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Third Rail Experiments


HAB
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It's all looking very good indeed! 

 

Perhaps you should keep those wagons until after the Scaleforum in June.

 

 

Hello Colin,

 

Many thanks for the kind words.

 

I am very much hoping that you will be here to collect them in person!

 

I suppose just to stop people getting in a panic, I should say that the event you refer to is the Scalefour Society AGM in Derby - Scaleforum has not moved from its usual dates.  Of course, we might have to shunt at a more sedate speed at such an event!

 

Very Best Wishes,

 

 

 

Very Best Wishes,

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 I'd love to come to Derby and see your layout at the S4 AGM in June - can't promise anything yet. 

 

 

Trusting you will make it, but I think you mean OPERATE, not see :)

 

Very Best Wishes,

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  • 1 month later...

Re Drivers using the hook switch pole, in my time on the South Eastern section no driver would isolate the 3rd rail with hook switches. Drivers aren't trained in using it.

Lovely layout.

Amazing!

 

Fifty years ago when I was taught how to use a hook switch (I can't really use the term trained because I was only a schoolboy at the time), you had to know how to pull them with full current passing through the switch. The main problem with that is that, unless you get it right, you set up an impressive (and blinding) arc as the switch opens.

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  • 5 months later...

I would just love to say what an inspiration this layout has been--even though I haven't made any inroads into P4 yet I hope to get a start soon. Every now and then I wade through Google results seeing if there's been an update on this fine essay in track construction.

 

Has there been any progress in the last 6 months? I seem to recall mention of it going to a show that was back in June? :)

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Is this 4mm scale?!

 

It is quite incredibly finely detailed - "museum quality" doesn't do it justice. I could smell the creosote, brake dust and oil.

 

One thought, going right back to the first picture, is that side-ramps for "running on" were avoided, if possible, because they tended to get out of alignment and knock shoes off. I recall them being permitted for low speed areas, but not at all encouraged.

 

So, are they really necessary in this location? An alternative might be a gap and ramp-end. Incidentally, the way that CR layout designs were tested for "gapping"" in reality was to run little cardboard trains, with shoes positions marked accurately on them, all over the place, on 40ft/inch layout drawings.

 

Anyway, brilliant work, and that from a dedicated coarse-scaler!

 

Kevin

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Hello Kevin,

 

Many thanks for your kind words.  Just to mention that I fully agree with what you say - the point in the first picture is the exit from the Carriage Sidings so a 10MPH speed limit here. It is also on a bit of "gappy" track where every bit of juice rail helps!

 

But just to add to / clarify what you are saying, even on high speed main lines, side ramps were "always" provided for facing points - ie where the shoe "trails" off the ramp, but were very uncommon for trailing points - ie where the shoe "runs on" the ramp as you say. The effect of this therefore that the two points in a double junction would only have one side ramp - at the facing point. This can look a bit puzzling to those who do not know why - it is well illustrated in a series of articles which have appeared in "Southern Way" which have included photos of Borough Market Junction and a facing crossover at (I think) Worting Junction, illustrating exactly this approach.  The later facing point has (unusually) a ramp on both sides - even though it is a high-speed point.

 

Of course this relates to SR practice - on the L&Y Liverpool-Southport line, there were no side ramps - nor were there gaps - instead, the juice rail was lowered below shoe height - thus providing a pair of end-ramps without the need for any copper cabling.

 

Interesting what you say about cardboard vehicles.   Of course BR screwed this up when they introduced 62' BR Standard vehicles in EMUs when the Southern's standard was a fair bit shorter!

 

Best Wishes,

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  • 1 year later...

Just to mention that "Minories" will be appearing at the Warley National Model Railway Exhibition at the Brimingham NEC on 26/27 November this year. 

 

The layout is still very much a "work in progress", but much has moved on since the photos above, and we do hope to put on a good show of Southern Region Surburban operations in the early sixties.

 

I look forward to seeing loads of RMwebbers there and hopefully answering any questions in person!

 

Best wishes to all,

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Hello Howard

 

It is really good to see that you have once again posted on RMW. Is it a one off or will we be fortunate enough to see more of your work here? I'm sure many people here, even those working in other gauges that might exist, would really like to see more of your work. Of course, whether some people at "that other place" would approve of you mixing with us mere mortals is another matter.

 

I was one of those lucky enough to spend some time with you at Aylesbury and learned an incredible amount from your tuition; indeed I still use your design of home made filing jig in preference to the steel ones made by the society and they allow you to make much more accurate components- just as you predicted they would.

Edited by Derekstuart
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Hello Derek,

 

In truth I have not been doing much posting anywhere as I have been busy with lots of things, but I do intend to keep these threads updated from time to time.   These days there are so many decent forums (fora?) that it is hard to know where best to go. 

 

Many thanks for the kind words re Aylesbury - I will be there again this year and hopefully will see you again. 

 

All are welcome of course, - Stoke Mandeville, 24 / 25 September - tickets available here - http://www.scalefour.org/scaleforum/tickets

 

Pete, here is one shot to (hopefully) tempt you...

 

post-11380-0-85625800-1472732977_thumb.jpg

 

 

 

I notice that was taken in January!  Hopefully yet more progress by November!

 

Best Wishes,

 

 

 

 

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  • 1 month later...

Hi Howard. I have been reading this thread, but I must have missed previous threads? If this is anything to go by , you are a champion.

I drove London Underground trains( some may say that I only changed ends and pointed them?). I don't know if you have considered

"Arcing" when the shoes(imaginary or not) cross the ends of the positive rails, of course you do not need shoes, you can use "eletrickery"

A simple magnet attached to the leading bogie and a reed switch concealed near to the end of the positive rail, but of course that is assuming you run your trains in the dark, at least for this show. I cannot remember what it is called exactly, but, it will IMHO work.

Best of luck. Kevin

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Hi Howard fantastic looking layout

I am very new to railway modelling and contemplating a third rail there are many questions to be asked but my first is

Is there a set distance to drill holes for the pots on the sleepers if so what is it please or is it what looks right

Thank you

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As with all your models, I had to look thrice to confirm that it was, indeed, a model!

 

For some reason, I can actually smell BR(S) when I look at your models; creosote; oil; the sharp tang of oxalic acid from carriage-washers; dusty seat cushions; warm electrical equipment; a whiff of fag smoke .......

 

You haven't got conflicting routes up on those signals, though, have you?

 

Kevin

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Hi Howard fantastic looking layout

I am very new to railway modelling and contemplating a third rail there are many questions to be asked but my first is

Is there a set distance to drill holes for the pots on the sleepers if so what is it please or is it what looks right

Thank you

Every 4th or 5th sleeper. This can change if need be near the end's of the 3rd rail. Hope this help's.

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  • 3 weeks later...

For some reason, I can actually smell BR(S) when I look at your models; creosote; oil; the sharp tang of oxalic acid from carriage-washers; dusty seat cushions; warm electrical equipment; a whiff of fag smoke .......

 

You haven't got conflicting routes up on those signals, though, have you?

 

Kevin

 

Many thanks again for your kind words Kevin - it smells more of paint, flux and glue in real life! Sorry to take a while to reply - Warley is now very close!!!  Hope to see you there.

 

No conflicting routes here - remember the frame is fully interlocked!  The main arm leads to the Down Main and the dummy reads to the carriage sidings.

 

I have a photo with both dummies off along with the starter from the other platform - also correct!  Unfortunately, RMW does not want to let me upload it - will try again later..

 

Cheers,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I have a photo with both dummies off along with the starter from the other platform - also correct!  Unfortunately, RMW does not want to let me upload it - will try again later..

 

here it is...

 

post-11380-0-32501000-1478188710.jpg

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  • 10 months later...

Just to mention that my Minories layout will be on show at Scaleforum at the Stoke Mandeville Stadium this weekend - hope people who have followed this hear but are not Scalefour Soc members with think it worth a visit to Aylesbury!  There are plenty of other goodies there also!

 

I would like to be able to say that all the third rail installation is now fully complete - well I could say that but I would be stretching the truth...

 

Details here:-

 

https://www.scalefour.org/scaleforum/2017/

 

Hope some of you will stop by to say hello.

 

Best wishes,

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Just to mention that my Minories layout will be on show at Scaleforum at the Stoke Mandeville Stadium this weekend - hope people who have followed this hear but are not Scalefour Soc members with think it worth a visit to Aylesbury.................... 

 

Best wishes,

It's the reason I'm coming to Scaleforum - as for saying hello, you might live to regret that :jester:

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