'O' gauge ? first tentative steps. Corrugated goods shed part 3: Painting and weathering

[David Siddall]

This is very much work in progress on the ballasting and trackwork........

.......but all the ballast is, er, cat litter

On this occasion, and with complete respect my dear chap, this is one piece of advice I might not be following up on.... our cat, which has moved into the room I use for modelling to avoid our most recent canine rescue arrival, might get ideas ;-)

[David Siddall]

Following advice from Martin Wynne I've dropped "A" switches from Fourgig and use 9ft switches instead, you get the same size pointwork, or maybe a little smaller but a gentler radius to the curve. "A" switches really don't work with crossings less than 1:6

 

Food for thought there 'RM'... though whether that'll be viable working with the C&L range I've chosen will require a few emails. Apologies for the thicko question but in what way don't they work?

 

D

[RedgateModels]

I'm in no way an expert in pointwork, quite the opposite But going with advice from Martin has given a much more flowing feel to the track on Fourgig. I think the issue with "A" switches is that they force an unnecessarily tight radius to the curve when using them with steep crossing angles to the V. Don't ask me why though!

[David Siddall]

Quick repeat of some useful advice featured a few weeks back to beginners in this turnout building game...

 

Save yourself the task of chopping up C&L slide chairs to simulate 4-bolt 'bridge chairs' (the little square ones), you can buy them ready-made from Exactoscale (product code 7CH201A). They also do rather nice 1-piece moulded fishplates in ABS - ideal for insulation gaps (7XXFP01).

 

Supplies of both ordered yesterday along with some of their brass fishplates (7XXFP11) so I can compare these to C&L's equivalent.

 

Thanks to Richard (Dikitriki) for the advice on the 'bridge chairs' and his photos.

 

D

[Donw]

Following advice from Martin Wynne I've dropped "A" switches from Fourgig and use 9ft switches instead, you get the same size pointwork, or maybe a little smaller but a gentler radius to the curve. "A" switches really don't work with crossings less than 1:6

 

I find this statement a little odd. I agree 9ft switches can be handy however the heel offset for a straight switch full size is 4.5ins and this is too tight for most model standards except S7 and P4 so the 9ft straight switches are usually a bit of a compromise. Also an A7 turnout has the same radius through the switch and the closure rail so there is no reason why an A switch will not work with crossings up to 1:7. If you go to an A8 you need to put in a straight bit before the crossing so I feel there is no point in using them. I find A5.5 and A6 switches make good sense. The problem with A5s is that the radius is down to 212ft which works out a bit tight in 0 gauge the 9ft straight switch is 218ft however the 0F| compromise may be a litle larger. This is due to sharpening the switch to increase the heel offset which then eases the closure rail radius. Personally I find no 5 crossings a little tight outside of goods yards.

[dikitriki]

On this occasion, and with complete respect my dear chap, this is one piece of advice I might not be following up on.... our cat, which has moved into the room I use for modelling to avoid our most recent canine rescue arrival, might get ideas ;-)

 

Hi David

 

In the circumstances, I think I would agree with you - a recipe for a noisome debacle!

 

We have a pet-free home - my wife is asthmatic and allergic to animal hair - so not something I had to take into account. Mind you, the cat litter had to be sieved twice to get the right ballast size. Rumours abound that it was the new Heyside punishment detail, and it was not easy to use either, given some degree of absorbency. I'm not sure I'd use it again, but the effect was very ballast-like in its size and angularity. Also, given the acres of trackwork, I didn't feel like adding any more weight than I had to to some already very heavy boards.

 

 

I look forward to seeing where you go from here.

 

Yours

 

Richard

[David Siddall]

Don..., having watched a couple of layouts for a while on Sunday I was surprised how acceptable I found the flow of stock through standard Peco medium turnouts (quoted as a nominal radius of 1828mm (72in). I appreciate that A5s are a fraction tighter than that but if an 0-6-0 loco and a 6-wheel milk tanker will run through them that'll be an OK compromise for me. Otherwise, in the space I have available, I'd almost certainly end up with more turnout than plain track - not the effect I'm after at all!

 

And whilst I admire the efforts of those who really know their trackwork and who build to the nth degree of scale precision I'm going to have to invoke the dread word 'compromise' again (...please put the gun down all those of you to whom that word is anathema). It is, after all, the availablility of stock compontents - particularly C&L's ready-made common crossings, blades and Timbertracks turnout bases - which prompted my venture into hand-built track in this scale in the first place. The outcome so far (given that it's taken several weeks as a consequence of the number of hours I work) is something that looks suspiciously like a turnout, may conceivably just work like one; and personally I'm not entirely unhappy with that ;-)

 

D

[Allegheny1600]

Hi David,

Just been having a fairly long catch-up here and I am very pleased to see how well your point has come out, brilliant work! (maybe I should give this handbuilt track a go myself?). Shame you had to give up the original plan but the new one still looks great!

With regards to staining the sleepers, I wonder if you would be interested in a tip I've picked up from US modelling? Mix your choice of liquid shoe polish with enough IPA to get a nice 'watery' consistency and apply quite sparingly. You can actually build up the depth of colour that you want, especially with a 'thin' mixture. Also, you could get a suitable sized 'Tupperware' box, fill to a bit deeper than your sleeper base and dunk the whole sleeper base in it! Don't leave it to soak though as you would have no control over the colour and it may distort the timbers! Then pour back into your container for later re-use!

This stuff won't affect how adhesives perform afterwards but can't be used after adhesives as you would see where the glue is!

Cheers,

John E.

[David Siddall]

With regards to staining the sleepers, I wonder if you would be interested in a tip I've picked up from US modelling? Mix your choice of liquid shoe polish with enough IPA to get a nice 'watery' consistency and apply quite sparingly...

 

Now that's my kind of idea John... simple, cheap and effective ...and therefore definitely on my list of possibilities for how to treat the batch of 60' track panels I brought back from the Bristol show.

 

Final stage... get the turnout rail-sides painted, and the stained sleepers dry-brush weathered so I can photo the finished item in all its glory.

 

Not sure how much modelling I'm going to be able to fit in over the next few days though. Loads of work in at the moment plus two of our offspring visiting for the weekend.

 

D

[David Siddall]

Location, location, location? I think I might have found another possible (and quite strong) contender from which to draw operational inspiration for the sort of bucolic whimsy I have in mind for my model - the Princetown Branch in the 50s. Single ex-mainline bogie coaches in carmine and cream formed into short mixed trains, short freights (two/three wagons plus van). Loads of photos and operational data available. What if I were to shift the principle down off the moor into the South Hams, or possibly just over the Tamar onto the south coast of Corwall (...say just west of Plymouth itself)? Steam era motive power could then be more varied: 14xx and Panniers as well as 45xx...? Dammit I'm spoiled for choice... North Somerset Levels, the eastern edge of the Forest of Dean, the western Costwolds and now this. Hmmmm?

 

Two questions: Did BR(W) ever split 'B' set pairs and run one half as a singleton? 2) Did Laira ever have an allocation of class 14s?

 

D

[Kris]

 

Two questions: Did BR(W) ever split 'B' set pairs and run one half as a singleton? 2) Did Laira ever have an allocation of class 14s?

 

 

1 - Single coach trains were known on the Kingsbridge branch but I couldn't tell you the dia of the coaches in question so don't know if these were from a "B Set"

2 - Yes and during the 50's (there were 2 allocated) but I have no idea where they were used as the Saltash shuttle used 64xx's and most of the local branches used 45xx's

[Donw]

Don..., having watched a couple of layouts for a while on Sunday I was surprised how acceptable I found the flow of stock through standard Peco medium turnouts (quoted as a nominal radius of 1828mm (72in). I appreciate that A5s are a fraction tighter than that but if an 0-6-0 loco and a 6-wheel milk tanker will run through them that'll be an OK compromise for me. Otherwise, in the space I have available, I'd almost certainly end up with more turnout than plain track - not the effect I'm after at all!

 

And whilst I admire the efforts of those who really know their trackwork and who build to the nth degree of scale precision I'm going to have to invoke the dread word 'compromise' again (...please put the gun down all those of you to whom that word is anathema). It is, after all, the availablility of stock compontents - particularly C&L's ready-made common crossings, blades and Timbertracks turnout bases - which prompted my venture into hand-built track in this scale in the first place. The outcome so far (given that it's taken several weeks as a consequence of the number of hours I work) is something that looks suspiciously like a turnout, may conceivably just work like one; and personally I'm not entirely unhappy with that ;-)

 

D

 

David no criticism intended my first turnout were someway from the real things but you learn as you go. What I was trying to do was point out the turnout radius of an A5 etc. The closure radius is quoted on the protoype tables and could easily be made available with the templates. It is also a fact that you can adjust turnout geometry quite a bit and still have it work. However when you mate turns up with a large pacific and it wont go through the turnouts you realise its horses for courses. The Peco point uses a shallower crossing about 1:7 I think but a sharper switch. This works well in model form as it keeps the radius down but has very little transistion inrto the curve. It works well in model form but full size would be subject to a severe speed reduction.

Ken Payne has a superb layout using Peco points and can run all sorts of stock at fast speeds. Looks good too.

Don

[dikitriki]

I can't help thinking that we going down a set-track route in discussing Peco points and geometry. Peco points occupy a lot of space and are inflexible in geometry. David, you have shown a clear ability to construct points. Why not start thinking about curved points and a layout plan as a whole. Apart from being able to get more in with curved points, it all flows much more satisfactorily. Don't go down the Peco route.

 

Tony posted a photo of Heyside on Western Thunder which illustrates what I mean. http://www.westernthunder.co.uk/index.php?threads/re-heyside-7mm-l-y-late-50s-early-60s.552/page-15#post-30453

I don't know whether you need to register to see the photo.

 

Richard

[Webbo]

David,

Richard is right, I have seen all the photo's of Heyside with the superb flowing trackwork, unfortunately I have not seen the layout in the flesh.

Keep with the hand made pointwork the end result is much more like the prototype, and you will also have the satisfaction of building it all yourself.

Alan

[Donw]

If you enjoy or just tolerate making track you can achieve a better result and flowing trackwork. However for those who don't enjoy it or just lack the time you can still build a good looking layout. I mentioned Ken Payne's well known layout as an example. I am one of the first to encourage people to have a go a track making but I wouldn't want those who do not like or want to make track should not be made to feel second class. It is the same with building stock rather than buying it these should all be choices. Also sometimes as a beginer it can be good to takes things in steps building track could be a choice for later.

Don

[dikitriki]

Don

 

I couldn't agree more.

 

However, I made a judgment call based on what I have seen of David's work, on David's thread, that he has the ability (and clearly the inclination or he wouldn't have got this far) to build some quality pointwork. I suppose my real point (ha!) is that if you are going to make your own track, move away from the set-track mentality.

 

Richard

[David Siddall]

The things is guys, I agree with all of you to varying degrees, completely respect your various suggestions and opinions, and would like to say a big thank you to those who complimented my progress so far. Positive feedback from those to whose standards I can only as yet aspire is really appreciated.

 

However, referring to Peco points doesn't mean I'm contemplating baleing out and returning to ready-to-plonk! Merely that I'm using terms of reference which are familiar to me as a beginner (and probably will be to others at a similar stage). Indeed the components for hand-built turnout No. 2 have just arrived in the post, I've got an order in with Exactoscale for some accurate bridge chairs for it; and I picked up a pile of plain track components at the Bristol show on Sunday.

 

What I'm aiming for with this project is trackwork which provides me with greater satisfaction than properietary items (IMO, 'too many' compromises), within a timeframe in which getting to the 'running stage' feels achievable.

 

The availability of stock components such as those supplied by C&L is therefore to me an absolute godsend. They're allowing me to progress in stages and to achieve measurable goals. And most importantly I feel more a lot more comfortable ascending a learning curve than climbing a wall...

 

D

 

PS: I do appreciate the siren call to 'flowing pointwork' and yes, I cannot disagree, Hemyock flows. However when I look at the main running lines at Princetown I see a track plan that appears to have been laid out with a ruler... this suggests to me that any attempt to recreate representative fictional track plans for our models should involve a bit of head-scratching about the local topography and how this would have influenced railway engineers in real life?

[dikitriki]

One last gratuitous shot, then I shall let David continue with his thread.

 

'The end of the day'

 

 

Richard

[David Siddall]

One last gratuitous shot, then I shall let David continue with his thread.

 

Richard, you photos (gratuitious or otherwise ;-) are an inspiriation to anyone starting out in the handbuilt-track building game - anytime you feel like adding more, please feel free!

 

D

 

PS: And I think your photo sums up my suggestion about 'topography to a 't'. Your track flows because the topography suggests it should... utterly superb :-)

[David Siddall]

And here it is... my first hand-built O Gauge turnout! It's taken a while bit I think it's been worth it. Preliminary painting and weathering complete but obviously a tad more of the latter required once in place.

 

 

Just five more to go... :-)

[David Siddall]

...and the latest version of my track-plan adapted to use A5 turnouts throughout with the sector plate replaced by a traverser to release locos without the need for handling. I know that choosing A5s will be controversial to some but, given the restricted space I have available, they'll mean a longer run-in, platform and goods yard sidings.

 

 

I haven't finally decided on 2' baseboard width though. Hopefully, I'll be able to consider 2'6" - more on which in due course.

 

And because I can resist just about anything but temptation... another shot of turnout No 1.

 

 

All in all a very satisfying weekend (...and yes, I will straighten that tie bar :-)

 

D

[Webbo]

David,

That looks brill for the first one, hopefully the second will be a quicker build for you.

Alan

[dikitriki]

Hi David

 

Well done!

 

It must give you an immense sense of satisfaction seeing the completed point, and it looks so much better than a commercial product. They do get a lot quicker, now you know what the pitfalls are. I reckon on a good day's work for a 'simple' point, which includes fabricating the crossing nose and blades from scratch.

 

I think your track plan is clever too, in that, if I read it right, you have the appearance of curved trackwork using straight points.

 

Yours

 

Richard

[hayfield]

David

 

I wish my first turnout was as good as that, knocks the socks off RTR track. 0 gauge does have its benefits when building tiebars etc, but imperfections are easier spotted. So a far harder subject to do well than in smaller scales. Well done great bit of modelling

[David Siddall]

Thanks guys, that's much appreciated... and yes I really am rather pleased with how it's turned out :-)

 

Richard... you're absolutely right, there's not a single curved point in my latest track plan. But if it's giving the 'impression' of a curved formation then I think I'm pretty near to a final design.

 

John... not only does the larger scale highlight any imperfections, photographing the outcome does so to an even greater degree! Fortunately the human eye is quite adept at taking 'a view' of a whole subject ;-)

 

Alan and Richard... re. the amount of time it takes to build stuff, I'm sure that I'll speed up as I gain experience but my pace is positively glacial compared to some modellers. The thought of building a turnout in a day really appeals, however so does the thought of finding an uninterrupted day in which to build a turnout! No 1 was built in the few hours I managed to grab over a series of weekends (...and as a result it's painfully apparent that my solitary wagon kit still hasn't see so much as seen a waft of primer yet!). So I think what I'm saying is: subject to the arrival of my order for 'bridge chairs' from Exactoscale I'm hoping to start turnout number two this weekend... but it may take some time! ;-)

 

TTFN and thanks again...

 

David