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Kelly Bray - Locomotives and rolling stock (LSWR 24T Brake Van)

7mmLSWR GWR SR Kit built stock




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#76 PD&SWJR

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Posted 18 December 2013 - 07:12

I have used the colour coding on most of the locos I have built.  Having carefully fettled up the square axle ends to remove burrs and likewise for the brass wheel boss inserts and generally achieved a good fit all round and smooth running, it pays to know which wheel is which.  The colours are nautical; green = starboard and red = port.


Edited by PD&SWJR, 18 December 2013 - 07:12 .


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#77 Ressaldar

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Posted 18 December 2013 - 12:09

Mike,

 

Have you any idea how many hours it took to build the PD&SWJR 0-6-2T?  Did you build it rigid as per the kit?

Hi Paul,

 

I apologise for not replying earlier, but your post seems to have slipped through under the radar.

 

I did not keep a build log for this loco, but the chassis photo is dated 11.03.10 and the first fully painted photo is dated 06.06.10 but I would have been involved with other things at the same time - A S Harris for example. I think that 4 - 6 weeks would be a good guess, and yes it is rigid as per the kit.

 

regards

 

Mike


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#78 PD&SWJR

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 18:01

I managed to make progress on the 57xx during the season of turkey, mince pies and modelling books by Gordon Gravett....

 

The brake gear was a bit of a muddle and a mess.  The side pull rods are from 0.7mm etched brass and had been bent and distorted out of shape by mishandling.  Also, the cross rods between the brake hangers were too short, resulting in the pull rods being too close to the wheels.  So the upper and lower cross rods for the front and middle axles were cut with a slitting disk.  Heat was then carefully applied to carefully remove the whitemetal brake hangers.  So I ended up with a kit a parts consisting of 6 brake hangers, 2 pull rods and a set of frames.  

 

Strips of 0.7 x 1.7mm nickle silver were sweated to either side of the brake pull rods.  This provides strength and improves the appearance.

 

New cross rods were made up from 1.7mm brass rod.  The wheels were temporarily refitted and the assembly systematically re-built. 

 

The job finished:

 

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A new short whistle shield was fabricated from nickle silver strip and brass wire attached at the back to form a mounting spigot which fits into a hole drilled into the top of the firebox.

 

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Replacement vacuum and steam pipes had been obtained from Warren Shepard.  These were sweated onto more nickle silver strip.  As I am not stripping the paint off the body, the strip will be glued behind the buffer beam.  The brake pipes provide additional fixing points on the front of the beams, but as the steam heating pipes hang down, longer strips were used to provide a larger surface area for the glue to bond.  On the left is the whistle shield.

 

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The next post will describe the fitting of 4mm scale plunger pick-ups to a 7mm scale loco.  Who said I always choose the easy options......?


Edited by PD&SWJR, 05 January 2014 - 18:04 .

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#79 N15class

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 18:40

Seems to be coming on nicely now. I always think the outside brake pulls are a bit on the thin side in kits. On some I have soldered wire to the inside bottom to give more strength without them looking too thick.


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#80 PD&SWJR

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 12:49

The 4mm plunger pick-up saga.

 

The original 7mm plunger pick-ups for the 57xx disintegrated when I stripped the chassis.  A friend who models 7mm scale had fitted 4mm plungers to a loco, so I thought I would have a go.  The make is a mystery, as there is nothing on the instructions revealing who was responsible.  As is the way, they did not assemble as per the instructions.  If the insulated wire was soldered into the nickle-silver plunger, the little spring would not fit over the wire insulation….  So, instead, I solder 0.4mm phosphor bronze wire into the plunger.

 

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The next problem was the hole in the frames.  The sleeve the plunger fits in required a 2mm hole, but the hole in the frame was 3.2mm.  I had previously made the pick-ups for my G6 using 3mm OD / 1.5mm ID semi rigid plastic tubing.  7mm lengths were cut off and glued into the frames using super glue gel.  A homemade jig was used to maintain alignment. 

 

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After a couple of hours, to ensure the glue is fully cured, rapid setting epoxy was used on the inside of the frames to build up a ‘shoulder’ around the sleeving. 

 

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When fully cured, a 2mm drill was run down the sleeves and then a tapered broach was used so ease out the hole, so that the plunger assembles were a snug, but not over tight fit. The outside face of the sleeve was filed down so that it was 0.5 – 0.7mm proud of the frames.  Experimentation showed that with the wheels fitted, contact was maintained with the backs of the wheels, but no binding was occurring.  A Vernier is helpful with this job.  I find that a Vernier and Micrometer are useful tools in 7mm, as one is moving into the realm of engineering with this scale and away from bodgit modelling!

 

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Simples!  :ok:


Edited by PD&SWJR, 09 January 2014 - 12:51 .

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#81 PD&SWJR

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 17:26

Second attempt at loading this page….. :banghead:

 

This afternoon, I reassembled the wheels and running gear to check that all was well after the work done.  I also trial fitted the vacuum and steam pipes.  Those photos are rotated through 180° to save all of you standing on your heads. :laugh_mini2:

Next, I will strip the frames down and clean them up.  I will glue copper coated glass fibre board to the inside of the lower firebox sides. These will act as electrical bus-bars. The horn guides etc. will be masked to prevent them being painted.

 

When the frames are complete, attention will revert to the body for finishing.

 

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#82 N15class

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 20:08

You are making a lovely job of the loco. I will be interested in how much of a difference there is between the two pickups.


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#83 PD&SWJR

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 08:50

Peter,

 

In theory, the 4mm plunger pickups should perform as well as 7mm ones, but we all know about theory..... :scratchhead: They have about 1.3mm 'plunge', though I have not accurately measured it. On the 57xx, the maximum axle side play is only 0.5mm, so theory says they should always be in contact. I have experienced problems with Slaters' 7mm plunger pickups before.  The springs are quite stiff and on my O2, on first fitting, the driving wheels were locked up.  I had to recess the plungers into the frames, a real faff.

 

I have a variety of pickup methods on my locos; Slaters plungers, home made plungers, 'A.N.Other' plungers and home made back scratchers. The conclusion for the best performance is that it makes no difference.  However, picking up on as many wheels as possible and a sprung / compensated set of frames does improve running reliability.


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#84 Mike Boucher

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 16:30

 

In theory, the 4mm plunger pickups should perform as well as 7mm ones, but we all know about theory..... :scratchhead: T

 

In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice.  But in practice there is...   :jester:


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#85 sej

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 21:07

Hi Paul, I'm very much enjoying this thread. You've got some photos of a lovely 39xx on your web-site/flickr collection. Could you tell us a bit about that?

 

Cheers

Simon



#86 PD&SWJR

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Posted 18 March 2014 - 14:19

Hi Simon,

 

The 39xx belongs to a friend and it was 'just visiting' Kelly Bray.  It is scratchbuilt and I believe it represents a member of the class just before withdrawal in the 30s.  I think it has a Portescap RG7 motor. Apart from that I can tell you very little, except it is a model of a class rarely modelled. It certainly makes an interesting change from 45s.

 

I believe I am correct in saying my friend is at Telford this year, with his layout Sywncombe, so it can be seen running then.



#87 sej

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 19:19

Thanks Paul, I think they're lovely locos, I'm not sure why! I hope to scratch-build one sometime and will keep a look out for your friend at Telford. Do you, or intend to, exhibit Kelly Bray? It looks superb.

 

Regards

Simon


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#88 PD&SWJR

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Posted 20 March 2014 - 20:57

Kelly Bray is not designed for exhibiting.  The framing of the baseboards are 3" deep and the backscene is 21", so it's 2 foot from top to bottom!!  So it would be cumbersome to move on a regular basis. It also rests on shelving units, so does not have legs of its own.  There is also a wall between the scenic section and the fiddle yard, so there is 6" of track permanently fixed to terra ferma in a short tunnel.  It is modular however to allow removal from one property to another, as and when we move to our retirement bungalow.


Edited by PD&SWJR, 20 March 2014 - 20:59 .

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#89 PD&SWJR

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 09:19

There is some progress on refurbishing the 57xx to report.

 

The chassis has been masked up and sprayed with Halfords grey etch primer.  Then inside of the frames which are to be painted red were then additionally masked, before spraying with Halfords satin black. I now use acrylic spray-can satin black, rather than the air brush as I find this just as effective and it is quicker to use and quicker drying than enamels.

 

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Foolishly, I painted the compensating beams black, then realised they should be red  :banghead:.  So I over sprayed with white undercoat, then hand painted red.  Red is not a very opaque colour and will require at least two, if not three coats to give the depth of colour. I am leaving the vacuum and steam pipes off until the last as they are vulnerable and easier to paint as well.

 

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The whistle shield, bunker steps and vertical hand rail have been fixed in place.  I used super glue gel, with a small spot placed on the tip of a sharpened cocktail stick poked into the fixing hole. This eliminates any surplus glue around the item. The replacement top bunker lamp iron was soldered on with 188 solder.  The green that the original builder of the model used is more yellow in tone than the jar of Railmatch late GWR green is.  Subtle weathering should hopefully make this far less obvious.

 

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I chemically blackened the steel tyres of the Slaters wheels, then hand painted the spokes, plastic rim and boss with Humbrol satin black. This will allow subsequent dry brush over painting with Gunmetal 'metacote' paint to give an oily sheen effect.

 

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Before anybody asks, 57's do not have six axles, I happened to have some spare ones which make the blackening / paiting process easier.


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#90 3 link

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 10:30

 

 

Before anybody asks, 57's do not have six axles, I happened to have some spare ones which make the blackening / paiting process easier.

 

  Hi Paul,

 

  Ahh, you beat me to it.

 

  I must admit that the painting and final detailing is one of the parts I am less comfortable with, although it is essential and brings the loco to life.

 

  I was just wondering if you will be going to the Reading show on the 10th of this month ? If so we can have a catch up then.

 

  All the best,

 

  Martyn.



#91 PD&SWJR

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 11:24

Hi Martyn,

 

So what are you detailing?  I shall not be going to Reading.  It's a bit of a hike for a day trip from North Devon, Maybe 20 years ago, but those days are long past! 

 

I hope to be off to Exeter at the end of the month, as 'Diesels in the Dutchy' will be there, as well as Tormouth Quay, which was at the RmWeb SWAG exhibition in Taunton last Sunday.  The latter is a very good dockside model.  Both are 4mm scale, but well worth seeing. 

 

Edit.  I actually enjoy the detailing part, especially the weathering as that in my opinion brings the model to life.


Edited by PD&SWJR, 01 May 2014 - 11:28 .


#92 Kev_Lewis

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 18:34

Great progress, Paul.

 

Have you thought about using black etch primer? It saves having to spray extra coats.

 

I've had great success with this one:http://www.ebay.co.u...=item2a1febca49


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#93 3 link

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Posted 01 May 2014 - 21:51

Hi Paul,

 

Have not really had much time for modelling of late, it's all work at the moment.

 

Although I did recieve some adjustable feet this morning for the baseboard legs, so any spare time I do get is used up on baseboard construction at the moment so no actual modelling on the horizon I'm afraid.

 

Regards,

 

Martyn.


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#94 PD&SWJR

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 09:49

This thread has gone rather quiet of late, but I have been working away as time permits.

 

Painting of the chassis was completed. 

 

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I then weathered it as follows:

  • Firebox sides were first painted with gunmetal (Humbrol 53) and were then dry brushed with water based oil paint, a product I found out about from Pugsley of this parish at the 2014 SWAG exhibition.  My wife bought me a tube of Indian Red as she thought it is close to rust. A true GWR colour!
  • Pull rods, brake hangers and relevant parts of the frame were stipple painted with matt black mixed with talc, to give the gritty dirt effect.  Use an old bristle brush for this as they are wrecked.
  • The plastic parts of the wheels were firstly painted satin black, then with Metacote gunmetal. I have found that Metacote does not adhere very well to unpainted surfaces and comes off after drying when one dry brushes to polish the paint.
  • The coupling rods were first treated with Caseys gunmetal metal black, then painted with Humbrol gunmetal (53), followed by a coat of varnish to give a sheen.  The crank pins and knuckle joints were then painted the Metacote as were random parts of the rods.

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Meanwhile, the body has been lettered and numbered and yesterday received a coat of satin varnish, let down with satin black.  Further weathering is to follow.


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#95 The Stationmaster

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 11:17

Excellent colour on the coupling rods Paul and the rest of the chassis looks really good colour/texture wise.


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#96 81A Oldoak

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 11:26

Excellent colour on the coupling rods Paul and the rest of the chassis looks really good colour/texture wise.

I agree. It is very difficult to get the finish of coupling and connecting rods right. 


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#97 PD&SWJR

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 13:18

The varnish I used on the coupling rods has a yellow colour to it. This is normally not the best of news for models, but works in my favour in this application. It is good at replicating oily rods.
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#98 3 link

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Posted 02 June 2014 - 17:59

Hi Paul,

 

I think the gunge that you have put on that chassis and brake linkages looks amazing, is there any talc left in your local boots ?  I am also a fan of the metalcote range and those driving wheels looks spot on as well, you probably have the same book as myself, one that was written by Mr Welch ;) .

 

ATB,

 

Martyn.


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#99 PD&SWJR

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Posted 03 June 2014 - 06:49

I certainly do Martyn, signed by the man himself

Having first sprayed the body with satin varnish, let down with a little satin black, I dusted over with a coat of dilute matt black. Around the number plates, it has retained a satin sheen, whilst the rest is matt. Possibly some glue residue from where the original builder attached the plates? Will need to buy a tinlet of matt varnish and gently over spray with that
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#100 PD&SWJR

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Posted 18 June 2014 - 10:05

A progress update on pannier tank 8729.  Photographs of 57s, taken around the mid to late ‘40s, show that they were a scruffy bunch.  So my model has been weathered to reflect that. It is green under all that grime, honest!

 

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The detailing parts used on this project are:

  • CPL: Transfers, couplings and crankpin nuts.
  • DJH: Fire irons and bucket.
  • Warren Shephard: Vacuum and steam pipes.
  • Springside: Head lamp and oil cans. The latter sit on the shelf above the firebox door and can only be seen by peering intently into the cab!

The crew were already fitted, but I removed them, stripped off the paint and re-painted them.

 

Here is a before, 'as purchased' photograph, taken in 2010.

 

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There are a couple of minor jobs to complete, namely fitting of the sand box pipes, which were ommitted by the original builder.  Also weathering of ash spill on the running plate below the smokebox door and sooty deposits on the top of the chimney.


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