And I thought the Dublo Deltic was bad...

[Titan]

This effort by Triang of the prototype in the 1950's makes the Dublo effort look positively scale!

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Triang-Minic-Diesel-Loco-Flier-nr-Mint-Boxed-1950s/291177609619?hash=item43cb89b993:g:yTMAAOSwo8hTrCRw

 

And it is probably the first mass produced model of a Deltic too... 

[bertiedog]

But it was never intended to be anything but a toy.....not a model and not aimed at Railway Modellers. It is, however, a quite rare toy item.

Stephen

[Hroth]

Well, they say fruit flies like a banana.....

[Dunsignalling]

But it was never intended to be anything but a toy.....not a model and not aimed at Railway Modellers. It is, however, a quite rare toy item.

Stephen

And they clearly had no intention of passing it off as "Deltic", or they would have done it in blue rather than orange.

[Dunsignalling]

Well, they say fruit flies like a banana.....

That, at least, is in conformity with Tri-ang Railways products from the era!

Edited April 26, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[melmerby]

What is it that suggests it is Deltic?

Looks like a generic 1940s/50s double ended diesel.

Could be from anywhere and it is just a push along toy.

 

Keith

[Titan]

What is it that suggests it is Deltic?

Looks like a generic 1940s/50s double ended diesel.

Could be from anywhere and it is just a push along toy.

 

Keith

 

It is a long list, but here goes...

 

1. The symmetrical layout.

2. The engine air intake grill in the middle.

3. The engine room windows, albeit two each side rather than three and shown as grilles, but never less the same height as the engine intake grill

4. The round window in the drivers cab door.

5. The  twin windscreens

6. The slightly smaller cantrail grill next to the cab - this is the generator air intake on the prototype.

7. The traction motor air intakes on the noses, wider at the bottom than the top (albeit exaggerated)

8. The central headlight

9. The Co-Co wheel arrangement

10 Horns on the roof

 

Now some of those may be common to other diesels, but 2,3, and particularly 6 is unique to the prototype Deltic, and it can't all be coincidence...

 

I am sure there is plenty more if you look.

[Nearholmer]

I think the difference is that Triang made a toy inspired (if that's the right word) by a Deltic, which was fine, but HD attempted to make a coarse-scale model of a Deltic, which turned out badly, and must have embarrassed them by how poorly it compared with everything else they made.

 

We all have our 'off days'.

[kevinlms]

I think the difference is that Triang made a toy inspired (if that's the right word) by a Deltic, which was fine, but HD attempted to make a coarse-scale model of a Deltic, which turned out badly, and must have embarrassed them by how poorly it compared with everything else they made.

 

We all have our 'off days'.

When I first saw one in the metal, many years after they were released, I assumed that the Deltic was much earlier than the Class 20.

Very wrong.

[Edwin_m]

Anyone on here who's been forced by a small child to watch "Chuggington" with them will have seen a single ended but otherwise largely recognisable Deltic. 

[Nearholmer]

Long diesels and electrics are particularly challenging to get right in coarse scale, I think, especially ones with noses. To get them round tight curves, the obvious thing to do is shorten them, but unless done very cunningly, that messes up the proportions. Both JEP and Hornby (France) did a lot better with their 0 gauge items at roughly the same time as the HD Deltic, but they did is by going underscale in height as well as length, which HD could never have got away with.

 

Modern coarse scale makers seem to be going for scale length, and buyers have to overlook the huge centre-throw on tight curves, but the locos look good.

Edited April 26, 2018 by Nearholmer

[The Johnster]

When I first saw one in the metal, many years after they were released, I assumed that the Deltic was much earlier than the Class 20.

Very wrong.

 

The prototype 'Blue Deltic', on which the production D90xx series is closely based and as modelled in the Kitmaster plastic construction kit, dates to 1955 and came out before the class 20.

[kevinlms]

The prototype 'Blue Deltic', on which the production D90xx series is closely based and as modelled in the Kitmaster plastic construction kit, dates to 1955 and came out before the class 20.

I'm talking about the Dublo models.

[Titan]

I'm talking about the Dublo models.

 

The mistake Dublo made was producing a model before the real thing had been built. It seems to be a combination of prototype features and some of the artists impressions of the production run - notably the headboard holder. It is also why it was released in overall green, the livery for the real thing had yet to be decided.

 

Ex Triang Hornby almost made the same mistake with the class 58, although not to quite the same extent!

 

This Triang version was released in the Fifties, and if you wanted something that looked sleek and futuristic, then the Prototype Deltic was pretty much the only thing in the UK that fitted the bill for 'inspiration' shall we say!

Edited April 27, 2018 by Titan

[Nearholmer]

There was a rash of LMS Pacifics from BL and Hornby in 0, and Trix in 00/H0, c1938, and some of them were distinctly “off beam” because they were made in advance of the real things. In that case, HD were a bit slower out of the blocks and theirs didn’t make it until after WW2.

 

Easy to forget that there was no ‘nostalgia market’ for model trains until the 1960s. It was all about being bang up to date.

Edited April 27, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Nimbus]

Easy to forget that there was no ‘nostalgia market’ for model trains until the 1960s. It was all about being bang up to date.

I suspect that was almost discovered by accident when Tri-ang/Hornby introduced a version of Flying Scotsman in LNER livery, and must have found it sold well.

The initial catalogue announcement had shown only a BR liveried model. Around this time the LMS Society was dominant in the model press, and my teen-aged impression at the time was that serious modelling was synonymous with pre-nationalisation.

 

The Nim.

[Nearholmer]

I tend to date it to the Triang Rocket, Caledonian 123 etc. They caught the mood as old locos were being given a final fling on the national network, beeching was publishing, betjeman was wiffling on, Awdry wrote his anti-beeching story (Bulliver? Oliver?) etc. Nostalgia bit as steam went. The Flying Scotsman was a few years later

[Dunsignalling]

I suspect that was almost discovered by accident when Tri-ang/Hornby introduced a version of Flying Scotsman in LNER livery, and must have found it sold well.

The initial catalogue announcement had shown only a BR liveried model. Around this time the LMS Society was dominant in the model press, and my teen-aged impression at the time was that serious modelling was synonymous with pre-nationalisation.

 

The Nim.

But when Tri-ang Hornby first did FS in LNER green, wasn't that the livery it was currently carrying? That's presumably why they decided to do it.

 

The model was thus "bang up to date" - and all the more so when they later released the version with two tenders..........

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

I tend to date it to the Triang Rocket, Caledonian 123 etc. They caught the mood as old locos were being given a final fling on the national network, beeching was publishing, betjeman was wiffling on, Awdry wrote his anti-beeching story (Bulliver? Oliver?) etc. Nostalgia bit as steam went. The Flying Scotsman was a few years later

I never quite got why they did the Dean Single when they did, though.

 

The final fling (as we then thought) of "City of Truro" was fresh in people's memories and that should have made her a much more popular choice at the time.

 

John

Edited April 27, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[Titan]

I never quite got why they did the Dean Single when they did, though.

 

The final fling (as we then thought) of "City of Truro" was fresh in people's memories and that should have made her a much more popular choice at the time.

 

John

 

I think Triang were allergic to outside frames and cranks judging by their 08...

[melmerby]

I think Triang were allergic to outside frames and cranks judging by their 08...

The MR never put outside cranks on it's "Jinty" so the 08 "cheap as chips" didn't get them either!

 

Keith

[The Johnster]

I'm talking about the Dublo models.

 

Ah. Fair enough.

[Titan]

Both Dublo and Triang were very quick off the mark, introducing Diesel models about the same time as the real thing was introduced. I did not quite realise how early the Met-cam DMU was introduced. If they had made it the correct length it would have been longer than the Mk1 carriages they were producing at the time!

[brack]

I never quite got why they did the Dean Single when they did, though.

 

The final fling (as we then thought) of "City of Truro" was fresh in people's memories and that should have made her a much more popular choice at the time.

 

John

Was it not just a case of what else they could make on the CR Single chassis?

[BernardTPM]

Was it not just a case of what else they could make on the CR Single chassis?

The Dean Single came first, in 1961, the Caley in 1963, which is why the driving wheels are too big - they're right for the Dean Single.