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Photos of mixed trains / passenger trains with tail traffic, West Highland Mallaig Extension, blue diesel era


Sandpiper
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Not sure where best to put this so I'll put it here in the hope that anyone searching might find it. The topic of mixed trains on the Mallaig line in the diesel era comes up from time to time. The oil tanks are fairly well known but whilst searching for photos of the line recently I came across these two gems. In the spring and summer of 1987 fish traffic from Mallaig was briefly revived with the fish being carried in Interfrigo vans. I was under the impression that these always ran as a separate train but these two photos show the vans attached to the rear of passenger trains. Since they are both down trains maybe it was just a couple of empty vans being returned to Mallaig, but an interesting mixed train nonetheless.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/curly42/6404221831/

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/curly42/9733150406/

Edited by Sandpiper
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The wagons used were Interfrigo refrigerated vans like these.

 

http://www.railalbum.co.uk/railway-wagons/ferry/italy-interfrigo-van-1.htm

 

They weren't dedicated fish vans designed to be run in passenger trains (though I am happy to be corrected if they were in fact designed to be run in passenger trains).

Edited by Sandpiper
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Are these really mixed trains? Once upon a time fish vans and the like were passenger rated vehicles designed to be run in passenger trains.

 

Not really, no.  As I understand it, fitted vehicles like fish vans or NPCS attached to the back of passenger trains and braked to the engine were known as "tail traffic".  A proper mixed train might have a mix of fitted and unfitted stock behind the passenger coaches with a goods brake at the rear - examples can be seen in published pics of trains on the Dornoch or Killin branches.

 

HTH

 

Alasdair

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The intention of this thread was to draw these two photos to the attention of anyone who might be interested in them from a modelling point of view. I used the words mixed trains in the title, not as a technical term, but because I thought that would make it easier to find through searching. They may or may not technically be mixed trains but that wasn't the point of the thread. The point of the thread is that they are interesting short trains formed of a mixture of passenger and freight stock that may be of interest to people modelling the railways of the Scottish Highlands.

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Thanks for posting the links Sandpiper. 

 

I'd love to see some photos of the trial of containerised fish traffic that was carried from Mallaig on PFA wagons that David Ratcliffe mentioned in a Rail Express magazine some years ago - anyone have a link to some pictures?

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Nice. A Lima 37, a couple of Mk1s from wherever, a Dapol (Ex-Airfix) Interfrigo van kit or two and presto, an interesting, economical and scale-length late Blue era train that will fit on an 8x4 or similar sized layout :).

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I have seen picture of a 37 with steel bolster wagons as tail traffic on a passenger train on the Mallaig line. The caption said that the steel load was for some harbour works. I remember being surprised that there was no barrier wagons between the loaded wagons and the coaches.

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I was too late to see the Interfrigo wagons in use on the Mallaig line, but I did photograph them when they were stored in Mallaig Junction Yard, Fort William, in September 1987.

 

Interfrigo_Ft-William-1_9-87.jpg.ea9b55c4bff458f30778c34a907568cf.jpg

 

Interfrigo_Ft-William-2_9-87.jpg.850cca17be18d294bead6e6569ce4d3e.jpg

 

Interfrigo_Ft-William-3_9-87.jpg.8d43abf5e45681310d2a1057a3101f4f.jpg

 

David

 

Edited by Kylestrome
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How long did those InterFrigo vans operate for on the West Highland? Was it domestic traffic? Looking at the markings they were still registered as FS (Ferrovie dello Stato, Italy) when stored in Fort William.

 

They are currently available RTR in HO from ACME.

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How long did those InterFrigo vans operate for on the West Highland? Was it domestic traffic? Looking at the markings they were still registered as FS (Ferrovie dello Stato, Italy) when stored in Fort William.

 

They are currently available RTR in HO from ACME.

It was fish traffic to a processing plant in Grimsby, IIRC. It didn't last more than a few months, I believe; whether this was because the trials were unsuccessful, or because the season for the particular type of fish had finished, I wouldn't know.

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  • 1 year later...

Just dug up this topic as I was looking at these wagons. I have picked up Electrotrens version to see what can be done with it. 

 

I'm thinking about a splice down the Centreline to beef it out and the same with the chassis. Hopefully making it a bit wider means that when I fill in between the body sides and the roof the roof will get lifted a bit.

 

I could seal up the sliding doors too.

 

:unsure:

 

 

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On 09/06/2019 at 17:56, Strathyre said:

These are mixed trains - a mix of passenger and freight vehicles in one train consist. 

Sorry, this is wrong. As explained above a mixed train consisted of fitted vehicles and unfitted freight stock and therefore needed a brake van. If all the vehicles are fitted and the brakes were connected it wasn't a mixed train.

Edited by JeremyC
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I think a more common working was a couple of oil tanks on the back of a passenger train. I've seen a photo in a book of such a train on the Mallaig line hauled by a class 20 (the then Fort William pilot). I've never seen any evidence that these "mixed" workings ever extended south of Fort William.

Strictly speaking, wagons added to passenger trains had to be "passenger rated" and would be marked XP. Not sure any oil tanks were so marked in earlier years when that rule applied, but fish vans (and other vans, for that matter) often were.

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On 01/05/2018 at 17:25, John M Upton said:

Nice, I like that a lot!

 

What options are there for these vans in N scale?

Hi John,

 

Options in any scale are limited.

 

For N - the nearest is the Trix/Rivarossi/Atlas/Arnold interfrigo van.

 

It's the wrong sort for the UK but it's all that is available.

 

However, this is one of the wagons I hope to do with my cutter, but it's a fair way down the list!

 

Thanks

Phil H

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On 12/06/2019 at 11:24, JeremyC said:

Sorry, this is wrong. As explained above a mixed train consisted of fitted vehicles and unfitted freight stock and therefore needed a brake van. If all the vehicles are fitted and the brakes were connected it wasn't a mixed train.

I'm afraid you're confusing train consist with train classification in relation to the fitment, or otherwise of continuous braking. The class of train varies from class 4 to class 9 in respect of the degree of braking available to the train crew, from Fully Fitted (class 1, 2 & 3), 90% fitted (class 4) through to unfitted (class 9). Class Numbers lower than that are fully fitted, as shown below.

 

Train classes

 

1        Express passenger, newspaper, or breakdown train; express diesel car; snow plough on duty; light engine proceeding to assist disabled train.

2        Ordinary passenger, branch passenger or "mixed" train; rail motor (loaded or empty); ordinary passenger or parcels diesel car; breakdown train not on duty.

3        Parcels, fish, fruit, livestock, milk or other perishable train composed entirely of vehicles conforming to coaching stock requirements; empty coaching stock (not specially authorised to carry Class A [sic] code).

4        Express freight, livestock, perishable or ballast train pipe-fitted throughout with the automatic vacuum brake operative on 90 per cent of the vehicles.

5        Express freight, livestock, perishable or ballast train with not less than 50 per cent vacuum braked vehicles piped to the engine.

6        Express freight, livestock, perishable or ballast train with 20 per cent vacuum braked vehicles piped to the engine.

7        Express freight, livestock, or ballast train not fitted with continuous brake.

8        Through freight or ballast trains not running under C, D, E or F [sic] conditions.

9        Mineral or empty wagon train.

 

The term 'Mixed Train' specifically relates to the consist itself and specifically the mixing of passenger carrying vehicles and goods carrying vehicles.

 

Attached are some photographs of the relevant section of the LNER 1937 General Appendix which I hope clarifies matters.

 

As an aside, when I joined the railway in 1979, on the Scottish region, the only mixd trains I was aware of that were running in regular service were on the Mallaig extension, such as the ones in the original post. It would be possible for unfitted (goods) vehicles to be conveyed in the mixed train but this would necessitate them being marshaled behind the braked portion of the train and, should that happen, a brake van would be attached to the rear, with a second guard on board as necessary.

 

Hope this helps

 

Paul

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Edited by Strathyre
Inserting classification list off trains
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  • 2 weeks later...
59 minutes ago, duncan said:

yes Keefer, that's the one,  but can't find the photo of it hiding under the canopy at Inverness

TOPS-coded FJB, they had been converted from FGA flats by fitting a second headstock and buffing gear. They worked from Aberdeen on a freight service, befroe they were coupled to a passenger service to the Far North. I don't think they were for Tesco traffic, but ran on behalf of a ferry company serving Orkney and Shetland.

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Pic of one at Elgin in 1984: https://www.flickr.com/photos/47209/5862882594

In the comments there is a link to a thread on Fort William (Old), in which i replied about the container flat but had completely forgotten about! https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/71982-fort-william-old-station-1970-1975/&do=findComment&comment=1049496

In my reply i further linked to another pic of the wagon:  https://www.flickr.com/photos/25691226@N07/6061318777/

EDIT: b/w shots of same train

https://www.flickr.com/photos/jjm2009/8179322785

https://www.flickr.com/photos/jjm2009/8179354092/in/photostream/

(btw, still haven't found the pic i was looking for which is probably the one Duncan mentions)

 

Edited by keefer
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