Dock Green

[Simond]

Yes they are, and good they sound.

 

But it would be clever indeed for a chip to be presynchronised to any gearbox ratio that the kit builder may have used in the loco!

 

Best

Simon

[bgman]

Chaz,

 

I assume you will be doing it on a rolling road, otherwise you'll need at least 4-6 ft of track when it whizzes off !

[chaz]

Chaz

 

I hope you’ll be able to do it - once the track is set up, and cleaned, it won’t take long to do the auto tune (seconds!!!) but I find the chuff synch does take a few minutes - I guess you might be lucky and get it right first go!

 

Unfortunately Basingstoke is a long drag from Kent, so I won’t see you or Dock Green, mores the pity

 

Hope the show goes well

Simon

Chaz

 

I hope you’ll be able to do it - once the track is set up, and cleaned, it won’t take long to do the auto tune (seconds!!!) but I find the chuff synch does take a few minutes - I guess you might be lucky and get it right first go!

 

Unfortunately Basingstoke is a long drag from Kent, so I won’t see you or Dock Green, mores the pity

 

Hope the show goes well

Simon

 

 

Golly, so good you wrote it twice! Thanks for the good wishes.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Chaz,

 

I assume you will be doing it on a rolling road, otherwise you'll need at least 4-6 ft of track when it whizzes off !

 

No. The back track, from off stage to the arrival line stop block is 16 feet, which I judge to be more than long enough. In fact when I did the Peckett it did about 42 inches, although admittedly its driving wheels are a fair bit smaller then the J6's.

 

Chaz

Edited March 8, 2018 by chaz

[chaz]

Murphy's law strikes again Chaz.

That's interesting what you say about "sync the chuff" I'm still slowly blundering my way around my Lenz Programing.  Their German/English manual isn't the most logical in its explanations. but I have found a USA flowchart for V3.6 which helps a lot being a one page show all.  You need to get the detail from the manual but it does guide me to the right area.

 

Anyway back to Chuff, does this need doing if I purchase a ready blown chip for say a Terrier.  I've always thought a ready blown one was all set up.?

 

Cheers have a great show.

 

To be honest, I don't know. With my kit built locos I have always had to adjust them to get the required 4 chuffs per rev' of the wheels. I suppose it depends on whether the bloke who sets up the sound project bothers to do the sync'. Then of course if he assumes a 4mm model that might not apply accurately to one to 7mm.

 

Synchronising is not that big a deal. I have found that if you get it right for notch one and again for 4 or 5 the rest will look OK. At any speed I defy anyone to watch and listen and then pronounce it right or wrong.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Weathering progress on the J6...

 

 

First some mess on the inside motion...

 

 

Nothing very sophisticated - as you can see in the next snap the motion can only really be glimpsed as the loco' passes.

 

Heather had already weathered the frames of the loco' and the top of the tender for me. 

Shock, Horror, yesterday morning I suddenly discovered that my only tin of Humbrol enamel No 62 (leather) had completely dried out - and the model shop in Eastleigh is not open on Wednesday. OK, I thought, necessity is akin to Frank Zappa. I had plenty of No 62 (leather) acrylic and this is one of my favourite weathering colours, so acrylic it is.

 

 

Here's how far I had got at nine this evening. All the paint applied with "flatty" brushes, mostly using the dry-brush technique, or nearly dry. All four colours I used are ranged along the front. From L to R - Tamiya XF85 rubber black, Humbrol 62 leather, 113 rust and RC401 coal (satin) black. I prefer to work within a very restricted colour range so that the effect is reasonably consistent. On the right are pots of Humbrol black weathering powder and plain talc. I add these to the tacky paint in places to add texture, dropping them on and spreading them with a soft brush, sometimes blowing them across the surface . The talc can be left so that it imparts a dusty look or overpainted once the paint below it is dry to colour the texture.

 

I have walked away from the model now and will leave it to harden overnight. In the morning I will look at it afresh. Are there any bits I missed? Have I gone far enough, or indeed overdone it? If the latter I will need to tone it down, possibly with a fine overall spray with the airbrush - that's about the only thing I use the airbrush for these days.

 

I will take some photos of the loco at Basingstoke when the weathering should be seen more clearly.

 

Chaz

Edited March 9, 2018 by chaz

[chaz]

I was looking at that last shot on the screen once I had posted it and I realised that it doesn't show what I have done very well so I fiddled with some settings in Lightroom and here's the same shot a little clearer I hope - maybe not.

 

 

I have found that the camera often lies when it comes to weathering.

 

Chaz

Edited March 8, 2018 by chaz

[sb67]

That looks great Chaz, did you mix your paints with any thinners, I'd like to try acrylics I've heard they can dry really fast when weathering? Look forward to seeing some pics of the J6 on the layout.

Steve.

[chaz]

That looks great Chaz, did you mix your paints with any thinners, I'd like to try acrylics I've heard they can dry really fast when weathering? Look forward to seeing some pics of the J6 on the layout.

Steve.

 

 

I do have a bottle of acrylic thinners and I did find it useful to "wake-up" the paint on the palette, however making paint too wet (runny) does work against the dry brush technique. However the speed of drying of the paint proved useful. Adding weathering powder and talc over the sticky paint surface seemed rather easier than it sometimes is with enamels. You do have to work fast so it seems best to put small amounts of paint onto the palette, large dollops will just be wasted. I use a stirrer to transfer small amounts of paint when weathering, never taking paint from the pot with the brush which would risk contaminating the colour with a mixture.

 

On the subject of economy I have found that I rarely use all the paint in a tinlet of enamel. The last quarter, or more, is wasted as it hardens in the tin and is discarded. So far the acrylics I am using have stayed liquid, indeed the pot of Humbrol RC401 I used on the J6 is almost empty with just a little in the bottom but this residue is still useful.

 

I see myself converting from enamels to acrylics - a complete conversion will depend on how well it goes through the airbrush - if that goes well I don't think I will be buying any more enamels.

 

Comparing the Tamiya paints with the Humbrol the former seem more liquid and will probably need less thinning to use in an airbrush.

 

Chaz

Edited March 9, 2018 by chaz

[bgman]

There's always the debate about which to use, but for the last few years I've gone over to 90% use of acrylics, mainly Vallejo and also Tamiya, both of which I am happy to use through my airbrushes.

Don't know if its me but the Humbrol enamel range don't seem as good these days, again mentioned elsewhere in this parish so best not go into that eh !

 

The loco weathering looks fine Chaz, hope you will enjoy using the acrylics in future.

 

Grahame

[chaz]

A bit more work on the J6 weathering, and some thoughts on the process.

 

First my brush collection.

 

 

Some new, some well worn, all still useful. I find it worthwhile having a lot of brushes. The ones in the pot with the green plastic handles were a really cheap set I picked up in a Suffolk bookshop and have proved very good once the odd stuff keeping the hairs in shape has been washed out with white spirit. 

 

And here's a "palette", a piece of a cereal box with plenty of white on it. White is good as the paint colours are not falsified and, of course it can go in the bin at the end of a session. 

 

 

On the card are three short stirrers that can be dipped and will transfer pure colour to the card to be mixed.

 

The loco propped up so that the front can be seen and painted.

 

 

I prefer this to holding the model in my hand - no risk of damage to delicate parts, no smudging of wet paint and no chance it will be dropped.

 

 

above - The rear of the tender top with some Humbrol weathering powder - dark earth - brushed into the surface. I rather like the look that the colour gives. Weathering powders can work well but really need a matte or textured surface.

 

 

Here I am about to add some Humbrol weathering powder - rust - into the bottom corner around the tank filler. I used a very small amount as I feel it's best to avoid too much rust - working locomotives were not allowed to go rusty; at the very end of steam yes, but in the late fifties dirty, oily, grimy, but not rusty. If the paint on the smokebox burnt off (as it did if ash was allowed to pile up) a quick coat of black was slapped on.

 

 

And that's the result of adding a little rust around the water hatch. Quite a satisfying effect I think.

 

Weathering is fun and can make a model much more convincing. If you want some help to get started I recommend Martyn Welch's excellent book "The Art of Weathering". Don't feel you have to follow it slavishly but it will give you lots of ideas.

 

Chaz

 

 

 

 

 

 

[chaz]

There's always the debate about which to use, but for the last few years I've gone over to 90% use of acrylics, mainly Vallejo and also Tamiya, both of which I am happy to use through my airbrushes.

Don't know if its me but the Humbrol enamel range don't seem as good these days, again mentioned elsewhere in this parish so best not go into that eh !

 

The loco weathering looks fine Chaz, hope you will enjoy using the acrylics in future.

 

Grahame

 

 

No need for a debate Grahame. I used to be an enamels-only painter, I am now moving towards acrylics as you have done - but I can see merits in both. My advice to those contemplating their first weathering job - experiment, find methods that work well for you and don't be afraid to try different approaches. Use enamels and acrylics (but not together!) and decide which one you prefer. 

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Yesterday morning at Basingstoke before the show opened I abandoned my attempts to program the J6 - mainly because it's so long since I did a loco I couldn't remember quite how to do it and the Lenz DCC users amongst you might be familiar with what a pain the manual is to use. I did manage to get the auto-tune done and so could operated the loco on the default address - No 3.

 

In an earlier post I wrote "The loco has had most of two whole days running in on the rolling road so should be nice and free and ready to put the DCC in." Well it wasn't, quite. There was still a slight hesitancy in its movement, although it moved away as slowly as you could hope. I had a conversation with Heather (who built the loco for me) and Adrian (?) who built the inside valve gear. They both suggested the inside motion as the probable cause and the cure? - another period of running in with Brasso rather than oil as a very mild abrasive. This to be washed out with IPA and replaced with some fresh oil. 

 

On a happier note the layout worked really well. The thorough session Peter and I had two weeks ago cleaning all the track and reapplying graphite (it was two years since this was last done!) meant that all the locos performed almost* faultlessly (* mustn't tempt fate). "Susan", the 0-4-0ST, never stalled once and worked the industrial estate for most of the day. "Christine", my Ixion Hudswell Clarke, disgraced itself with what I hope is a failed speaker and will need a replacement before it runs again. All the stock ran really well (graphite is the bizz) and I only saw one derailment. The few embarrassing moments were down to operator error to which sadly I was as prone as anyone. The comment "Whose railway is this anyway" was heard on more than one occasion. 

 

A good day yesterday. We enjoyed it and there were plenty of spectators watching. The only problem was that the sports hall we were in got very warm with so many people and a fire alarm (thankfully false) in the afternoon gave us all a chance to go outside and get some air.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Sunday at Basingstoke went well. There were fewer visitors so the hall did not get quite so hot.

 

We did have a spot of bad luck when we were loading the van. When we started it was dry and fairly bright. Half way through the process, whilst we had some stuff outside the van waiting to be put in it started to rain, hard. We quickly got everything in that was on the ground and had to close the doors as the rain was coming in through both sets. The rain stopped as quickly as it had started in about five minutes it seemed and we were then able to complete the loading. 

 

I was concerned that the layout and stock might suffer water damage but when we unloaded the van in Eastleigh things didn't look as bad as I had feared. Later today I will open up the layout to examine it and give it a chance to thoroughly dry. If any surfaces are water marked or show other damage I might have to clean or repaint but I am hopeful that little will need doing. It was unlucky, if we had started loading ten minutes earlier or later we would not have had a problem at all.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

First a quick note on the possible water damage - I had a look at the layout this morning and you can't tell that it had got wet - the rain seems to have dried off and left no trace. I will have a closer look later but I think it's OK.

 

____________________________________________________

 

I took quite a few photos on Saturday, almost all of which feature 64253, the J6. Here are a sample...

 

 

 

 

 

Just one comment about the above - When it comes to weathering the camera often lies. The front part of the footplate is not as sandy brown as it looks here. The weathering powder seems to have been overemphasised by the camera (a Panasonic compact).

 

 

That's enough for the moment. If there's any appetite for more I will post 'em later (I took 57 and some of them are worth a look).

 

Chaz

Edited March 12, 2018 by chaz

[bgman]

 "If there's any appetite for more I will post 'em later (I took 57 and some of them are worth a look)."

 

Yes please !

[Siberian Snooper]

The loco, is looking the dogs wots its. The weathering finishes it of nicely.

[keefr2]

 "If there's any appetite for more I will post 'em later (I took 57 and some of them are worth a look)."

 

Yes please !

 

Seconded!

[chaz]

OK lads, I get the message! More will follow, maybe tomorrow.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Should the dirt on the steps on the loco match that on the tender?

 

Putting the camera on the track often gives the best views.

 

 

 

Two of my three ex-GNR locos.

 

Chaz

 

 

 

 

[keefr2]

P1070808-1.jpg

Should the dirt on the steps on the loco match that on the tender?

I wouldn't necessarily have thought so Chaz, ground conditions differ all over the place, there could have been a muddier puddle immediately under the tender steps, leading to boots leaving more earthy tones on them. I think your weathering looks very natural as is, and making areas 'match' could lead to it looking more formulaic. Just my opinion of course...

 

Cracking pictures, thanks for taking the time to post them. I really believe I'm doomed to ever see Dock Green live though - we were in Hampshire again this weekend, but were up for a family 'event' on Saturday, and of course it was Mother's Day on Sunday, so no chance of sneaking away for a few hours...

 

Keith

[sb67]

Always love photo's of Dock Green, thank you Chaz. The J6 looks fantastic, not sure if I've missed it but do you seal your weathering powders after applying them?

Steve.

[chaz]

I wouldn't necessarily have thought so Chaz, ground conditions differ all over the place, there could have been a muddier puddle immediately under the tender steps, leading to boots leaving more earthy tones on them. I think your weathering looks very natural as is, and making areas 'match' could lead to it looking more formulaic. Just my opinion of course...

 

Cracking pictures, thanks for taking the time to post them. I really believe I'm doomed to ever see Dock Green live though - we were in Hampshire again this weekend, but were up for a family 'event' on Saturday, and of course it was Mother's Day on Sunday, so no chance of sneaking away for a few hours...

 

Keith

 

 

Keith, you really must get your priorities right.....   Dock Green's next outing will be the Fine Scale do at Aylesbury in May.

 

Thanks for the comments, much appreciated.

 

Chaz

[chaz]

Always love photo's of Dock Green, thank you Chaz. The J6 looks fantastic, not sure if I've missed it but do you seal your weathering powders after applying them?

Steve.

 

Seal the weathering powders? No, I don't. Adding any sort of seal (a varnish?) is likely to change its look. Providing the surface has a key or the powder is applied on to wet or tacky paint it should not be necessary. On the J6 the powders were brushed into the surface quite vigorously, so any loose powder has gone and what's left should stay put .

 

On the other hand adding powder to an untreated RTR model is not likely to be permanent as the finish will lack any sort of key - the powder will come off on fingers when the model is handled.

 

Chaz

[81A Oldoak]

Seal the weathering powders? No, I don't. Adding any sort of seal (a varnish?) is likely to change its look. Providing the surface has a key or the powder is applied on to wet or tacky paint it should not be necessary. On the J6 the powders were brushed into the surface quite vigorously, so any loose powder has gone and what's left should stay put .

 

On the other hand adding powder to an untreated RTR model is not likely to be permanent as the finish will lack any sort of key - the powder will come off on fingers when the model is handled.

 

Chaz

I agree with Chaz about not sealing powders. I dislike the way the colour and texture change, even with only light misting of Testor's Dullcote. If the powder wears away through handling then I simply apply some more. This may change the appearance of the loco, but then real weathering was not static either.

 

Chris