RMweb Gold Garry D100 Posted February 18, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2011 Noticed this interesting train pack has now been released. Some pictures here http://railsofsheffi...-JJJA15071.aspx Looks quite smart, quite like the cowcatcher on the front of the loco. Did it run at all over here like this (maybe just on its way to the boat) or was it just in the USA. I am guessing just in the USA so is this another limited use collectors item? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted February 18, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2011 Noticed this interesting train pack has now been released. Some pictures here http://railsofsheffi...-JJJA15071.aspx Looks quite smart, quite like the cowcatcher on the front of the loco. Did it run at all over here like this (maybe just on its way to the boat) or was it just in the USA. I am guessing just in the USA so is this another limited use collectors item? Peter Nicholsons 1999 book 'Flying Scotsman' has a photo of her in steam outside Doncaster works on August 9th 1969 with all of the US additions (including the cow 'catcher'). He says that the loco hauled a few excursions prior to being loaded onto a ship for transport on the 19th September however the photo on the facing page shows her on the 31st August with the bell and extra whistle but sans the cowcatcher or the buckeye. On her return to the UK in 1973 she had the all of the US fittings attached but for her first run from Liverpool docks to Derby works, light engine, photo evidence shows that all had been removed. The preproduction body on the Hornby stand at Warley last year seemed to have the cowcatcher as part of new a bufferbeam tooling so I fear that removal to make an authentic UK 4472 might not be as straightforward as it could have been. Shame they haven't included an alternative buffer beam really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Garry D100 Posted February 18, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2011 Thanks for the info Mike, makes interesting reading. Modelling the 70's I think the best version for me would be double tender with one for the tenders in BR Blue Grey. Think it was done a good few years back but would be nice for an upgraded version.....maybe one day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-BOAF Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 A couple of things worthy of note. The second tender appears to have the large 1980s couplings, and an interestingly plain front corridor connection (i.e. no proper buffing plate). It does, however, have seperate handrails, so is presumably the same version as used with the double-tender live steam model a few years ago. Be interesting to see if the metal frame of a tender-drive unit is inside! Sadly, this means no NEM pockets, and no close coupling between loco and tender or tender-coaches. The model appears to have the pecular problem that I have only seen affect the Australian Scotsman, that the main running plate slopes downwards (by about 1 to 1.5mm if my aussie example is anything to go by) towards the back (no its not an optical illusion caused by the reverser rod), and the cab running plate upwards to compensate with the rear drag box then at correct height (i.e. firebox bottom too low). I can't understand this at all and Hornby bodies are glued together!). This aside, the whole pack is VERY GOOD VALUE. With Hornby Pacifics RRPing over £130, to get the A3, plus Observation Car (close to £50) plus second tender for an RRP of £140 is great! If you want a 1960's scotsman, this is probably the best way to go. Carving off the cowcatcher, support brackets and Buckeye shouldn't be too difficult for the skilled modeller. Snip off the Bell and Whistle Splash of LNER buffer Beam Red, some transfers from Fox and a spare Hornby screw coupling from EKM or third party version, Vac Hose, and you're done! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preservation Modeller Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 It looks stunning. The different carriage is nice too. If I could, I'd certainly buy this. Shame about the knuckle coupler on the front though, that'd need some tweaking for me... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 It would be easier to convert the NRM version . I see its a strange mixture of parts. The main tender is a the NRM version sans warning panels with a NEM coupling. The loco also has the new style wiring connector. Which has recieved numerous bad reviews. No idea if the Water tender has been made before? If its a old Tender drive moulding it will be wider than the Coal tender too ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Just a bit of a shame it's not in HO scale... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Garry D100 Posted February 18, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted February 18, 2011 Just a bit of a shame it's not in HO scale... More a shame the American models are not in OO Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doubleslip Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 For a late 60s double tender Scotsman this is the best option so far. The NRM and Australian versions have the wrong boiler (A4 type - sloping washout plugs etc), as well as too few tenders. The moulding for the second tender has been done before, not sure if it has been tweaked for this version. The coupling looks old. I was hoping the USA front buffer beam accesories would be more detachable on this model, for once I hope that bits start falling off this one to get it back to UK condition. Does anyone know if the observation car could be backdated to any standard pullman livery? This is a good value pack. Even if Hornby brought out a UK double tender version in the future, it would be probably be as much or more expensive than this pack is now the way things are going. The Australian version sold out quickly in UK (though not in Australia and New Zealand!), so maybe these won't hang around long either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billystanier Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Looks good and I might be tempted. On the same batch of releases - £50 quid for the latest Dapol-style Pug - and thats from a bulk box discounter! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 For a late 60s double tender Scotsman this is the best option so far. The NRM and Australian versions have the wrong boiler (A4 type - sloping washout plugs etc), as well as too few tenders. The moulding for the second tender has been done before, not sure if it has been tweaked for this version. The coupling looks old. I was hoping the USA front buffer beam accesories would be more detachable on this model, for once I hope that bits start falling off this one to get it back to UK condition. Does anyone know if the observation car could be backdated to any standard pullman livery? A SUPERB set!! I take my hat off to Hornby for retooling the observation car to correct sides for SC281; I really didn't think they'd do it. As such it would not be correct for the original Pullman livery. I'm delighted Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Peter Nicholsons 1999 book 'Flying Scotsman' has a photo of her in steam outside Doncaster works on August 9th 1969 with all of the US additions (including the cow 'catcher'). He says that the loco hauled a few excursions prior to being loaded onto a ship for transport on the 19th September however the photo on the facing page shows her on the 31st August with the bell and extra whistle but sans the cowcatcher or the buckeye. The 1970 Ian Allan 2nd edition book "Flying Scotsman" states that the cowcatcher and buckeye where attached aboard the Saxonia - presumably they were tried out at Doncaster and then removed. The railtour web site sixbellsjunction does not list any for 4472 in 1969 after June. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted February 19, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 19, 2011 The 1970 Ian Allan 2nd edition book "Flying Scotsman" states that the cowcatcher and buckeye where attached aboard the Saxonia - presumably they were tried out at Doncaster and then removed. The railtour web site sixbellsjunction does not list any for 4472 in 1969 after June. Page 47 of the Peter Nicholson book has two photos of 4472 on an LNER society special from Kings Cross to Newcastle - the date given is August 31st 1969. 'The Worlds Most Famous Steam Locomotive', (David Clifford, 1997) says that this was the last UK railtour and its last pre USA move was engine, 2 tenders and one coach from Doncaster to Liverpool on the 14th September. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 The 1970 Ian Allan 2nd edition book "Flying Scotsman" states that the cowcatcher and buckeye where attached aboard the Saxonia - presumably they were tried out at Doncaster and then removed. The railtour web site sixbellsjunction does not list any for 4472 in 1969 after June. Also on the crossing, the window-end buffers were removed from the observation car (and subsequently lost, which was unfortunate for when it was repatriated) and buckeye attached too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doubleslip Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Does that mean that observation car is the Scottish region version in a Pullman type livery (what were the mods to the sides)?. I am guessing it was repainted from the maroon livery. Did it ever run in this cream/umber livery in UK or was it only for the US tour? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Does that mean that observation car is the Scottish region version in a Pullman type livery (what were the mods to the sides)?. I am guessing it was repainted from the maroon livery. Did it ever run in this cream/umber livery in UK or was it only for the US tour? This car was one of two which were built (from older vehicles) for the Devon Belle. They were Nos 13 and 14 (of which this is 14). Once the Belle ceased to run, both cars were taken over by British Railways and No 14 was reliveried into Maroon, the partial plating over the matchboard sides and ends having been removed. A smaller board was placed at the centre on each side of the car, OBSERVATION CAR being applied. It was renumbered Sc281. In this condition it ran on the Glasgow-Oban line until 1966. In 1967 it transferred to the Inverness-Kyle of Lochalsh line, replacing sister car No 13 (Sc280M) which had been sold to the South Devon Railway for preservation. In 1968 No14 was readied for the USA Tour. The matchboard sides were retained and it was repainted into a more traditional Pullman livery. It retained its Scottish number. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted February 21, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 21, 2011 Has anyone picked up one of these sets? The usual sites have just got the stock photo from Hornby on the site. Would be nice to see some different photos, especially one from the front. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium BR60103 Posted February 22, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 22, 2011 I know someone who claims to have one of the headlamps (the buffer beam ones) from the tour, if you need really precise detail. B) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Has anyone picked up one of these sets? The usual sites have just got the stock photo from Hornby on the site. Would be nice to see some different photos, especially one from the front. Hope these will whet your appetite: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Hope these will whet your appetite: A better shot of No 14, showing Hornby's superb matchboard sides: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Garry D100 Posted February 23, 2011 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted February 23, 2011 Hope these will whet your appetite: Is it me or are the underframe mouldings on the tenders different. The loco tender underframe has more detail and relief. Pity they could not use the same on both. Think someone mentioned the double tender might be the older version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiltedsignaller Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Is it me or are the underframe mouldings on the tenders different. The loco tender underframe has more detail and relief. Pity they could not use the same on both. Think someone mentioned the double tender might be the older version. They are certainly different. The main tender is the most recent Hornby product, but the water carrier is more crude in detail. Also it has an older (chunkier) style of coupling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doubleslip Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 It sure looks good. I have seen one picture of 4472 in this livery but running with only the first tender, therefore the number was only on the buffer beam, but perhaps making a more consistent and layout friendly sized loco. Looking at my other A3s, the front face of the buffer beam is a separate moulding, so I am presuming this one is a new moulding with cow catcher etc which could possibly be removed/replaced to backdate it. The observation car looks great and useable in this livery, as though it could be legitimately run on any number of excursion trains, not just in Devon! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Wouldn't it be nice of Hornby to present Sir Alan Pegler with one of these? Just a thought... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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