered the last one still serving New York and stated that it was expanding again.

 

Nice little yard at 65th Street which is easy to see on Google Earth.

 

Ian T