When were GWR pagoda waiting sheds first used on the Bodmin and Wadebridge?

[MarcD]

I'm thinking of building a layout based on the B&W and I was wondering when the first use of the GWR pagoda waiting sheds was? I know it was after 1904 when the halts were first used and before BR(W) took over the line but was it a BR(S), SR or Late LSWR introduction?

 

Marc

[chris45lsw]

I'm thinking of building a layout based on the B&W and I was wondering when the first use of the GWR pagoda waiting sheds was? I know it was after 1904 when the halts were first used and before BR(W) took over the line but was it a BR(S), SR or Late LSWR introduction?

 

Marc

I don't know when they appeared, Marc.  I think that when the three halts were opened in 1906 they had no shelters at all - certainly I've seen a pre-Group photo of Nanstallon without one but I suspect they appeared before 1923 and were definitely in situ by the middle 1930s.  Note that if you are modelling the BR period that Nanstallon's pagoda was replaced some time after 1947 as far as I can ascertain.

 

Chris KT

[MarcD]

I'm was hoping to pitch the date around 1918-23 as I could use multiple 2-4-0WTs 3 in the 1895 build and 3 in post 1921 build. Maximum use out of the kit I'm developing. Also just bought a LSWR terrier

 

Marc

[Steamport Southport]

Some mentions of the pagodas on this page.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disused_railway_stations_on_the_Bodmin_to_Wadebridge_line

 

 

 

 

Jason

[TomJ]

I wonder why there were GWR pagodas on a SR line? I know the GWR ran through to Wadebridge but I don’t think their trains stopped at the halts. And Dunmere Halt didn’t see GWR trains at all, yet also had a pagoda

[Steamport Southport]

I wonder why there were GWR pagodas on a SR line? I know the GWR ran through to Wadebridge but I don’t think their trains stopped at the halts. And Dunmere Halt didn’t see GWR trains at all, yet also had a pagoda

 

They probably just seen them as suitable buildings and bought them. I wouldn't have thought the GWR would be bothered that a rival company was using similar style buildings. After all many railways were using GWR style gunpowder vans.

 

According to Wikipedia they were made by outside contractors in kit form. So they probably just went straight to the contractors.

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GWR_pagoda_platform_shelter

 

 

Jason

[bécasse]

As far as I am aware, all the c/i huts used by the GWR were in fact proprietary products (my memory drags up Joseph Ash of Birmingham, but I have been unable to check that so it may not be right), even though official GWR drawings undoubtedly existed. Certainly I once came across a "pagoda" hut in use as a park pavilion in a location that made a GW provenance most unlikely. It is possible that a LSWR official saw their use by the GWR and considered them suitable (particularly in terms of cost and ease of installation) for the three B&W locations, or a salesman may have made an opportune visit to the District Engineer at Exeter (who seems to have had greater authority than the other LSWR DEs). The LSWR wasn't a big user of c/i and those structures used elsewhere (on the Basingstoke-Alton and Bulford lines for example) seem to have been sourced elsewhere, possibly to a precise LSWR specification; I have never been able to identify their supplier.

 

As to a construction date, the three halts opened in July 1906 and examination of the timber sub-structure of Grogley suggests that it was always the intention to provide shelters of this size, so they may have been installed by the winter of 1906/7. The layout at Boscarne Junction was improved and the signal box there extended in the summer of 1914 and, if they hadn't already been installed earlier it is possible that their provision was authorised at the same time. The rail motors were withdrawn during the latter part of the Great War and services cut back, so it is unlikely that their provision dates from later than 1914.

[MarcD]

As far as I am aware, all the c/i huts used by the GWR were in fact proprietary products (my memory drags up Joseph Ash of Birmingham, but I have been unable to check that so it may not be right), even though official GWR drawings undoubtedly existed. Certainly I once came across a "pagoda" hut in use as a park pavilion in a location that made a GW provenance most unlikely. It is possible that a LSWR official saw their use by the GWR and considered them suitable (particularly in terms of cost and ease of installation) for the three B&W locations, or a salesman may have made an opportune visit to the District Engineer at Exeter (who seems to have had greater authority than the other LSWR DEs). The LSWR wasn't a big user of c/i and those structures used elsewhere (on the Basingstoke-Alton and Bulford lines for example) seem to have been sourced elsewhere, possibly to a precise LSWR specification; I have never been able to identify their supplier.

 

As to a construction date, the three halts opened in July 1906 and examination of the timber sub-structure of Grogley suggests that it was always the intention to provide shelters of this size, so they may have been installed by the winter of 1906/7. The layout at Boscarne Junction was improved and the signal box there extended in the summer of 1914 and, if they hadn't already been installed earlier it is possible that their provision was authorised at the same time. The rail motors were withdrawn during the latter part of the Great War and services cut back, so it is unlikely that their provision dates from later than 1914.

That's what I wanted to hear. I was looking for a date before 1923. I got my hands on a corrugated card kit for one at this years West Cornwall Steam and agricultural show.

I was thinking of Grogley junction and halt about 1921.

 

Marc

[bécasse]

The Great Western Railway's Lipson Vale Halt https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Lipson-Vale-Railway-Station-Photo-Mutley-Laira-Plymouth-to-Devonport-1-/251629966223, located east of Mutley station in Plymouth and therefore passed through by LSWR trains en route to/from Friary, which was opened in 1904 appears to have had a remarkably similar construction (albeit with longer platforms) to Grogley Halt, opened two years later. The LSWR had remarkably few stations with rudimentary timber platforms and, given that the LSWR's DE Exeter would have been aware of Lipson Vale's construction, one has to wonder whether the design was copied (albeit not slavishly) inclusive of the pagoda hut.

 

Eventually, I haven't been able to trace a date, LSWR local trains to/from Friary started to serve Lipson Vale as well as North Road and Mutley and, even more remarkably, continued to do so for almost another 12 years after the last GWR trains were withdrawn in July 1930. 

[Edwardian]

I have a strong notion that the pagoda was not introduced by the GWR until 1907.  I wish I could recall the reference for that.

 

Of course they were used for more than halts, but came in shortly after halts started to proliferate, so there is a natural association. 

[brianusa]

This was situated down the hill from where we lived.  It is always said that it was removed because of enemy bombing in WW2 as its platforms were wooden, but by that time Plymouth Corp buses were eating into its local passenger base which is probably more likely the reason.  On more longer runs, most joined Southern trains at Mutley or North Road.

 

Brian.

[Mikkel]

I have a strong notion that the pagoda was not introduced by the GWR until 1907.  I wish I could recall the reference for that.

 

Of course they were used for more than halts, but came in shortly after halts started to proliferate, so there is a natural association. 

 

Chris Leigh says "around 1907" in GWR country stations vol 1. That may be the source of the Wikipedia entry which also says 1907.

 

The halts were introduced in 1903 but the buildings may have developed a little later of course. In his "GW Architecture" Vaughan does not mention the intro date but in the caption for a wonderful photo of Defiance Halt (showing no less than three Pagoda shelters on the down side!) he indirectly suggests that when opened in 1905, that halt had a pagoda. He also refers to a drawing (can't find it) for a Pagoda constructed in 1907 (which, again, could be the source of the 1907 suggestion).

Edited October 26, 2018 by Mikkel

[Miss Prism]

This might be an instance where the official drawing came after construction of the initial 'prototypes' (like Defiance Halt), i.e. the GWR settled on a design it was happy with, and could transmit the spec to subcontractors.

[bécasse]

Like the LSWR halt at Grogley, the method of construction of the timber platforms at Lipson Vale Halt strongly suggests that provision of space for the shelters was included in the original design, which doesn't, of course, mean that the shelters were provided from the actual opening day.

 

Like Miss Prism, I have my suspicions that the GWR drawings of the various c/i huts were made subsequent to installation, quite possibly as tracings of the manufacturer's own drawings. On a railway which often prepared its loco GAs subsequent to construction there would have been nothing unusual in this practice, which is actually quite sensible.