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Model Railway Partwork - Coaches under ?5,


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I don't think you need to spend £20 on one.  

 

After inspection the main problem is the under frame... 4 of these coaches are in the project cupboard and when I get round to sorting them out I shall fit a Replica/Comet/DCkit/ANother replacement (not really that expensive but an improvement on even the Bachmann offering)... I bought them to hack about so any other parts would have to be added anyway but I will feel much happier taking a blade to something that costs under £5 rather than something over £10.

 

Don't expect anything soon though, my bench is pretty full but in the meantime buy while you can or regret at your leisure. 

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I have one of these sat om my desk at the moment, the wheels are very much like the old crud magnets Heljan fitted to their earlier OO diesel loco models.  I will pick up a second one later today and put them in my spares pile for some sort of Departmental conversion project.

 

Do you think some later issues will have futher coaches?

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I wasn't going to bother, I've already got too many coaches but I was in Smiths and ended up walking out with four. They are rather good for the money, certainly as good as eighties Hornby/Lima/Mainline stock, I think a bit better. Has any one noticed how the coupling pushes out as the bogie turns to increase the gap between coaches? New to me. If get around to it I may spray the roofs a bit of a darker grey and highlight the door handles etc. I may also remove  a bit of weight, they are 166 grams as opposed to 133 for a similar Hornby version.Had a derailing issue on tighter curves, removing the coupling and cutting a chamfer into the curved end of the shank to stop it contacting the curved front edge under the front end at full extension did the trick.

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Bought 6 of these the other day. They might not be that detailed underneath but with roco couplers on and some weathering they look excellent. You can't see the underframe trussing when on the layout and the lack of handrails isn't detracting. I'm not even going to number them. If half of my own and our clubs Lima/Bachmann MK1's can run with the same numbers then mine aren't any worse for running with non at all. Paired up with a Lima flushglazed BG and a Bachmann GUV, I've got a 8 coach rake for just over £40. An absolute bargain!

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I just got 2 today (difficult to carry more on the bus with all my work stuff...) might go back for more!

What's interesting on this thread is the number of people saying 'for £4 it looks fine as part of a train, I don't need to make any modifications...' - exactly the opposite of the 'we need all the detail you can manage to cram onto a model' calls from previous years. Is this a reflection of Austerity Britain - we've been beaten down to being content with far less than we were expecting just a few years ago?

Another thought is that Hornby will be rather worried about their new Railroad models not being bought in the numbers they might have expected; the market for Mk1 SKs could be rather saturated by these models. Hornby might have to take a Hachette to their sales forecasts (sorry, couldn't resist that one!)

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Given all the interest that the model railway part work has generated with it's £3:99 coach, it begs the question, (out of interest)

 

"if" a range of these sorts of quality vehicles were available at say £4:99, would you buy one/or more?

 

I appreciate there has been some OTT interest in the novelty value that these have brought and thus on a more general sale, there might not be the same enthusiasm, especially as they would not be as widely available as the magazine version.  

 

For example I've often wanted a garden railway, and liked the idea of a rake of 8 or 9 MkI's behind a Peak, these would seem ideal.  Be interesting to hear others thoughts.

 

I appreciate also that there is a Hornby Railroad Range. And I can see that they have brought a new MkI range out, at £17:95, http://www.Hornby.com/shop/Hornby-railroad/railroad-rolling-stock/?page=3

 

now unless hachette were making a loss on each of these issue 1's (unlikely?) take away the track piece and the magazine etc, it would appear that these coaches have been made for around £3 each?  

 

Thus could a limited range be made and sold at under £5 each?

In a word, no.

 

I have not been through the whole thread but:

1) It is entirely possible that Hachette are making a loss on this first item;

2) You have not allowed for any distribution costs i.e. retail margin;

3) Actual manufacturing cost is only a small part of the picture - especially in plastics. Most of the cost is in new tooling which Hachette have not had to do apparently.

 

And any existing manufacturer has to look at how these cheaper items can abstract from sales of their other (more profitable) products.

 

When I was a child, nearly 50 years ago in the late 1960's, a Tri-ang Mk1 cost 10s6d (52.5p). So at £17 (or less), the Railroad range are really cracking value for a product that is considerably improved. Most other things (white goods being the notable exception) have gone up by larger multiples since then.

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.....Has any one noticed how the coupling pushes out as the bogie turns to increase the gap between coaches? New to me.....

 

 

It looks like a straight copy of the Bachmann coupling cam system on their own Mk.1s. It even has the mini spring at the end for centralising purposes.

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Bought 6 of these the other day. They might not be that detailed underneath but with roco couplers on and some weathering they look excellent. You can't see the underframe trussing when on the layout and the lack of handrails isn't detracting. I'm not even going to number them. If half of my own and our clubs Lima/Bachmann MK1's can run with the same numbers then mine aren't any worse for running with non at all. Paired up with a Lima flushglazed BG and a Bachmann GUV, I've got a 8 coach rake for just over £40. An absolute bargain!

 

I have thought for a long time that it is silly for manufacturers to put numbers on coaches and wagons that are going to run in rakes. Looks far worse to see the same number repeated than to see none at all. Best of all they could give us the choice - numbered or unnumbered.

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There seems to be a second wave of deliveries of these coinciding with the second issue of the Star Trek series.  Horsham and Oxford Street WHSmiths had plenty in over the last couple of days and my strategic reserve is now up to four.

 

The steel rail however  :sarcastichand:  will be sitting outside in the rain for a while to rust and weather prior to a new career as a scenic background accessory...

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In a word, no.

 

I have not been through the whole thread but:

1) It is entirely possible that Hachette are making a loss on this first item;

2) You have not allowed for any distribution costs i.e. retail margin;

3) Actual manufacturing cost is only a small part of the picture - especially in plastics. Most of the cost is in new tooling which Hachette have not had to do apparently.

 

And any existing manufacturer has to look at how these cheaper items can abstract from sales of their other (more profitable) products.

 

When I was a child, nearly 50 years ago in the late 1960's, a Tri-ang Mk1 cost 10s6d (52.5p). So at £17 (or less), the Railroad range are really cracking value for a product that is considerably improved. Most other things (white goods being the notable exception) have gone up by larger multiples since then.

 

1) Possible, but not very likely. A huge gamble if they are and one that will see them lose a large amount on the volume of sales of the first issue that will never tranlset into continued sales.

2) & 3) I said it appears that they hav produced a coach for around £3,

 

Indeed the individual cost of production is only a small part. What appears to hapen with simlar such models in the mainstream manufacturers is that regardles of cost of production, they all command a similar price, what the £3:99 coach has done is merely expose the fact that in a limited range such vehicles could be produced for around £5:99 "but" only in a limited range.

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The steel rail however  :sarcastichand:  will be sitting outside in the rain for a while to rust and weather prior to a new career as a scenic background accessory...

I hope you remembered to remove the fishplates, unless of course you are not as tight fisted as I am.

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I got three yesterday for my son's train-set. He's 6, say what you like about the detail, they are perfect for him - you can't get second hand coaches for that! I did have to remove the springs from the close-coupling mechanism to get it to run round a curve without derailing though (2nd and 3rd radius).

 

We all know that part-works sell 10 times as many of the first issue than they are likely to of any other, as do the manufacturers, so I cannot believe they will loose money. Now they won't plan on a profit, the magazine design costs will be factored over the life of the run, and there is already a distribution network (the newsagents won't make a profit on the first issue either, but will take it and promote it to get people signed up for the full run). As others have said the design has probably been copied from others, and this is Chinese batch-production at it's most efficient. However if the manufacturer lost money on materials on the first issue they will go bust...

 

Which proves it is possible to make a basic but adequate RTR coach for under £4. Imagine what could be done for a production run at £8... surely this is what Hornby's Railroad range should be about... Pocket money models that encourage youngsters to have train-sets? How many kids get £25 fully detailed coaches anyway?

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We all know that part-works sell 10 times as many of the first issue than they are likely to of any other, as do the manufacturers, so I cannot believe they will loose money. Now they won't plan on a profit, the magazine design costs will be factored over the life of the run, and there is already a distribution network (the newsagents won't make a profit on the first issue either, but will take it and promote it to get people signed up for the full run). As others have said the design has probably been copied from others, and this is Chinese batch-production at it's most efficient. However if the manufacturer lost money on materials on the first issue they will go bust...

 

Which proves it is possible to make a basic but adequate RTR coach for under £4. Imagine what could be done for a production run at £8... surely this is what Hornby's Railroad range should be about...

 

if it's a race to the bottom, then yes.

 

The statement 'it is possible to make a basic but adequate RTR coach for under £4' is not supported by the rest of your comments.  If none of the parties in the chain plan on a profit, then they won't stay in business.  Break-even is the domain of charities, and not even well-run ones at that.

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They have done it for the partwork, that's my point, they won't be loosing money on the manufacturing and materials.

 

You're correct that once normal profit margins, adequate packaging (though a bubble pack is OK), distribution, etc. are factored in the cost would be higher, hence I suggested £8 for the same product as a normal production run. Still cheap enough for kids train sets, unlikely to tempt serious modellers from more detailed models.

 

Race to the bottom? Hmm, the quality is no worse than the main brands managed until the 1980's. When VW went from making Beetles to Phaetons they brought (bought) out cheaper brands. Different market segments, all I am saying is there could be money to be made and encourage people into a hobby.

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I wonder if what we might see from this is that WH Smiths decide to try stocking some model railway stuff, given how much demand there has been for this partwork because of the coach. There was already a mention somewhere else about them in regard to Hornby finding a replacement high street concession holder after the demise of MZ.

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I wonder if what we might see from this is that WH Smiths decide to try stocking some model railway stuff, given how much demand there has been for this partwork because of the coach. ....

I doubt it. In the early 1980s, Smith's did have a go at selling the Airfix railway kits and a fair number of the Airfix / GMR range, but I remember they took ages to sell. The Brent Cross branch in particular had GMR boxes on the shelves by the stairs for a very long time indeed.

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I wonder if what we might see from this is that WH Smiths decide to try stocking some model railway stuff, given how much demand there has been for this partwork because of the coach. There was already a mention somewhere else about them in regard to Hornby finding a replacement high street concession holder after the demise of MZ.

Coaches or whatever at el cheapo part work come-on prices are one thing - stocking them costs WHS very little and they are invariably 'sale or return' so there is no loss on unsold items.  Pop in exactly the same coach at realistic mark-up levels with reasonable packaging plus distribution costs and all the rest of it and you are probably talking about £8-9+ as an absolute minimum retail price.  

 

As a result I suspect they would move more slowly off the shelves and the unsold items will remain a cost of the retailer's books while taking up shelf space that might be used for faster moving items - all a very different proposition from the way these coaches are going into the marketplace at present.

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So what? Hornby started out making toys, and indeed still do.

 

It's just that many of the "toys" they make for us demanding modellers are far too expensive and delicate to get children into train sets. Even the Thomas range is expensive, they are supposed to be toys yet coaches are £18! Who pays £125 for James? I think a range of properly affordable trains to get kids to move on from Brio would only do the hobby good in the long run. Wagons <£5 and coaches <£10, basic locos for £30-£60. It can be done, which manufacturer will be brave enough to give it a go?

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