Enthusiasts in Hi-Vis

[PenrithBeacon]

Good job you weren't at Goathland last Friday, besides getting soaked you would have been exploding at the amount of Hi-Viz about. Some of my shots have been converted to monochrome in an attempt to stop it from standing out so much. Still, it made it easy to spot which were official railway people. The ones on the locos looked like 1950s footplatemen and those on the platform looked like old-time station foremen.

I think I'd have been spitting feathers! I'm thinking of visiting the GCR this weekend, the thought of two Bulleid pacifics on a double track mainline is too much of a temptation. Perhaps it'll be OK, perhaps not.

Regards

[PrestburyJack]

Just come back from the Deltic DPS 40th anniversary gala at the Bluebell - no enthusiasts in hi-viz; if fact, apart from the travelling fitter for the locomotives (who was wearing hi-viz overalls), no-one at all in hi-viz, even staff going on the line! Bluebell staff all wear black coats.

[Boris]

Just come back from the Deltic DPS 40th anniversary gala at the Blubell - no enthusiasts in hi-viz; if fact, apart from the travelling fitter for the locomotives, no-one at all in hi-viz, even staff going on the line! Bluebell staff all wear black coats.

 

It's good when they do that.  The NYMR is slowly starting to realise that orange hi-vis isn't particularly heritage and hopefully things will improve over the next couple of years, but when the culture is "look at me I work here" rather than "I need this for my job" its going to take a while.

[avonside1563]

A few years ago.... ok 15... I visited the NYMR and happened to know the driver. I'd been chatting to him at Grosmont standing on the platform and as he moved the loco over to the train one of the platform staff came along and demanded to know why I wasn't wearing a HiVi! I politely reminded him that I was standing on a platform so didn't need one but just shows the mentality that can become engrained.

[Boris]

A few years ago.... ok 15... I visited the NYMR and happened to know the driver. I'd been chatting to him at Grosmont standing on the platform and as he moved the loco over to the train one of the platform staff came along and demanded to know why I wasn't wearing a HiVi! I politely reminded him that I was standing on a platform so didn't need one but just shows the mentality that can become engrained.

The quality of the platform staff at Grosmont has improved since, unfortunately the idiot element have now moved elsewhere on the NYMR.  Is it sad that I can hazard a guess as to which member of platform staff it was?

[roythebus]

Errmmm.... he wouldn't have noticed someone wearing hivis, NOT wearing hivis? I don't suppose he would... I'm surprised that crossing keepers don't wear hivis at KESR. I don't see any useful reason for burger sellers to wear them, but it is the sort of unintended consequence which can appear when SSOW are applied to activities which they arent really intended to apply to, but no specific alternative exists.

 

Crossing keepers on the KESR DO wear hivis, the signalman at Tenterden is NOT required to wear on when doing the gates or the token. 

[Boris]

Crossing keepers on the KESR DO wear hivis, the signalman at Tenterden is NOT required to wear on when doing the gates or the token. 

Because he is in effect creating his own line block?  It sounds like a sensible idea and is common on several preserved railways.

[96701]

Because he is in effect creating his own line block?  It sounds like a sensible idea and is common on several preserved railways.

A crossing keeper got hit by a road vehicle when closing a gate across the road, so the rule on our route is for crossing keepers to wear all orange whilst dealing with gates. Different rules for different companies are okay, I assume it depends on whether or not your risk assessments require the wearing of orange in order to avoid injury or death.

[cal.n]

Anyone see this?

 

https://twitter.com/thebashmash?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

[TheSignalEngineer]

Nice to see when I was at East Lancs last weekend that there didn't seem to be any enthusiasts wearing HiViz on the platforms at Bury and Rawtenstall only those on the trackside in mid-section. Also. I only saw two staff in them, one obviously not crew on a loco and one at Townsend Fold Crossing. All station staff I noticed were wearing East Lancs railway uniforms and loco crews mostly in blue slops.

.

[BlackRat]

Why would you? Unless a complete belle ende x

[Boris]

Why would you? Unless a complete belle ende x

Because unfortunately the Homosapien Sensibilius is being out bred by the Homosapien Dumbassus

[Richard E]

Hivis has long been an issue in motorsport. All marshals and recovery crew are required to wear orange hivis - recovery are a full 'suit', marshals have a tabard. The design of the latter was changed this year from a tie side tabard to a waistcoat. Medical crew tend to have their own choice and I've seen green, red and orange.

 

There is an issue. Many taking photographs adopted the orange tabard (official photographers are now a different colour each year, blue has been one choice) and seemed to think that cars bounced off them. As we sadly found out 2 years ago they do not.

 

Last year I was working on Wales Rally GB as part of a fast intervention crew to go into an area that needed help. We had a spectator suffer a major heart attack and we went to the ambulance RVP to help there as it was on one of the spectator access roads. When the casualty was ready to be moved from the middle of the forest to the RVP the road was closed with two motorcycle police trying to divert traffic, they were, of course, in uniform with yellow hivis. They were pretty much ignored. So I and my driver weighed in, in orange hivis. And we were diverting the traffic with no issues at all! The police looked at each other and left us to it until the ambulance was ready to leave when they took up escort duties. Even then we ended up stopping traffic on the road for them.

 

I guess the lesson from this is that familiarity can breed contempt and that something that is different catches attention. As such the H&S culture is perhaps breeding a nonchalance that is self defeating.

[phil-b259]

Just come back from the Deltic DPS 40th anniversary gala at the Bluebell - no enthusiasts in hi-viz; if fact, apart from the travelling fitter for the locomotives (who was wearing hi-viz overalls), no-one at all in hi-viz, even staff going on the line! Bluebell staff all wear black coats.

 

The Bluebell do not permit the use of High vis by station staff signalmen or loco crews unless specific circumstances require it. In terms of day to day activities* this is usually only confined to when manning the foot crossings at stations on busy days (when simply escorting the occasional passenger no high vis is necessary)

 

*(should a station evacuation be necessary then high vis will be worn by staff for example)

 

If the Bluebell had a level crossing over a public road (which we don't) requiring the signalman to operate the gates manually, then wearing high-vis while doing so would probably recommanded - purely because of stupid motorists.

 

Holders of lineside photographers permits are instructed not to put on their high-vis until just before they are about to go trackside and to remove it as soon as they return to public areas.

 

Naturally S&T, P-way and other technical departments will be wearing high-vis by virtue of their frequent need to be 'on or near the line' (if they are working on a station platform they can keep them on)

[Boris]

All sounds like a very sensible policy to me. 

[rockershovel]

Hivis has long been an issue in motorsport. All marshals and recovery crew are required to wear orange hivis - recovery are a full 'suit', marshals have a tabard. The design of the latter was changed this year from a tie side tabard to a waistcoat. Medical crew tend to have their own choice and I've seen green, red and orange.

 

There is an issue. Many taking photographs adopted the orange tabard (official photographers are now a different colour each year, blue has been one choice) and seemed to think that cars bounced off them. As we sadly found out 2 years ago they do not.

 

Last year I was working on Wales Rally GB as part of a fast intervention crew to go into an area that needed help. We had a spectator suffer a major heart attack and we went to the ambulance RVP to help there as it was on one of the spectator access roads. When the casualty was ready to be moved from the middle of the forest to the RVP the road was closed with two motorcycle police trying to divert traffic, they were, of course, in uniform with yellow hivis. They were pretty much ignored. So I and my driver weighed in, in orange hivis. And we were diverting the traffic with no issues at all! The police looked at each other and left us to it until the ambulance was ready to leave when they took up escort duties. Even then we ended up stopping traffic on the road for them.

 

I guess the lesson from this is that familiarity can breed contempt and that something that is different catches attention. As such the H&S culture is perhaps breeding a nonchalance that is self defeating.

I do notice, travelling around our collapsing, congested, obstructed main road network, that traffic police are increasingly ignored on their rare appearances. Ambulances and fire engines, the traffic parts like the Red Sea for Moses... but traffic police sometimes have to bull their way through, and don’t always get through at all.

 

I suppose that motorists KNOW that “blues and twos” have no actual legal force, and see dangerous, obstructive or downright lunatic driving go unremarked every day... while everyone has a Gatso story of some sort, often involving vans by the roadside.

 

When I first visited the US, in about 1978 I was struck by how little respect the police commanded from the public - especially traffic police, who sometimes seemed to be regarded as little more than uniformed banditry. Armed State police seemed to devote much of their time to enforcing the rather curious American age-of-majority laws, particularly regarding under-age drinking on private property; the cousin I was visiting had been amazed when he visited us a few years before, at the laxity of British policing of such matters.

 

I’d be sorry to think our police were going that way, but it seems increasingly so.

[Coryton]

When I first visited the US, in about 1978 I was struck by how little respect the police commanded from the public - especially traffic police, who sometimes seemed to be regarded as little more than uniformed banditry. Armed State police seemed to devote much of their time to enforcing the rather curious American age-of-majority laws, particularly regarding under-age drinking on private property; the cousin I was visiting had been amazed when he visited us a few years before, at the laxity of British policing of such matters.

 

I believe the justification for the strict age limits on alcohol is to reduce drink driving.

 

I always thought that you ought to be able to drink at a younger age if you showed a non-drivers ID (which performs the various functions of a drivers license apart from the actual being-allowed-to-drive-a-car bit).

[rockershovel]

I believe the justification for the strict age limits on alcohol is to reduce drink driving.

 

I always thought that you ought to be able to drink at a younger age if you showed a non-drivers ID (which performs the various functions of a drivers license apart from the actual being-allowed-to-drive-a-car bit).

No, American age laws are rather different to ours. The age of consent is anything from 16 to 18, age of legal majority is mostly 18, you can drive (mostly) at 16, but the age of licence (to buy alcohol) is 21 in all mainland states AFAIK, and the age to vote is 21. Some states rule it illegal for under-21s to drink alcohol in their own homes, or when not in the presence of their parent or guardian (hence the film cliche of the police raiding a high-school-age party). This doesn’t encourage the populace to hold the law in high regard.

[faulcon1]

The use of the HiVis vest and all over clothing is becoming a bit out of hand. When you have per way work and the railway is shut for traffic there's no need for the volunteers to be suited in all over HiVis clothing. No trains are running. I dread the day when black liveried locos are required to have some HiVis treatment because they're deemed to not be visible enough. Perhaps a steam loco painted orange with broad reflective silver stripes for lining. All locos required to carry flashing strobe lights when moving. When reversing a reversing beeper is required to be activated. These are very extreme measures but they may become law as people get more stupid over time and require "nanny rules" to protect their idiotic behavior.

One role of governments is to look after the people. But governments are not their to rule the peoples lives. People have to be responsible for their own actions and this attitude of getting injured through your own stupidity so you can sue other people or companies has to cease. Genuine cases yes but if people trip over something because they've got their face glued to a phone then that's their problem and they should have no right to financial compensation whether they're in HiVis clothing or not.       

[Guest]

Possibly the easiest way to annoy a jobsworth wearing an unnecessary hi-vis vest is to accidentally bump into them and then say "sorry - I didn't see you".

[Tim Hall]

Possibly the easiest way to annoy a jobsworth wearing an unnecessary hi-vis vest is to accidentally bump into them and then say "sorry - I didn't see you".

My uncle used to do that with people dressed in camo gear in his local High St......