Pullman coaches.

[percomotion]

When was match board pullman coaches introduced and when did they stop being used,and when did straight sided pullman coaches come into service

[BernardTPM]

The very first Pullmans on the Midland Railway back in 1874 were 'matchboard' style and were integrally built of wood. Sides were basically straight, without tumblehome, but the layers did have steps between them. This form of construction continued until around the Great War when separate underframes began to be used, though the matchboarding style remained. The first all-steel Pullmans appeared in 1928, still with straight sides, but smoother. The 1951 Golden Arrow stock reverted to wood frames but had smooth straight panelling. Many of the older Pullmans were sheeted over in aluminium after WWII to make them appear more modern. The last traditional Pullmans were the 'Golden Arrow' coaches which stayed in service until 1972.

Of course, the VSOE Pullmans have been running since 1982, so you could say there has only been a brief 10 year gap when straight sided Pullmans have not been used, less than that if you allow for the Bulmer's Pullmans that often used to run behind King George V; some of them ended up in the VSOE rake.

[Ceptic]

A bit more info'.

There were also the Pullmans which made up the Southern Railway's electric multiple units.

lntroduced in 1933, these were also all-steel, and featured truss free underframes. The truss bracing being contained within the body, similar to the 1928 built cars.

These cars were slightly longer, 66' compared to 63'-10". Another feature, was that the body sides were not straight. They sloped inward slightly, from the waist, to the cant rail.

[percomotion]

A bit more info'.

There were also the Pullmans which made up the Southern Railway's electric multiple units.

lntroduced in 1933, these were also all-steel, and featured truss free underframes. The truss bracing being contained within the body, similar to the 1928 built cars.

These cars were slightly longer, 66' compared to 63'-10". Another feature, was that the body sides were not straight. They sloped inward slightly, from the waist, to the cant rail.

Thanks for that info as I've just purchased 8 straight sided Pullman coaches, 4 years ago I purchased 2 Hornby china made matchboard Pullman coaches and did not know when they were is service is it still possible to run them together as I model mid sixties.Also why did they have different colour roofs silver white and grey.

[BernardTPM]

Most of the pre-1928 Pullmans were out of service by the mid-60s and those that remained were likely to be aluminium clad, so not obviously matchboard. The introduction of the Mk.1 Pullmans on the East Coast route in 1960 meant that those all-steel cars mostly went to the Southern Region (they hung onto a few Kitchen and the Brake 3rds for a while longer) which, along with the reduction in the number of Pullman services, enabled them to retire the majority of the older coaches on the Southampton Boat Trains and Bournemouth Belle. It wasn't always the end for old Pullmans as many became camping coaches and some began to find their way into preservation.

I didn't mention the EMU type Pullmans (5-BEL and 6-PUL) as, until VSOE days, they would not have been loco-hauled.

[Ceptic]

Thanks for that info as I've just purchased 8 straight sided Pullman coaches, 4 years ago I purchased 2 Hornby china made matchboard Pullman coaches and did not know when they were is service is it still possible to run them together as I model mid sixties.Also why did they have different colour roofs silver white and grey.

 

l would say, at guess, that the grey roofs were introduced as a pre - WW2 camoulflage. There's a photo of the Brighton Pullman works, showing the aftermath of a bombing raid. two of the cars have had the Grey paint blasted away, showing, what looks to be, White paint underneath

[percomotion]

Most of the pre-1928 Pullmans were out of service by the mid-60s and those that remained were likely to be aluminium clad, so not obviously matchboard. The introduction of the Mk.1 Pullmans on the East Coast route in 1960 meant that those all-steel cars mostly went to the Southern Region (they hung onto a few Kitchen and the Brake 3rds for a while longer) which, along with the reduction in the number of Pullman services, enabled them to retire the majority of the older coaches on the Southampton Boat Trains and Bournemouth Belle. It wasn't always the end for old Pullmans as many became camping coaches and some began to find their way into preservation.

I didn't mention the EMU type Pullmans (5-BEL and 6-PUL) as, until VSOE days, they would not have been loco-hauled.

Thanks for all your help.

 

 

l would say, at guess, that the grey roofs were introduced as a pre - WW2 camoulflage. There's a photo of the Brighton Pullman works, showing the aftermath of a bombing raid. two of the cars have had the Grey paint blasted away, showing, what looks to be, White paint underneath

Many thanks for the info.

[gresley]

Whilst the official roof colouring up to WW 2 was white. However, from photographic evidence, it would appear that during the 1950s most "in service" cars had grey roofs, certainly on the Eastern Region. I notice, (again, from photographic evidence), that after withdrawal, some of the preserved cars were given white roofs.

 

gresley

[AMJ]

There is at least one book that says many of the pre WWII cars were stored during the conflict and not used so when the hostilities ended they were seen as in good nick so got a few more years out of them.

 

Many of the older cars that still operate do so as they are fitted with Buck Eye couplings and Pullman type gangways. These are said to be safer than coaches of a similar age with screw couplings.