Traincontroller vs i-train

[LlandudnoJunction]

Hi All

 

Would like to start of a conversation about the 2 products on sale at the moment for controlling your model layouts. I am looking at the pros / cons between "Traincontroller" vs "i-Train" as I will be looking to buy one of them.

 

Traincontroller

 

Pros for

1) Great looking application (like windows excel)

2) Lots of features built in (but negative you need gold)

3) Easy to understand and learn

4) Compatiable with most DCC systems (except Gaugemaster to name one)

5) Reliable control of your layout

 

Cons against

1) Cost vs Features (Gold is a small fortune)

2) Only designed for Windows no i-MAC software

3) No free version upgrades

4) Additional software / license required to use a walk around controller (more cost)

5) Problem / Help support is limited

 

i-Train

 

Pros for

1) High level of compatiability with most systems (only a few not compatiable eg Gaugemaster)

2) Software can be used on Windows or Apple systems or Linux

3) Free use of all features for 2 months

4) Cost for standard level license allows full automation of your layout (gold needed with Traincontroller)

5) Nice looking apple / i-MAC application

 

Cons against

1) Hard to understand / learn (manual is not user friendly)

2) Free upgrades to your purchased version but other versions require more payments

3) Designed mainly for European train layout (Signals etc)

4) Technical support is through a forum

5) Dose not have buldings or stations preloaded have to create yourself

 

So question to people who already use these can you suggest more pros / cons about both software and also their limitations would be a great help plus if you was to start over again would you still pick that software or look at something else?

 

Cheers

Mark

[WIMorrison]

Hi there,

I am an iTrain user and have also looked at TrainController in depth and was considering swapping to TC9, but now I am not and I will stick with iTrain.

What I don’t know is what you want to get out of the system as both will runs trains very well, both support automatic and manual routing, both offer macro capabilities and neither is limited on what you can control but, and this is the big but for me I find the interface of TC9 rather old and a bit clunky, I also find that in many cases illogical where the new version of iTrain 4.1 has a very clean and easy to negotiate interface. I will say though that you will have to buy the gold version of TC9 to achieve anything useful - the limitations on the lower versions are significant - a quick glance at the manual will show you that all the useful functions are only in Gold - highlighted by the gold bar down the side, whereas the stand edition of iTrain (what I use) has everything that I need 

There are drawbacks ITrain since it doesn’t have all the capabilities within TC9, as example, it doesn’t support the use of variables or HTML scripting but in most respects, I find it much easier to use.

The support through the English forum is generally good, the support in Dutch and German is even better and in UK if you buy through James at http://dcctrainautomation.co.uk/ then you will get excellent 1 to 1 support where he takes remote control and sorts the issues out for you! He also runs courses on iTrain in his premises, again well worth the £70 for the day. The TC9 support is similarly through a forum and is at a similar level to that provided for iTrain.

Please ping me a pm if you want to chat on the phone and I can tell you more about TC9 than I am willing to put here and explain a couple of reasons why I have chosen iTrain which may influence your decision

 

Edited to clarify I was talking about TC9 Gold as iTrain doesn't have a Gold edition

Edited June 24, 2018 by WIMorrison

[fcwilt]

Hi,

 

I currently use TC v9 GOLD and have been a user since v7.

 

IMO it is the best there is. Yes it can appear to be expensive but if you consider how much you have invested in model railroading, the price of TC may seem more affordable. I have locos that cost more than TC.

 

There is a forum for TC with top notch help. The manual is good as well.

 

Frederick

[LlandudnoJunction]

Many thanks Iain and Frederick for your reply pots as it sure is a big help to me but also a great topic to discuss.

 

Cheers

Mark

[Andymsa]

Hi mark,

 

I'm not sure about I-train, but with TC a user has created a vast set of videos the really explains some of the features of TC.

 

Point 3 of your cons for TC is not quite correct, often upgrades are posted with the version these are free but upgrades between version have to be paid for. But to be fair if you want a developer to speed time on solving issues and making product better I can live with paying for upgrade.

 

One thing I don't really like about TC is the USB licence key as if it gets lost you would have to buy it again. What I don't know is would this be at full cost.

 

I did look at i-train but didn't find it intuitive. Where TC you don't need to look at manual for basic stuff. Also there is the ability to import various own made images into it

 

Overall I feel TC has the edge, but it does come in various forms but not as with much functionality in the lower versions.

 

Andy

[fcwilt]

Many thanks Iain and Frederick for your reply pots as it sure is a big help to me but also a great topic to discuss.

 

Cheers

Mark

Hi Mark,

 

If you have any other questions feel free to ask.

 

My layout is fully automated. Naturally it has occupancy sensing and turnout control as they are required. But I also have signals (just because I like the look), electromagnetic uncouplers, a customized Walthers DCC turntable, fascia mounted keypads for turnout/uncoupler control and a few other features.

 

One feature of TC sometimes overlooked is the ability to mix manual train control and computer control allowing me to run a way freight, doing switching operations, while the computer runs "through" trains from/to the staging yard.

 

Frederick

Edited June 22, 2018 by fcwilt

[Alan Kettlewell]

Hi Mark,

 

I don't know iTrain but I've been a keen Train Controller (Gold) user since 2004.  It is an expensive initial outlay and yes there are major version changes to pay for if you want to keep it up to date (you don't have to).  I'd guesstimate that in 14 years I've spent about £1000 on the programme(s) including the upgrades so equating to an average of around £70 odd a year.

 

However I believe it to be the best there is out there as it provides almost limitless automatic operatonal features - it seems to me there's nothing it can't do and the options are only limited by the imaginaton.  Even as an experienced and long time user, there are still a whole raft of features I haven't explored yet.  Now it's an integral part of my model railway world and I wouldn't do without it.

 

In addition there are other 'add on' programmes eg Train Programmer for simple on-screen DCC chip setting,  Train Animator where you can design your own loco sound projects which works superbly with their amazing '+4D Sound' software programme.  Again though, these add ons have to be purchased but as a suite of programmes working together they take railway modelling to another dimension.  

 

My layout (link in the signature area below) is fully automated running about 30 trains.  Some of the locos are linked with their own sound project - that is, no on board sound chip but authentic loco sounds played through a 5.1 sound system which is fitted around my layout room - the clever software makes the sound 'follow' the loco around the layout.  The sound quality has to heard to be appreciated.  This is acheived by clever interaction between 'train tracking' in Train Controller, use of Train Animator where the sound project is made and stored, and the +4D Sound Software.    

 

Just my completely biased view ..lol, but I hope something there for you to ponder over.

 

Cheers ... Alan 

[richard brown]

I have been a Traincontrol user but I did not use it for 2 version updates due to family issues and was told that I would need to pay almost the same as a full licences for the upgrade and why am I complain about it also it doesn't support the car system I am using for moving cars which has been promised so I am looking at Itrain which dose has UK support in the hands of DCC train Automation which is the UK Reseller of ITrain and offer classes on using it. I will say Train control is good software but I can't use my current DCC system with my version train control and looking at the cost of getting my self working again I think Itrain is the way to go for me.

 

Richard  

[LlandudnoJunction]

Thank you Alan and Richard for your feedback about train controller. I must admit I do like to look of both software packages, so its not a easy decision for me as I want to make the right choice for me. One thing which Iain showed me in his video about his layout using itrain is how easy it was to set up your blocks and run schedule routes and also give commands to other trains to run manually (cheers Iain).

 

My mind is swaying to itrain, mainly because I found a clip on youtube, which Andy from "calling all stations" gives a great introduction to itrain. The bonus, if I heared him correctly is that after your 2 months evaluation of itrain, you just loose the ability to control no more than 3 trains on a schedule. (Which is great if its true).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGNg5uMI6CY

 

This would really help with my costs as I could spend more money on turnout controls, signals and uncoupling as I also have to change my DCC controller from my gaugemaster prodigy advance to somthing else (Lenz, Z21 or DR5000). My layout is a small one in my study which is an end terminus using cassette loading of trains and a single TMD working shed / refueling point. (see attachment)

 

 

Cheers

Mark

[WIMorrison]

Mark

 

You have seen the size and plan for my layout for comparison and looking at your plan I would suggest that the simple economics, if nothing else, will sway you towards one product rather than the other

 

I have absolutely no doubt that iTrain Standard will handle your layout (that is what I use) and it is possible depending on what you want that iTrain Lite would meet your needs - however even if you started with Lite (after the 2 or 3 month trial) then found that you wanted the 100% automatic control gained in Standard (where I train calculates and runs routes, as opposed to you defining routes) then you can upgrade to Standard for the difference in licence cost without any additional premium.

 

My investigation and comparison suggest that TC9 Gold was required to provide the same functionality ‘out of the box’ as iTrain Standard. It was shown to me that many of the TC9 Gold functions could be achieved in TC9 Silver however they were work-arounds to get over the licence limitations requiring expert knowledge and for me the significant additional cost of TC9 Gold over iTrain Standard swung it for me.

Edited June 26, 2018 by WIMorrison

[Andymsa]

Is it possible in i-train to have the locomotive image displayed in the block on the switchboard

 

Andy

[WIMorrison]

No, it dois ant do that - but I should say that when I tried that in TC9 the quality was very poor (they have their own image format, which is a pain to use) and consequently I switched it off.

 

ITrain does support good quality images in the throttles and rostering panels though.

[Andymsa]

Hi Iain

 

Thanks for the info, was thinking of trying I-train. But as a traincontroller user I stay with it for now as I like the image to show in a block. Also you can see what train has reserved the route on the switchboard. As to the images yes there not photographic in quality but I like the way you can see at a glance what train is where on the layout

 

Andy

Edited June 26, 2018 by Andymsa

[tender]

Thank you Alan and Richard for your feedback about train controller. I must admit I do like to look of both software packages, so its not a easy decision for me as I want to make the right choice for me. One thing which Iain showed me in his video about his layout using itrain is how easy it was to set up your blocks and run schedule routes and also give commands to other trains to run manually (cheers Iain).

 

My mind is swaying to itrain, mainly because I found a clip on youtube, which Andy from "calling all stations" gives a great introduction to itrain. The bonus, if I heared him correctly is that after your 2 months evaluation of itrain, you just loose the ability to control no more than 3 trains on a schedule. (Which is great if its true).

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGNg5uMI6CY

 

This would really help with my costs as I could spend more money on turnout controls, signals and uncoupling as I also have to change my DCC controller from my gaugemaster prodigy advance to somthing else (Lenz, Z21 or DR5000). My layout is a small one in my study which is an end terminus using cassette loading of trains and a single TMD working shed / refueling point. (see attachment)

 

 

 

Cheers

Mark

 

With a layout this size you could probably get away with TC Silver if you want to go the TC route. My layout is about twice that size and fully automated with TC Silver. Yes there are a few things in Gold which would be nice to have and make things a bit easier but there are quite a few workarounds that can be done in Silver to get the same effect as in Gold and save yourself a bundle.

[Edwin_m]

I would suggest thinking very carefully before getting TrainController in conjunction with Lenz .  Unless it's changed recently, TC won't track the locations of trains being driven by other handsets, unless they are manually assigned via TC, which appears to be a pain.  I've not done much running of trains recently but I think just assigning all the trains to manual control puts a lot of load on the system as it has to keep asking specifically for any activity on each train rather than the command station notifying it when something happens.  Other software seems to have found a way round this, although I don't recall exactly how, but Freiwald considers it is something for Lenz to sort out and as we all know Lenz has done very little on product upgrades recently. 

 

This was as of some years back but I'm not aware anything has changed since (but would be glad to hear if it has). 

[RFS]

I would suggest thinking very carefully before getting TrainController in conjunction with Lenz .  Unless it's changed recently, TC won't track the locations of trains being driven by other handsets, unless they are manually assigned via TC, which appears to be a pain.  I've not done much running of trains recently but I think just assigning all the trains to manual control puts a lot of load on the system as it has to keep asking specifically for any activity on each train rather than the command station notifying it when something happens.  Other software seems to have found a way round this, although I don't recall exactly how, but Freiwald considers it is something for Lenz to sort out and as we all know Lenz has done very little on product upgrades recently. 

 

This was as of some years back but I'm not aware anything has changed since (but would be glad to hear if it has). 

 

The Lenz version 4.0 software, being released later this year with the LZV200, resolves this issue. Existing LZV100s can be upgraded but no details have been released yet.  I know Lenz have said "this year" many times since the LZV200 was first announced many years ago, but I get the feeling they mean it this time....

Edited June 26, 2018 by RFS

[WIMorrison]

Luckily iTrain fully supports manual operation via a handset or onscreen, it is especially useful with a Multimaus as it will support the wireless Multimaus through iTrain simply by ticking a box if you don’t have the Multimaus connected to your DCC through your command station.

 

Another plus point

[fcwilt]

Hi,

 

TC also supports manual control including running of TC Schedules. In this mode TC controls the turnouts and signals but you control the throttle. There are options to allow you to ignore all signals or have TC enforce them preventing you from overrunning a red signal.

 

It was remarked that the images in TC were not so good.

 

Here is what they look like on my system. They seem fine to me.

 

Frederick

Edited June 29, 2018 by fcwilt

[Bucoops]

I'm way off needing it yet, but I looked at TC a little while back. It's frustrating that to use a turntable properly you instantly HAVE to have the Gold version. For my planned layout I could get away with Bronze but would prefer Silver. Except I need a turntable...

 

I'll have a look at i-train.

[WIMorrison]

James@dcctrainautomation.co.uk has a turntable working perfectly on a demonstration layout using iTrain

[Wogga]

Coming to this late, I am a lapsed modeller, life doesn’t allow me time. below is a link to a video I made which is how far I got with TC. It’s a demo that shows the “basic” capability of TC. For me it is simply is the best. I have the Railroad and Co Gold v7 usb dongle but I don’t think I can sell it secondhand perhaps I need to ask Herr Freiwald.

 

[WIMorrison]

You only purchase a licence to use the product - not the actual product - it is the same as any other licence, though most people unfortunately don't appreciate this subtly of computer programmes.

 

What this means is that it isn't like a car which you can sell easily as you own it, you only own a licence which is created for you - another person would need a new licence - and given my limited dealing with Herr Friewald I would hold out a lot hope in him allowing reassignment of the licence.

[john dew]

Hi Pete

 

Its great to hear from you again.I did a double take when I saw a “Wogga” notification....you have been missed. Sorry to hear that you no longer have time to play trains. I used to enjoy our chats.

 

Best wishes

 

John

[Alan Kettlewell]

Coming to this late, I am a lapsed modeller, life doesn’t allow me time. below is a link to a video I made which is how far I got with TC. It’s a demo that shows the “basic” capability of TC. For me it is simply is the best. I have the Railroad and Co Gold v7 usb dongle but I don’t think I can sell it secondhand perhaps I need to ask Herr Freiwald.

https://youtu.be/qzsQhopIvwQ

I'm sure you can't sell on a TC licence (it'll be in the licence agreement somewhere), even if you could the new owner would not be able to make any upgrades as the name, email address and licence wouldn't match. For me that would be sufficient reason not to buy a second hand licence.

 

I'd keep it anyway, because if in future you find yourself in position to resume modelling, then it would be much cheaper to upgrade to the latest version (if you wanted to) than buying a new licence.

 

I Hope you get back into it.

 

Cheers ... Alan

[Andymsa]

With I-train can you have the icon of a loco on the track plan, as with Traincontroller you can do this ?