RMweb Premium 31A Posted May 20, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 20, 2015 Perhaps then I'll be able to replace this one and about four others like it that wander around my layout, two of which I postponed 'refurbishing' when the new ones were announced: 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 Perhaps then I'll be able to replace this one and about four others like it that wander around my layout, two of which I postponed 'refurbishing' when the new ones were announced: BSK E1918E.JPG How far did you go in refurbishing them Steve? I've a dozen or so plus a lizzie rake with Comet/ Southern pride sides... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted May 20, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 20, 2015 The most obvious change was to replace the glazing with South Eastern Flushglaze, and the gangways with MJT ones. I also replaced the torpedo vents with whitemetal ones (noting where they are offset and where they aren't!), and made step boards in the right places on the solebars and bogies. I must admit I did't go as far as reproofing the roof. Also, I could have rebuilt the destination board racks - that would have been easy enough. I've done the Brake Second in the picture and a Brake Composite, but on a Full Brake I went a bit further. On that one, I cut the battery boxes away and relocated them the proper distance inboard. I thought I would have to replace the angle iron trusses and battery boxes and bought MJT items for that purpose, but actually by cutting carefully I was able to preserve the angle irons, and re-use the original battery boxes - it helped with this one that the Full Brake only had battery boxes on one side, so I was able to glue the cut off items back to back to produce one item of correct thickness. I intended the Full Brake as a 'prototype' for the others I've got, but Bachmann then announced the new ones..... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted May 20, 2015 Share Posted May 20, 2015 (edited) The most obvious change was to replace the glazing with South Eastern Flushglaze, and the gangways with MJT ones. I also replaced the torpedo vents with whitemetal ones (noting where they are offset and where they aren't!), and made step boards in the right places on the solebars and bogies. I must admit I did't go as far as reproofing the roof. Also, I could have rebuilt the destination board racks - that would have been easy enough. I've done the Brake Second in the picture and a Brake Composite, but on a Full Brake I went a bit further. On that one, I cut the battery boxes away and relocated them the proper distance inboard. I thought I would have to replace the angle iron trusses and battery boxes and bought MJT items for that purpose, but actually by cutting carefully I was able to preserve the angle irons, and re-use the original battery boxes - it helped with this one that the Full Brake only had battery boxes on one side, so I was able to glue the cut off items back to back to produce one item of correct thickness. I intended the Full Brake as a 'prototype' for the others I've got, but Bachmann then announced the new ones..... Thanks Steve- I keep hoping that a retooled BG would appear and an RF. I put a comet chassis under my one of my BG's your solution looks cheaper. Would you mind posting a picture. Heres a BCK i resided just before Christmas: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/64295-wright-writes/page-145 Edited May 20, 2015 by davidw 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted May 20, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 20, 2015 Hi David, I'll have to get some pictures taken, so bear with me! Cheers, Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted August 12, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 12, 2015 (edited) Price (but no date) now showing on Bachmann website - £52.95. Edited August 12, 2015 by Downer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Price (but no date) now showing on Bachmann website - £52.95. Oh dear - I was hoping to have very many, but not at that price.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Listed originally at about £25 now over 100% mark up , Bachmann ur having a laugh !! Buy a cheap secondhand original Bachmann version add Southern Pride sides about £20 all in. Example and its a easy conversion. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul.Uni Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 (edited) Listed originally at about £25 now over 100% mark up , Bachmann ur having a laugh !! Was that the Bachmann RRP or a retailers made up price? (I know the LMS Inspection Saloon and GWR Autocoach didn't have a RRP but Hattons had pre-order prices which had no hope of been kept, when announced at the same time. I'm not sure about if the Thompsons had a RRP announced or not.) Edited August 12, 2015 by Paul.Uni Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted August 12, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 12, 2015 Price (but no date) now showing on Bachmann website - £52.95. Looks like I will be finishing the upgrades on my old ones. I'm not going to replace 5 at that price. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
County of Yorkshire Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 (edited) Price (but no date) now showing on Bachmann website - £52.95. Surely this is some sort of unfunny joke? Even Hornby are managing to keep new coaching stock releases to around the £40 mark? These price increases are a worrying portent, but you can already see it happening: wagons now retailing at £14 failing to leave shop shelves. Newly released Modified Halls going straight into the bargain bin at a number of box shifters (though admittedly this may lie more in the glaring error with the front-end). £300 for a rake of 6 Thompsons? Nope. Doubt I'll even buy a BCK in LNER ersatz teak for my 1947 Newcastle to Bristol through train. Dread to think what retooled Bullieds and perhaps GWR sunshine coaches may cost if they ever get the same treatment. CoY Edited August 12, 2015 by County of Yorkshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 (edited) Was that the Bachmann RRP or a retailers made up price? (I know the LMS Inspection Saloon and GWR Autocoach didn't have a RRP but Hattons had pre-order prices which had no hope of been kept, when announced at the same time. I'm not sure about if the Thompsons had a RRP announced or not.) The original price was £30.35. Most retailers to sell at about the £25 mark. This price is absurd, and requires a rethink. The UK market is not the same as Europe. A fact that seems to elude Bachmann Edited August 13, 2015 by davidw Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 13, 2015 I don't know. It seems that Bachmann et al are trapped between rising production costs and what the market will bear - a lose-lose situation. I shall still get the four I've pre-ordered (and probably two more if they come out later in maroon) because they're such a basic element of any BR (ER) set-up. But then I'll be spending less on other, less essential, rolling stock items. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 13, 2015 The days of the £25 super detail coach are long gone. Options are more like the Hornby MK1 (which is fine by me) or pay the price for the separately fitted detail and complex processes that are needs to produce models like the Portholes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 13, 2015 The days of the £25 super detail coach are long gone. Options are more like the Hornby MK1 (which is fine by me) or pay the price for the separately fitted detail and complex processes that are needs to produce models like the Portholes. That's fine if you want Mk1s, but the Hornby versions of those are the only coaches now available at that sort of spec for that sort of price. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rembrow Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 (edited) I cancelled my pre-order for the crimson and cream versions, when Hattons advised that they could not maintain their pre order prices on Bachmann products. I shall not reinstate the order, as my purchasing of Bachmann products is now much more discrete, as I've had to cut my cloth to fit my wallet. I would have had these plus an expected later run of maroon liveried, but will now wait for the maroon versions. There has been talk of the increased prices vis a vis the cost of having added detail with the increased production costs, and that is very true, however that is not the whole story with Bachmann/Kader who have in addition made a corporate decision to increase the net income from the British outline market, to bring it in line with the returns that Kader get from other toy and model manufacturing. This has seen their pricing structure leap ahead of their main UK competitor, Hornby on a like for like model basis. Take coaches, having gone through the no added detail phase, with the BR Mk 1 and 2E coaches, Hornby's last two coach announced models have returned to added detail, but with more moulded detail on the coach sides than was used previously. So the Stanier suburbans and the forthcoming Collett corridors, have separately fitted roof vents, added end detail and added detail handrails on the guards/luggage doors, with passenger doors having more moulded detail and underframes having more components incorporated into the underframe tool to reduce hand fitting. This has brought them to a comparable level of added detail to that used by Bachmann on their BR Mk 1, and Stanier Porthole coaches, however the price difference between the Collett corridor and the Thompson corridor (coaches currently in tooling and likely to appear in 2016) will be £14 per coach in the Hornby models favour. It's also worth remembering that Bachmann prices are not fixed on retailers orders, as the price charged to retailers is the price in force at the time of release, and there is potentially another price rise before these models are released. The Birdcage coaches have just been priced at £59.95 and I can see the Thompson's getting to that price next year. Edited August 13, 2015 by rembrow 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 Price (but no date) now showing on Bachmann website - £52.95. They will only get manufactured if the retailers place the requisite number of orders. I can see many deciding to sit on their hands and wait for what else transpires from other suppliers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 13, 2015 (edited) The main focus of a train on my layout is the loco. I'm prepared to pay for a super detailed loco and things like moulded handrails and solid steam pipes are going to jar but I'm happy with a coach that shows attention to detail without having all of that detail separately fitted.. Make coaches dimensionally accurate with a selection of representative types and do a good job of the livery and I'm happy. Edited August 13, 2015 by MikeParkin65 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lochinvar Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 Perhaps Bachmann are exploring the point at which consumer price resistance sets in. From the comments so far,they're about to find out! This episode underlines yet again the utter nonsense of manufacturers attempting to attach a price to items which,with the best will in the world, are not going to see the light of day for yonks ahead. There are simply too many "known unknows" for that practice to have credibility. DR Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 The days of the £25 super detail coach are long gone. Options are more like the Hornby MK1 (which is fine by me) or pay the price for the separately fitted detail and complex processes that are needs to produce models like the Portholes. If and when they arrive. The problem is will they actually be made, as it has been mentioned the dreaded pre ordering ,not enough orders or they don't get made option. The latest current superb Hornby Pullmans are r.r.p of approx £50, I have never seen any Bachmann offerings that come close to that super detail standard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 If and when they arrive. The problem is will they actually be made, as it has been mentioned the dreaded pre ordering ,not enough orders or they don't get made option. The latest current superb Hornby Pullmans are r.r.p of approx £50, I have never seen any Bachmann offerings that come close to that super detail standard. spot on.... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 13, 2015 Just glad I bought from the last batch of Thompson coaches produced by Bachmann in Crimson & Cream. £18 each . Not so long ago! My only issue was that they weren't free running but unusually had very stiff bogies. These costs are absurd, completely agree with Rembrow as to the likely reason (Sorry costs are not going up that much- what other consumer goods from China do you know has gone up in price at the same rate?). Bachmann are the new Wrenn in terms of market pricing , and will become increasingly irrelevant. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 This price is absurd, and requires a rethink. The UK market is not the same as Europe. A fact that seems to elude Bachmann Everything evolves ! We may have got used to paying less than our European fellow-modellers, but that situation is not set in stone. If prices have to go up, perhaps the UK market will move towards the European norm - less modellers, but those remaining being prepared to pay the higher prices. OK - the home market may be smaller than that in Europe, but we have the US and Antipodean contingents too. Saying the UK market is different from the European one doesn't affect the realities of production costs. All model producers realise that lower prices mean higher sales volume - it's in their interests to keep prices as low as possible. The prices that they set reflect the cost of production, plus the level of profit they deem to be necessary to remain viable. An awful lot of RMweb members need to take a reality check, IMHO !! Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 I was not going to comment but John sums it up. Welcome to the new world order. You either buy at the new prices and continue in the hobby or you do not. Simples. I await to see just how much of an improvement these new versions are over the heavily modified originals that I am currently using and will base my decision to buy or not on that analysis. On the basis that UK produced models would currently retail at between £120 and £160 I do not think that things have got that bad. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted August 13, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 13, 2015 I'm waiting for the diagram of exploded parts that will no doubt appear in due course to justify this price, or the fact that it's a relatively unknown prototype ( I don't think that but I'm sure it'll be a reason ) to justify the need to charge more . If you go by the immediate postings above , which seem particularly selfish to me, you will end up with European prices and by their own hand" less modellers " . Not very good for the market or hobby I would suggest. Howls of protest? Well others have already made the point. Hornby are bringing in detailed coaches at £10-£15 less . I haven't got one, but their latest Pullmans seem well regarded , with LED lighting and cost less than these Thompsons . Both made in China, one at a third party subcontractor (usually more expensive), the other in house at the parents manufacturing facility . What other conclusions are possible other than Bachmann/Kader are trying to maximise the profit on these coaches at the expense of the British consumer. The new reality? Well only if you make it so. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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