RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted March 31, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 31, 2012 Hi Alan, That's looking very tidy indeed. Excellent and interesting work - thanks for updating! cheers Ben A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted March 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 31, 2012 That track looks very interesting Alan. Could be very handy for bridge sections (well if you removed the broad gauge bit). Any chance of a better photo of it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DavidLong Posted March 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 31, 2012 That track looks very interesting Alan. Could be very handy for bridge sections (well if you removed the broad gauge bit). Any chance of a better photo of it? Sacrilege, Mr. Dean! About time we had some broad gauge in 2FS and you from South Devon and all. I haven't seen any 2FS broad gauge for thirty years since Paul Styles was experimenting with it in the early 1980s and very impressive it was too. The way things are shaping up in the 2mm Scale Association then pre-grouping, which may include the Brunel gauge, is looking to be the future. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 The tool just knows how to spit out straight track for any gauge or pair of gauges with sleeper spacing or baulk and cross spacing specified at the time. The big limit is the material. With plastic you'd make the chairs slightly tight and they'd bend a bit holding the track firmly. With FUD you can't do that as it would instead simply crack the tops off the chairs. So the track is slightly loose and would need securing some other way or glueing to the base too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 And testing the next bits of Gresley work. This didn't quite come out the way I intended as I forgot to move the battery boxes off centre. A bit of extreme violence and some Ultima white metal ones later however we are getting there. I also need to make the trussing a shade longer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted March 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 31, 2012 The tool just knows how to spit out straight track for any gauge or pair of gauges with sleeper spacing or baulk and cross spacing specified at the time. The big limit is the material. With plastic you'd make the chairs slightly tight and they'd bend a bit holding the track firmly. With FUD you can't do that as it would instead simply crack the tops off the chairs. So the track is slightly loose and would need securing some other way or glueing to the base too. Thanks for that Alan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Good imaginitive work here. The folk who want GWR 'Concertina' stock should first try glazing them. Bad enough in 4mm! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 And a bit of GWR just in case everyone gets fed up of the Late and Never Early Railway... I've not done the underframe bits and buffer yet or finished the bogie coupling mounts. It actually shows up a real problem with the N scale bogies. The van is very narrow while generic N scale axles and thus bogies all use 15-15.7mm axles. I had this problem before with dumb buffered wagons, and here again I shall need to swap the bogies for 2mm SA ones which use rather more sensibly proportioned parts and will avoid the problem. For those wondering why the huge bogies - these vans date back to the world where money actually meant something and you couldn't print giant fictional IOU's with 'dollar' written on them. In those days currency was gold backed and that meant now and then you had to reckon up and trundle chunks around the world. These vans ran between London and Plymouth shifting gold bullion between the UK and the USA. The all metal body for security and the comparatively giant bogies for the weight involved. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Hi Alan Looks good, I must admit this wan on my long term to do list. I'll watch this thread with interest, keep up the good work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richbrummitt Posted April 1, 2012 Share Posted April 1, 2012 And a bit of GWR... This would be one of those occasions where a full side transfer would make a lot of sense to help with lettering and lining. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted April 1, 2012 Author Share Posted April 1, 2012 The axle problem is a bit of a pain for that. I don't know any sources of 7mm wheels on sensibly short axles except the 2mmSA - annoyingly they've sold out at the moment as well so it'll have to wait a bit. Certainly it can't be built sensibly with standard N gauge wheels. Otherwise it's a nice simple thing to throw together - I need to print some GWR buffers for it I guess as the ones I have are a bit chunky for GWR. Mainly it was done to prove that I could get roof ribs and curved in ends generated properly. Richard - not sure about the transfer. What is wrong with an aerosol of *maroon* paint ? For GWR I agree though 8) I did talk to Adam briefly about this for the coaches. In theory there is no reason why you can't swap the etched sides for vinyl on thin clear plastic for hard liveries. That said teak is actually a very easy livery to paint providing you skip the incredibly fine lining. I spent today making jewellery for someone and failing to master playing barre chords, however so the pile didn't make the paint shop. Don't suppose anyone knows what colour the driving interior and the ends of the LNER push-pull trailer were ? Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richbrummitt Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 What is wrong with an aerosol of *maroon* paint ? What is *right* with an aerosol of maroon paint ? For GWR I agree though 8) You did say it was a GWR vehicle and not a BR one. Barre chords aren't easy when you're starting. I found that practicing on lighter strings and building up worked well. Also you can try wrapping the second finger behind first to help add pressure to the strings and omitting the second finger you can still play the top four strings and not hear much difference. (I'm assuming you are trying type I rather than type II) If it comes to it just play the top two strings hard as a 'power chord'. Palm mute the rest or achieve the same effect with the left hand.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 And a bit of GWR just in case everyone gets fed up of the Late and Never Early Railway... Very nice, I might be up for one of these. Any idea what they were used for post-WW2? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Higgs Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 The tool just knows how to spit out straight track for any gauge or pair of gauges with sleeper spacing or baulk and cross spacing specified at the time. The big limit is the material. With plastic you'd make the chairs slightly tight and they'd bend a bit holding the track firmly. With FUD you can't do that as it would instead simply crack the tops off the chairs. So the track is slightly loose and would need securing some other way or glueing to the base too. Very nice indeed. But I see what you mean about flexible. Presumably it could be made with slots in the baulks to take brass cross members. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Higgs Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Next bits arrived. This one is currently on the wrong bogies as I printed it for Farish type bogies and I've run out of NGS ones. I've also printed another test coach with Dapol bogies, but I'm still not happy with the mounting for that. More work needed there. The other bits see to be sorted, including various minor sizing glitches, correcting the vac cylinder locations and the like. The brake showed up a new bug in the roof code I didn't spot until assembling but that was fixable with a file and will get fixed in software next attempt. I've also printed some Gresley buffers in FUD which have come out nicely, the GWR bullion van to test curved ends, some Dapol coupling adapters to use the Dapol bogies in these coaches and mount couplings on the bogies, and a piece of dual gauge baulk track (which is what the coach is sitting on). The track is a little flexible. I think to use it beyond display you'd need to put in a short section of matching brass profile every so often and solder the rail to that for strength. Alan The one thing that does stick out a bit is the overthick footboards, presumably the 1mm minimum wall thickness. Does the technology allow for these to be tapered so the edges appear thinner? That would also allow the Concertinas to be done, as the door pillars on those were at an angle. Chris Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 Very nice indeed. But I see what you mean about flexible. Presumably it could be made with slots in the baulks to take brass cross members. Currently it's got a slot in the base to keep the material use to a minimum as FUD is pricy. You could thread something down that but it occurs to me that you could equally print it with the slot at the top, solder the rail to the bar instead and slide it down the slot (or I guess get some rail drawn which has a Pecoesque base to fit the baulks) For FUD you can do similar things to white metal except that instead of casting around a rod or similar you print with a suitable sized hole, add glue and stuff the rod down it. For the footboards it's a material limit. They could be filed thinner or you could use FUD instead (0.3mm-0.4mm wall thickness) but that makes the vehicle a lot more expensive. I suspect concertina's would have to be in FUD. The good news is the processes are getting better, the bad news I suspect is that the rapidly increasing demand means we'll see prices steady for a while before they fall off. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 Very nice, I might be up for one of these. Any idea what they were used for post-WW2? Sending lots of UK gold to America as part of the great 'lend lease' racket I imagine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Higgs Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 For the footboards it's a material limit. They could be filed thinner or you could use FUD instead (0.3mm-0.4mm wall thickness) but that makes the vehicle a lot more expensive. I suspect concertina's would have to be in FUD. The good news is the processes are getting better, the bad news I suspect is that the rapidly increasing demand means we'll see prices steady for a while before they fall off. I presume you are thinking about making the final parts using this method. But is there also the possibility to use FUD for a master which is then resin cast? When I first started doing my resin coach roofs we looked at doing the masters using 3D printing, but it wasn't up to the job and they ended up being machined instead. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share Posted April 2, 2012 I presume you are thinking about making the final parts using this method. But is there also the possibility to use FUD for a master which is then resin cast? When I first started doing my resin coach roofs we looked at doing the masters using 3D printing, but it wasn't up to the job and they ended up being machined instead. Chris It should be possible, you'd have to pick wall thicknesses to suit the resin. The man to ask is Atso as I believe the LNER pigeon van was done that way. I've certainly no interesting in going via resin. I've found resin to either be very expensive, or extremely unreliable with differences between castings enough to mess up fits or indeed both. 3D print isn't perfectly reproduceable either but its a lot better. I think you could do roofs to the standard of your machined ones using FUD now, providing you were careful on the orientation (which might mean using someone other than Shapeways). Basically you'd need to guarantee the supporting material was on the underside of the roof. so that the top was very smooth and any roughness from the support was out of sight. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atso Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Yes, the pigeon van master was made in FUD and then cast. I did this so that I could remove the print lines on the master and get a consistant finish for each van. 3D printing does create some size/fit problems if interchanging parts between batches but for bits printed on the same machine at the same time this isn't usually a problem. Print orientation is a bit of a pain as some models would be so much easier to finish if the printing firms printed them in a certain direction. However, this is the price we pay for an affordable service. I'm sure that we will be able to specify the orientation at a later date but for the moment it is pot luck - with Shapeways at least! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Print orientation is a bit of a pain as some models would be so much easier to finish if the printing firms printed them in a certain direction. However, this is the price we pay for an affordable service. I'm sure that we will be able to specify the orientation at a later date but for the moment it is pot luck - with Shapeways at least! I know it's not much use with this application, ie FUD, but print orientation is possible at I materialise, if you're doing anything there and wanted in printed in a certain way contact their customer services and they'll pretty much sort it out for you, all my stuff there is now printed how I want it rather than how they chose to do it. Just a heads up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted April 6, 2012 Author Share Posted April 6, 2012 Been getting a few more bits ready to send off. The first CAD for the Thompson is done although I want to take another look at the roof as it feels slightly 'humpy' compared with the prototype. The other trivial tool I did takes the distance from the centre of the wheel, the wall thickness, the thickness needed and the distance between the top and out comes... That's another annoying N scratch-building job mechanised ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted May 6, 2012 Author Share Posted May 6, 2012 Some dry sunny weather and I've had time to start painting up the test coaches. Still fiddling with details for the production ones. Getting the Dapol bogie mounts right turns out to be quite tricky. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted May 16, 2012 Author Share Posted May 16, 2012 Some more bits arrived today. Partly I'm testing a few ideas for very small objects also things like buffers which work very well in FUD. I've managed a couple of things on this attempt that didn't quite work before. Firstly a proper working NEM pocket in FUD. That took a bit of jiggling as its fractions of a mm stuff. I've also got the track to fit tightly this time. It's still not very strong and all the dire 2mm easitrac warnings about filing the rail first actually really matter in this case. Other than that some experiments in how fine you can go (N gauge pullman lamps with a proper hollow space between the lamp and shade), a OO gauge angle-poise lamp and a T gauge clayhood where the standard T wheels just clip in. I've also been experimenting with FUD coach sides. That didn't work out quite as well as I hoped with Metropolitan Rigid 8 coaches. The sides in this case are flat and so promptly warped. A kettle and a flat surface mostly cures it but it's not ideal. I think rev 2 may be printed as a single part roof/body shell. They also managed to print it edge on but fortunately such that the fine lining marks are always in the grain direction of the wood on the coach. The end result is a surface better than I could intentionally print. Next problem is to sort out the underfame. Making it rigid won't work so I'm playing with the idea of bogies hidden behind an apparently rigidset of underframe sides. For the sides it seems you can print them flat/kit like only if they are small or have a curve. The curve is enough to keep them rigid. Straight flat coach sides without bracing is a fail with the current process. I've also finally got the Gresley suburban bogie mounts right so they don't need fiddling around with washers. Those will now go into production as hopefully will the Thompson suburbans once I've checked the etch fit. Photos to follow when I've painted some bits up - it's pretty much impossible to photograph FUD without paint as its so translucent. Alan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 First photo. It's a bit hard to photograph some of these little bits with a phone. Anyway First test (underframe work and the like left to do) tester for the T gauge clayhood. Anglepoise lamp in 4mm (couldn't quite do it in N with current technology) I've no particular use for 4mm anglepoise lamps but it seemed to a good tester for extreme limits 8) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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