Brill Branch Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Hi, I've just starting building a 16" Hunslet (or 2!) from a Centre Models whitemetal kit. I'm planning to use an RT Models J94/Austerity chassis. It will need some trimming but the major dimensions (i.e. the wheel centres) are correct for the 16", I think, based on a GA drawing from Railway Modeller September 1972 which shows wheel centres of 5' 3" & 5' 9" (11' overall). However, I also plan to build an Impetus kit for a 16" Hunslet and one for a 15" Hunslet, and also have another Impetus chassis. The chassis etches are marked "S12", "S13" and "S21" (although the last, with the rest of the text, is etched reversed and I was not aware Impetus went up to S21 - but its not "S12" as it has different dimensions to the one marked "S12"). This has added a whole set of confusion for me. All these have different spacing and/or wheelbase, even the one for the 16" when compared to the information above. Also, from the RM article, above, the 16" has 3' 9" wheels (12 spoke, although instructions suggest 10 spoke as that is what is available). But I am unsure of the 15" wheels. The Impetus instructions suggest 3' 7" 10 spoke. Can anyone confirm this? Can anyone help and point me to a GA drawing (or just confirmation) for the wheelbase and wheel diameter for the Hunslet 15"? Many thanks Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 (edited) Hi, I've just starting building a 16" Hunslet (or 2!) from a Centre Models whitemetal kit. I'm planning to use an RT Models J94/Austerity chassis. It will need some trimming but the major dimensions (i.e. the wheel centres) are correct for the 16", I think, based on a GA drawing from Railway Modeller September 1972 which shows wheel centres of 5' 3" & 5' 9" (11' overall). However, I also plan to build an Impetus kit for a 16" Hunslet and one for a 15" Hunslet, and also have another Impetus chassis. The chassis etches are marked "S12", "S13" and "S21" (although the last, with the rest of the text, is etched reversed and I was not aware Impetus went up to S21 - but its not "S12" as it has different dimensions to the one marked "S12"). This has added a whole set of confusion for me. All these have different spacing and/or wheelbase, even the one for the 16" when compared to the information above. Also, from the RM article, above, the 16" has 3' 9" wheels (12 spoke, although instructions suggest 10 spoke as that is what is available). But I am unsure of the 15" wheels. The Impetus instructions suggest 3' 7" 10 spoke. Can anyone confirm this? Can anyone help and point me to a GA drawing (or just confirmation) for the wheelbase and wheel diameter for the Hunslet 15"? Many thanks Roger Hi Roger, I have both a Impetus and Judith Edge 16" kits you mention. Wheels for the 16" - I use Alan Gibson 3'9" 12 spoke - product code 4844P - these are as close as you can get. Chassis for the Centre Models 16" - I'd have a chat with Mike Edge - he might be able to supply you with a 16" chassis - there will be a fair bit of trimming to make the RT models 18" fit (length, depth and curving on the ends). I can confirm that I have a Impetus 16" and its chassis is etched in reverse "S21 Hunslet 16" 0-6-0ST" Hope that helps - don't have a 15" to hand. J Edited July 15, 2018 by Down_Under Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brill Branch Posted July 15, 2018 Author Share Posted July 15, 2018 Hi, I must have missed the Gibson wheels, I thought I'd looked, but I follow up on that, many thanks. That does confirm the Impetus chassis etch and clears up the outstanding questions I had on the 16" (for now at least!). Hopefully someone can help me with information on the Hunslet 15" which seems scarcer. many thanks again. Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiptonian Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Hunslet 15" has 3' 7" 10 spoke wheels on 5' 0" + 4' 6" wheelbase. There is an article and a basic drawing in Model Railway Constructor September 1986. Hope this helps. -Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Hunslet 15" has 3' 7" 10 spoke wheels on 5' 0" + 4' 6" wheelbase. There is an article and a basic drawing in Model Railway Constructor September 1986. Hope this helps. -Al. Can confirm these dimensions having measured my three 15 inch locos in 7mm. All from different kits. The wheels are 10 spoke 3'7''. I hadnt realised that the 16 inch does share its wheelbase with the 50550 and austerity locos despite having built six in total. The austerity wheels are much larger and therefore pitched lower in the frames. Good luck and welcome to the addictive world of hunslets. Like beers, you can't have just the one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Just a thought had you particular examples in mind? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brill Branch Posted July 15, 2018 Author Share Posted July 15, 2018 Guys, thanks for that. Very helpful confirmation. It means the Impetus 15" chassis is also correct. You kind of hope it is but a number of books/references that I've found infer the 15" and 16" had the same wheels & wheelbase. Apparently not. I haven't decided on a specific example just yet but have been looking at a lot of prototype photos. It is for a fictional industrial layout so does not necessarily need to be exact. That said, I always try and find an example to copy as you get, hopefully, a realistic "might have been" end product. The Centre Models kit has smokebox footsteps. I wouldn't use these anyway as I would fabricate something from brass, but in the very large majority of photos I've seen they do not seem to exist (the same might be said for the short vertical handrail just above, also on the smokebox side). Does anyone know if they were specific to some customers/models or were they routinely dispensed with? I have other Hunslet kits to build as well but I try not to think about it.... Thanks again Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Guys, thanks for that. Very helpful confirmation. It means the Impetus 15" chassis is also correct. You kind of hope it is but a number of books/references that I've found infer the 15" and 16" had the same wheels & wheelbase. Apparently not. I haven't decided on a specific example just yet but have been looking at a lot of prototype photos. It is for a fictional industrial layout so does not necessarily need to be exact. That said, I always try and find an example to copy as you get, hopefully, a realistic "might have been" end product. The Centre Models kit has smokebox footsteps. I wouldn't use these anyway as I would fabricate something from brass, but in the very large majority of photos I've seen they do not seem to exist (the same might be said for the short vertical handrail just above, also on the smokebox side). Does anyone know if they were specific to some customers/models or were they routinely dispensed with? I have other Hunslet kits to build as well but I try not to think about it.... Thanks again Roger The 16'' is a stretched version of the 15. There is a great photo somewhere on one of the RM web 7 mm Colliery threads that shows both locos together. By pure chance I have models of both Astley and Beatrice, the chosen illustrations. I think the photos were credited to PGL?. Have you seen Don Townsley's definitive history of the Hunslet company? Expensive but my local library found me a copy. The 16s are the best looking of the lot and I have scratchbuilt two. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 The Townsley book has details of all the individual locos and their first owners. Colliery engines were always modified to local custom and practice or the whim of the chief engineer. It was the unique hand rails of Ackton Hall that drew me to model Airedale, Beatrice and the 50550 S112. Likewise, Wheldale is instantly recognisable by the twin ladders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brill Branch Posted July 16, 2018 Author Share Posted July 16, 2018 Hi, thanks for that. I'll look for the photos and take your point on the local mods. I have managed to find a copy of the MRC September 1986 in the loft and that is very helpful. Cheers Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted July 16, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 16, 2018 We might have a spare 16" frame etch, I can let you know next week. Most Hunslets were offered with a choice of iron or (more expensive) cast steel wheel centres, the cast iron ones in these sizes had 12 spokes, steel ones 10. You can take Don Townsley's drawings as absolutely accurate but beware that they were not always printed correctly, the magazine publishers often stretched drawings to fit the page size so check that the vertical scale matches the horizontal. It certainly doesn't in the case of the 15" published in MRC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 I have just had a look at my notebook. Of 43 16inch locomotives, 29 went to collieries, 5 exported and 7 for iron stone mines. Leaving just two for other industries. HE 2082 to the steel works of Richard Thomas&Baldwin Ebbw Vale and 2689 Llynfi to Edmundsons Electric Corporation. Of 28 15inch locomotives, 20 to collieries, 7 to Mersey Dock & Harbour Board, leaving just HE1458 to Ferrybridge Powerstation. These were the original owners and no doubt people will quickly add further information. I seem to remember a 15 inch as one of Austins engines at Longbridge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted July 16, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 16, 2018 I think Longbridge had the 14" 0-6-0ST. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 17, 2018 Share Posted July 17, 2018 I think Longbridge had the 14" 0-6-0ST. Always another Hunslet to model! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted July 17, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 17, 2018 We can sell you that one as well.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 17, 2018 Share Posted July 17, 2018 We can sell you that one as well.... In 7mm? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted July 18, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 18, 2018 Not yet but the 16" in 7mm will be available soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 18, 2018 Share Posted July 18, 2018 Not yet but the 16" in 7mm will be available soon. Couldn't wait. Built Beatrice and Glasshoughton #4 last year. Still have to finish painting and find an identity for the 15 inch I bought at York in 2016. Wheeler, Mexborough or perhaps one of the Coronation locos? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brill Branch Posted July 18, 2018 Author Share Posted July 18, 2018 Mike, Would certainly be interested if you have a spare 16" frame etch, it might make the process a lot easier. Thanks both for all the info. Cheers Roger Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 The 16'' is a stretched version of the 15. There is a great photo somewhere on one of the RM web 7 mm Colliery threads that shows both locos together. By pure chance I have models of both Astley and Beatrice, the chosen illustrations. I think the photos were credited to PGL?. Have you seen Don Townsley's definitive history of the Hunslet company? Expensive but my local library found me a copy. The 16s are the best looking of the lot and I have scratchbuilt two. Correction. PGH Moving Coal page 7. My apologies. A great thread close to my own heart. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granite-Yorkie Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 I have just had a look at my notebook. ... Of 28 15inch locomotives, 20 to collieries, 7 to Mersey Dock & Harbour Board, leaving just HE1458 to Ferrybridge Powerstation. According to leedsengine.info 1458 was a 2ft gauge 4-6-0T which was sent to Calcutta. The 0-6-0ST at Ferrybridge was almost certainly 1658/1930 which was originally built for the Haifa Harbour project- a 14" IC. A sister of this one ended up at Frickley Colliery- again having been originally in Haifa. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 According to leedsengine.info 1458 was a 2ft gauge 4-6-0T which was sent to Calcutta. The 0-6-0ST at Ferrybridge was almost certainly 1658/1930 which was originally built for the Haifa Harbour project- a 14" IC. A sister of this one ended up at Frickley Colliery- again having been originally in Haifa. My information came from the Don Townsley book. 1658 would match a 1930 build. There are one or two other issues with the table of 15" locos. 1450/35 may well be a typo as it appears out of sequence. I also wasn't aware that the Haifa locos were returned to the UK. Assuming that you are correct, is the "1458/25 YEP#2" a spurious entry and was there one 15" loco fewer than the table suggests? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 My information came from the Don Townsley book. 1658 would match a 1930 build. There are one or two other issues with the table of 15" locos. 1450/35 may well be a typo as it appears out of sequence. I also wasn't aware that the Haifa locos were returned to the UK. Assuming that you are correct, is the "1458/25 YEP#2" a spurious entry and was there one 15" loco fewer than the table suggests? At least two 14” OC hunslets made it back from Haifa. One of which made it to Oxford Ironstone Quarries named “The Bursar” Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granite-Yorkie Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 At least two 14” OC hunslets made it back from Haifa. One of which made it to Oxford Ironstone Quarries named “The Bursar” Another ended up at Birch Coppice Colliery (Hunslet 1673)- like The Bursar it had outside cylinders. Three 14" ICs from Haifa ended up at an Admiralty Depot in Wales, and another in Dorset. There was also another former Haifa engine at the Alpha Cement's works at Shipton on Cherwell (I think this had come from Haifa via the War Department). I have a list of the Haifa Hunslets somewhere, along with their fates. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 (edited) Another ended up at Birch Coppice Colliery (Hunslet 1673)- like The Bursar it had outside cylinders. Three 14" ICs from Haifa ended up at an Admiralty Depot in Wales, and another in Dorset. There was also another former Haifa engine at the Alpha Cement's works at Shipton on Cherwell (I think this had come from Haifa via the War Department). I have a list of the Haifa Hunslets somewhere, along with their fates.There is a thread in industrial modelling sub forum (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/111474-hunslet-engine-co-works-numbers/&do=findComment&comment=2975311) with a bit more info. I think Birch Coppice is a larger 16” OC Hunslet. They made 14”, 15” and 16” varieties. Edited November 24, 2018 by Down_Under Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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