Great Model Railway Challenge - Channel 5

[PaulRhB]

Oh, and my fine scale, rivet-counting credentials can be seen in my signature below.

Which is why a follow up showing short bits of the participants home or exhibition layouts would be rather good in showing what else they do and bridging the gap from trainset to model. I think the association with what might seem daunting to a new entrant yet seeing the same people produce these competition layouts would be good for the ‘l could do that’ feeling.

[JohnR]

I wonder whose idea it was to have an ad in one of the commercial breaks featuring a website "www.oddballs.com"?

 

Entertaining eccentricity though.

 

Some of the "in progress" shots of the sink plunger were,  erm,  disturbing and anyway, who has three plungers under their sink?

 

Davros

[Hobby]

As long as it's not a shot of someone counting rivets... 

 

Which is why a follow up showing short bits of the participants home or exhibition layouts would be rather good in showing what else they do and bridging the gap from trainset to model. I think the association with what might seem daunting to a new entrant yet seeing the same people produce these competition layouts would be good for the ‘l could do that’ feeling.

 

Edited October 22, 2018 by Hobby

['CHARD]

It's pleasing and illuminating to note that the average post counts for contributors to this topic appear lower than may be typical for RMWeb as a whole....

[Jol Wilkinson]

As long as it's not a shot of someone counting rivets... 

 

I can't understand this objection to rivet counting. It's low cost, needs only a basic understanding of arithmetic, can be practiced on full scale or model locos, doesn't need any special skills or tools.  Ideal for the beginner, surely?

[Oldddudders]

It's pleasing and illuminating to note that the average post counts for contributors to this topic appear lower than may be typical for RMWeb as a whole....

 

Perhaps some of us who have higher post-counts spend little time watching tv?

[colin smith]

Unfortunately though the apparent sponsors of stock don’t make the other scales.

 

Bachmann certainly do make stock in Fn3 and 1:22.5. Track is an issue I admit. 

 

But this is all part of my point. If this show wants to showcase model railwaying then you don't have pointless (pun intended) restrictions on what can  be modelled in terms of fixed scales, fixed geography*, and fixed baseboard sizes. That means binning the silly rules and themes and widening the range of sponsors to include at least one major retailer and maybe Peco so you have a decent range of track.  

 

*In the sense we've only seen British outline or Sci-Fi.

 

 

['CHARD]

Perhaps some of us who have higher post-counts spend little time watching tv?

 

I did think that, but it seems to have attracted some new contributors/ long-time lurkers to join the fray too  ...  

[Hobby]

If this show wants to showcase model railwaying

 

But that's the point. It isn't showcasing model railways. Merely using model railways as a medium for a game show. there's a big difference between the two and I feel you've missed the point of the show.

 

What we can do, though, is to try to capitalise on the show's use of our hobby, but trying to change the format is a non-starter, that format works so they won't change it, all we can do is work round itto help us promote the hobby...

[colin smith]

If you can find another million people who feel the same way then you can have a telly programme. For the mass market in the UK, OO is the way to go, especially for the first series. This can't be about modelling "interesting" prototypes, you'll eat more than 24 hours on research alone, never mind scratch building the models, then the forums will be full of people moaning about prototype inaccuracies. 

 

I'm sure your Fn3 layout will be marvellous, and that you can build it very, very quickly. I look forward to reading about it in a magazine in the future.

But not all OO surely? But it isn't about modelling 'interesting prototypes' it's about showing the variety of scales and prototypes. Hell it's about showing there are actual prototypes to model.

 

The Fn3 idea would be for the movie challenge and would be High Noon. Two lengths of straight track laid diagonally across the boards. Then the six pre-builds would be the depot, an animated water tower, and a few buildings from key scenes in the film plus the wagon Will kane rides away on at the end. The three days would be spent mostly on groundwork to bring it all together, figure modelling, and sound effects. 

 

I stopped hobby modelling when it became my real job and since then I've found writing is a better way of creating an alternative reality. 

Edited October 22, 2018 by colin smith

[Phil Parker]

But that's the point. It isn't showcasing model railways. Merely using model railways as a medium for a game show. there's a big difference between the two and I feel you've missed the point of the show.

 

What we can do, though, is to try to capitalise on the show's use of our hobby, but trying to change the format is a non-starter, that format works so they won't change it, all we can do is work round itto help us promote the hobby...

 

I was about to type pretty much the same thing when this appeared - Great minds etc. 

 

If modelling was all about "interesting prototypes" meaning odd scales etc. then Narrow Gauge and Industrial would be the big mass-market magazine and all those who cover mainly OO, be specialist publications. It isn't (although I love it) because OO is the most popular scale/gauge combo in the UK by miles. There's also loads of ready to use stock, which is vital for a show with limited time for filming. Odd scales would require much more pre-building, at which point the modellers turn up with pretty much the whole lot in the back of their cars and you end up with a dull show. 

 

OO is also easier to identify with for the audience, there's a good chance that some of them have had a train set so there isn't the same need to explain absolutely everything.

[colin smith]

But that's the point. It isn't showcasing model railways. Merely using model railways as a medium for a game show. there's a big difference between the two and I feel you've missed the point of the show.

 

What we can do, though, is to try to capitalise on the show's use of our hobby, but trying to change the format is a non-starter, that format works so they won't change it, all we can do is work round itto help us promote the hobby...

And with the exception of programmes like Qi and University Challenge, I hate game shows. Tbh, I barely recognise most of the layouts in GMRC as model railways. Glorified train sets, maybe, but not model railways.

[Zomboid]

But that's the point. It isn't showcasing model railways. Merely using model railways as a medium for a game show. there's a big difference between the two and I feel you've missed the point of the show.

 

What we can do, though, is to try to capitalise on the show's use of our hobby, but trying to change the format is a non-starter, that format works so they won't change it, all we can do is work round itto help us promote the hobby...

This is exactly the point.

 

I've taken up ceramics as a hobby following the pottery version of this gameshow. I like making bread (though not cakes or biscuits, particularly) which is probably not particularly linked to GBBO as I hadn't really watched it before I started trying to make my own pizza, but it might have been in my consciousness because of it.

 

Railway modelling now has the opportunity to capitalise on a gameshow that ceramics had.

[Phil Parker]

But not all OO surely? But it isn't about modelling 'interesting prototypes' it's about showing the variety of scales and prototypes. Hell it's about showing there are actual prototypes to model.

 

The Fn3 idea would be for the movie challenge and would be High Noon. Two lengths of straight track laid diagonally across the boards. Then the six pre-builds would be the depot, an animated water tower, and a few buildings from key scenes in the film plus the wagon Will kane rides away on at the end. The three days would be spent mostly on groundwork to bring it all together, figure modelling, and sound effects. 

 

I stopped hobby modelling when it became my real job and since then I've found writing is a better way of creating an alternative reality. 

 

Neither figure modelling or adding sound effects are televisual so the Fn3 (is that what Bachmann call On30?) would just be adding some dirt for the groundworks. OK for a while but untimely very limited.

 

And I also create alternative realities by writing (Blatant Book Plug).

[Coryton]

But this is all part of my point. If this show wants to showcase model railwaying then you don't have pointless (pun intended) restrictions on what can  be modelled in terms of fixed scales, fixed geography*, and fixed baseboard sizes. That means binning the silly rules and themes and widening the range of sponsors to include at least one major retailer and maybe Peco so you have a decent range of track.  

 

 

 

The track is Peco, so far as I know.

[colin smith]

If modelling was all about "interesting prototypes" meaning odd scales etc. then Narrow Gauge and Industrial would be the big mass-market magazine and all those who cover mainly OO, be specialist publications.

 

 

Not necessarily. There are thousands of great prototypes that you never see modelled. There are thousands more models of GWR branch termini than there were actual GWR branch termini, but when was the last time you saw anything modelled from South America, or North Africa, or Scandinavia, or Russia? Railways don't end at Dover.

[colin smith]

The track is Peco, so far as I know.

 

Well, that's good. Gives a big range of scale and gauge. 

[ThaneofFife]

So should we take the same stance at new models that are disappointing?

 

What's the difference with a TV show?

 

Why the kid gloves or is that just the way everything seems to be going these days (for fear of upsetting say the one in 5 million) ?

Edited October 22, 2018 by ThaneofFife

[colin smith]

Neither figure modelling or adding sound effects are televisual so the Fn3 (is that what Bachmann call On30?) would just be adding some dirt for the groundworks. OK for a while but untimely very limited.

 

And I also create alternative realities by writing (Blatant Book Plug).

 

Fn3 is completely different from On30.

 

On30 is what we call O:16.5, except their O scale is 1:48, not 1:43.5

Fn3 is a variant of LGB using 1:20.3 (15mm=1 foot) on gauge 1 track to represent 3' gauge prototypes. LGB is much looser on scale/gauge but mainly represents metre gauge. 

 

But again, it's not about what's televisual but about the modelling. It can be done. Programmes about writers don't show writers writing. Even I wouldn't watch a hour of someone typing, cursing, and staring out the window. Instead it's writers talking about writing and why they write, and so on. I accept that GMRC is a game show crossed with reality TV, but wish it wasn't so. 

 

Writing plug 

[ThaneofFife]

The track is Peco, so far as I know.

 

yes I saw the blue boxes of new PECO track - amazed in this day and age the word "PECO" wasn't marred by hellish pixellation!

[Steamport Southport]

Not necessarily. There are thousands of great prototypes that you never see modelled. There are thousands more models of GWR branch termini than there were actual GWR branch termini, but when was the last time you saw anything modelled from South America, or North Africa, or Scandinavia, or Russia? Railways don't end at Dover.

 

But it's made for a British audience. You just need to visit virtually any model railway exhibition and see the lack of people even glancing at foreign layouts or narrow gauge for that matter. Most just walk past.

 

 

Are you a returner by any chance? As I think your comments suggest you haven't followed model railways in the last twenty years or so and are from the 1980s or earlier. I think the reference to GWR branchline termini is extremely outdated. I think I can count on one hand the amount of those I've seen on the exhibition circuit in the last ten years and I visit approximately ten shows a year.

 

90% of layouts I see are BR steam/transitional or current.

 

 

 

Jason

[Phil Parker]

Fn3 is completely different from On30.

 

On30 is what we call O:16.5, except their O scale is 1:48, not 1:43.5

Fn3 is a variant of LGB using 1:20.3 (15mm=1 foot) on gauge 1 track to represent 3' gauge prototypes. LGB is much looser on scale/gauge but mainly represents metre gauge. 

 

But again, it's not about what's televisual but about the modelling. It can be done. Programmes about writers don't show writers writing. Even I wouldn't watch a hour of someone typing, cursing, and staring out the window. Instead it's writers talking about writing and why they write, and so on. I accept that GMRC is a game show crossed with reality TV, but wish it wasn't so.

 

That's what I thought, which is why I was surprised that you said Bachmann make RTR. I've got some 10mm on 16.5 track in January's Garden Rail by the way.

 

I think the problem is that you don't like any show like GMRC and have a very narrow idea of what you define as a model railway - so it's not a surprise that you don't like the show. However, it comes back to my point that if you can find another million people with the same opinion, you CAN have a TV show that would please you. Until then, we get GMRC which seems to be keeping a lot of people happy.

[Phil Parker]

So should we take the same stance at new models that are disappointing?

 

What's the difference with a TV show?

 

Why the kid gloves or is that just the way everything seems to be going these days (for fear of upsetting say the one in 5 million) ?

 

Because this is a very public forum which people interested in the GMRC are likely to find. There are some excellent behind the scenes details and comments from participants which would appeal to a wider audience. If the thread turns into one full of competitive moaning and slanging matches, it doesn't show the hobby in a good light and far from encouraging new recruits to the hobby, will turn them away while reinforcing many of the prejudices from non-modellers about us.

 

So far, apart from a few bits of personal abuse and bad language (which have been removed), it's all been very positive and enjoyable.

 

If you don't like the show, don't watch it.

[HillsideDepot]

Not necessarily. There are thousands of great prototypes that you never see modelled. There are thousands more models of GWR branch termini than there were actual GWR branch termini, but when was the last time you saw anything modelled from South America, or North Africa, or Scandinavia, or Russia? Railways don't end at Dover.

That may be so, but I model what I like. And I like BR (W) in the early 1970s - which are no doubt dismissed as "blue boxes" by some, Do I care? Not in the least. Do I have plenty of great prototypes to choose from; you bet I do! More than enough to last me my lifetime - even if I live to be 100. 

 

Do I expect a mainstream TV show to include BR blue hydraulics? No. But neither do I repeat the claimed benefits of modelling 1970s Western Region in OO. It's just one small specialism within this vast hobby.

 

Out of interest I watched a programme called Great British Bake Off - the Professionals. My interest in food is very much at the basic, home cooked, level, so many of the terms they used were unknown to me - just as "static grass" probably is to most GMRC viewers. The programme offered me no insights or explanation of these terms. But one thing that was noticeable was how one of the big displays (made of sugar) crashed to the floor before judging. Fair enough, it may have been much more ambitious than anything GBBO (the amateurs) would attempt, but it was a failure of much bigger proportions than we've [yet] seen on GMRC. And the judges were more critical of various rough edges and unfinished items on GBBO - Professionals than on GMRC.

 

We all partake in this hobby in a way that suits us, even if that means abandoning Fn3 (never heard of it, tbh, but that's my ignorance) in favour of writing. Right, I'm back to my modified Airfix water tower, now on a brick base and to my eye making a fairly good replica of one which once stood in my local station yard where even the other BR Regions are a foreign land.

[sharris]

There are RTR models of esoteric prototypes or one-offs

 

Although hasn't it always been so to some extent? - the Triang-Hornby Caledonian Single was the second locomotive I ever owned (the first being a Nellie), I think around 1973. Certainly a one-off prototype and maybe not the first thing that comes to mind when you ask most people what a steam locomotive looks like.