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Hattons Andrew Barclay Motor/Drive Question





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#1 chuffinghell

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Posted 10 July 2018 - 13:35

My Andrew Barclay runs beautifully

 

However, I've noticed that in DC with the controller set to the same position the loco runs much faster in reverse than it does going forwards

 

Just wondered if anyone else has experienced this and if it is normal

 

Chris


Edited by chuffinghell, 10 July 2018 - 13:35 .




#2 DavidCBroad

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 01:06

Strange question, have you tried turning it round physically instead of just switching the controller reverse switch from forward to to reverse to eliminate the controller being the cause of the issue.

 

The old locos used to do this all the time, Most were arranged to be freer running forwards than backwards as pick up springs worked against worm drive side thrust instead of working with it, but Hornby Halls/ B12 used to be faster backwards as the they had a better thrust bearing at the back.  

 

I use H&M Variable Transformers or Morley controllers which vary the voltage and find almost everything (except Hornby 42XX) goes the same speed at the same controller setting albeit at greatly different amps, which makes double heading and banking practical.


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#3 Dunsignalling

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 02:13

My Andrew Barclay runs beautifully

 

However, I've noticed that in DC with the controller set to the same position the loco runs much faster in reverse than it does going forwards

 

Just wondered if anyone else has experienced this and if it is normal

 

Chris

Mine was the same to begin with, but after half-an-hour running each way on the rolling road, its pretty much even now. My P was similar. I suspect it's a case of getting the lubricant evenly distributed around the gear train.

 

A lot of these locos will be purchased for use on "shunting planks" and without a rolling road or a circle of set track, they'll never get properly run-in.

 

Even later on, the running of many locos (big and small) tends to deteriorate unless they get an occasional canter away from the terminus-fiddle yard shuttle. 

 

John


Edited by Dunsignalling, 12 July 2018 - 02:23 .

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#4 SRman

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 02:43

With so many moving and meshing parts, it is possible for there to be differences in each direction. If the axles move back and forth even slightly, the amount of friction could vary, the gears may have slightly different meshing patterns on each side of the teeth, and so on. With a good deal of running in both directions, one would expect these things to even out eventually, as John suggested above; the lubrication becomes better distributed and the gears wear in to better mesh.

Going back to the original post, it used to be very common for things to run better one way than the other. This was particularly noticeable with 'single-ended' items that are run in one direction far more than the other (express steam locos would be the classic example of this). Even with double-ended items it could be noticeable though - my preference with the old Triang diesels (class 31 for example) and electrics (EM2) was to run them with the motor bogie trailing, so they always tended to run better in that direction because they hadn't been run-in (worn-in??) in the other direction.


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#5 chuffinghell

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 09:54

Strange question, have you tried turning it round physically instead of just switching the controller reverse switch from forward to to reverse to eliminate the controller being the cause of the issue.

Not a strange question at all

Yeah I had tried that and the results were same, I also tried a different controller and also a 9v battery.

Mine was the same to begin with, but after half-an-hour running each way on the rolling road, its pretty much even now. My P was similar. I suspect it's a case of getting the lubricant evenly distributed around the gear train.

A lot of these locos will be purchased for use on "shunting planks" and without a rolling road or a circle of set track, they'll never get properly run-in.

Even later on, the running of many locos (big and small) tends to deteriorate unless they get an occasional canter away from the terminus-fiddle yard shuttle.

John

I applied a little more lubricant and left her running on the rolling road for a further half an hour forwards and she seems a lot better now

I have a dedicated programming and testing unit I've built and always 'run-in' on the rolling road and test slow speed running on the track, given myself the flexibility to be able to test/run-in in either DC or DCC

Many thanks to those who have replied

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Edited by chuffinghell, 12 July 2018 - 10:22 .

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#6 DavidCBroad

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 11:02

 

A lot of these locos will be purchased for use on "shunting planks" and without a rolling road or a circle of set track, they'll never get properly run-in.

 

Even later on, the running of many locos (big and small) tends to deteriorate unless they get an occasional canter away from the terminus-fiddle yard shuttle. 

 

John

Good point, not just shunting plank and end to end either, some locos can spend years shunting a yard on a continuous run without getting  decent run out,

My Farish 94XX has spent the last 30 odd years working hard pulling 6/7/8 coach rakes out of platforms and shoving them back into an adjacent road.  Every now and again it gets sluggish so when no one is looking I give it a blast round the main line.

The GWR used to give some of the Swindon Works shunting locos a run on the workmen's trains to Cirencester, Purton, Highworth etc before starting shunting, and they based the Bridgwater docks shunter at Taunton so it had a good gallop along he GW main line  first thing in the morning trying to keep out of the way of the through traffic.  There are reports of the old Cardiff Rly 0-4-0ST being driven flat out light engine at 30 mph or more.  1361 0-6-0ST s also worked this turn at times.


Edited by DavidCBroad, 12 July 2018 - 11:19 .

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#7 alfsboy

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 11:25

Good point, not just shunting plank and end to end either, some locos can spend years shunting a yard on a continuous run without getting  decent run out,

My Farish 94XX has spent the last 30 odd years working hard pulling 6/7/8 coach rakes out of platforms and shoving them back into an adjacent road.  Every now and again it gets sluggish so when no one is looking I give it a blast round the main line.

The GWR used to give some of the Swindon Works shunting locos a run on the workmen's trains to Cirencester, Purton, Highworth etc before starting shunting, and they based the Bridgwater docks shunter at Taunton so it had a good gallop along he GW main line  first thing in the morning trying to keep out of the way of the through traffic.  There are reports of the old Cardiff Rly 0-4-0ST being driven flat out light engine at 30 mph or more.  1361 0-6-0ST s also worked this turn at times.

wE used to do the same in the 60's when i worked for motorcycle shop .In would come a Honda 50 or Lambretta  used by a commuter  couching and spluttering  and going very slowly .We used to take them for a spin down teh Southend road flat out and that blew the cobwebs away .One i remember  was very slow and suddenly did a huge bang  and  rocketed off.It was hilarious .We also use  new  Honda 50 ( 3 in a crate) as a mini scrambler round our course built in the yard.Then we assembled all the gubbins that came in the crate like leg shields .


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#8 RAFHAAA96

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Posted 14 July 2018 - 08:44

Staying off topic for a bit.
Honda 50 step thru. I remember mine well, run on a shoe string and flat out most of its life.
To maximise life I would turn the back sprocket over once it had hooked its teeth to wear it out the other way.
The auto-clutch also wore out and would stick engaged so stopping and starting was an art - kicking it in and out of gear at the precise moment.

Back on topic.
As hinted at previously the controller could be pushing out a different voltage in each direction for the same speed setting, else its down to gear lash wind up.
Rob

Edited by RAFHAAA96, 14 July 2018 - 08:47 .