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DCC sound decoders for US diesels


Alcanman
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Having so far only purchased models with factory fitted sound, I was wondering which sound decoders you favour (and speakers).

 

In order to expand my fleet, I now need to consider fitting sound to DCC ready locos, probably Atlas Silver models

 

I noticed that Bowser have announced that they will be using ESU Loksound decoders. This follows Atlas' announcement last year.

 

I'm familiar with Loksound, my UK locos fitted with them are smooth runners and have decent sound. Have you used them?

 

Also, any info or links to fitting sound to Atlas Silver HO models would be helpful.

 

 

Thanks,

 

 

Mal

Edited by Alcanman
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Sound is in the ear of the beholder, but I'd always go for Loksound first, as they usually run very smoothly in any locomotive they're placed in, without any need for tweaking, unlike the Soundtraxx Tsunami which can be a veritable nightmare.  The Loksound Select soundfiles can be heard on their website. 

 

Brian

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Sound is in the ear of the beholder, but I'd always go for Loksound first, as they usually run very smoothly in any locomotive they're placed in, without any need for tweaking, unlike the Soundtraxx Tsunami which can be a veritable nightmare.  The Loksound Select soundfiles can be heard on their website. 

 

Brian

Hi Mal,

 

I have Soundtraxx Tsunami and MRC Sound Decoders.

 

I'm already wishing that I'd waited for the Loksound to be available before I started buying.

 

Even with DecoderPro and Sprog programming the Soundtrax seems to rely totally on luck.

 

The MRC are a bit easier to do.

 

None of them are as easy as a Loksound is to program!

 

Choice is always the thing.

 

However, I prefer the sound out of the Soundtraxx compared to the MRC decoders!

 

Thanks

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Hi Mal, elaborating a little on the answers already given so far:

 

ESU:  Superior motor control, and easy motor set up (auto tune function build in)

Flexible sound files, many varieties available.  Decent amount of function outputs for lights etc, option to load your own custom soundfiles.

Cons: requires a programmer if you want to load sounds yourself, some soundfiles are compressed, and quality isn't always great (this goes for older factory sounds only)

 

Soundtraxx:  Sounds of very high quality although I'm not convinced by some of the horns , function outputs geared towards US light functions , decent motor control, reasonably priced compared to some others.

Cons: Can't change the sounds, can be very tedious to program and get the motor response good enough for a switcher/low speeds some times a bit of trial and error.

 

QSI:  Similar to ESU in that you require a programmer to change sounds, but it is possible. decent motor control, although somewhat complicated to set up, sounds are good to very good, engines can sound a little unnatural when speeding up/down, but the horn sounds are very good indeed. I haven't heard their recent TITAN decoders yet, which are an upgrade to the Revolution decoders I've used.  

 

MRC:  Steer clear of these, although some have used them, they have quality control issues, are not completely compatible with NMRA spec so won't always respond the same compared to others. It is a shame, as they used to make very good analog controllers, but their digital stuff isn't of the same standards (yet).  

 

 

That's my view anyway based on my own subjective experiences: FYI   I own Soundtraxx, QSI and ESU decoders. My statement on MRC is based on what others have told me, and what I've found on the web on several locations. (big blue,trainorders,and others).

 

Koos

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Thanks to all for the replies.

 

My own experiences with factory fitted sound are similar to those Koos has experienced. Soundtraxx have good sound but need adjustment for slow switching control.

 

In their recent statement Bowser mentioned one of the reasons for changing from Soundtraxx to ESU was smoother speed control.

 

My 2 QSI fitted locos have good slow speed control without need for any adjustment, but one has a factory setting much slower than the other. Sound is OK, Horns and Bell very good.

 

As I have never installed a sound decoder and speakers, I'm looking for a reasonably straightforward installation. This is why I thought of Atlas Silver which I believe have space for speakers, as they are,essentially, the same model as the Atlas Gold dcc sound fitted.

 

Any info on sound fitting would be welcome.

 

Mal

Edited by Alcanman
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Mal,

 

The only way to start is to start.  With patience and common sense, you'll get there.  At times it seems like trying to install a two pints into a half-pint pot, but just be methodical.  In some instances, I've had to remove quite a bit of weight from a chassis to get the speaker in, but the loco has always been able to pull a more-than-adequate load after surgery.  If possible, try to find space for a rectangular bass-reflex speaker, even if you have to remove weight to do so.  When you're more adept, you can also do "tricks" like passing wires for rear lights through the speaker itself.

 

http://www.dccsupplies.com/shop/product_info.php?products_id=3542

 

Brian

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hi Mal,

 

I thought I'd point out this supplier as well. A more limited range than DCC supplies, but often somewhat cheaper. not always everything in stock, but I've had good service from him.  http://www.coastaldcc.co.uk/

 

 

By the way, also TCS is now shipping it's first sound decoder. Steam sounds only for now, but who knows what the future holds.

 

Koos

Edited by torikoos
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I only have 2 locos currently with sound, both  are used (same owner) so where set up by him. Atlas B23-7 with inhouse QSI is less than satisfactory, to little engine noise to much peripheral background noise, no short horn function but the biggest let down for me is no ability to manual notch(unless I've missed something). The other loco is an Atlas RS1 with Soundtraxx  Tsunami I've set it up for manual notching, CV116 to 0 F9 for up F10 for down, only problem is when notching down it is very easy to over do it and shut the loco down. There is according to the manual a way to prevent this involving CV15 and 16 but I haven't been able to sort this yet. For me I really like the ability to notch up/down manually so will probably stay with Soundtraxx despite rarely getting out of notch2 on a 10ft plank!

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I admit to be being a bit of a sound snob and consider it every bit as important as the way a model looks. We wouldn't accept a loco that looked wrong so why accept one that sounds wrong?

 

On that basis, I choose Soundtraxx Tsunamis every time as they sound just like the real thing. We use them exclusively on Menasha and have had no issues with slow running on a Lenz system, using 128 speed step mode. Programming is a breeze using Decoder Pro and a SPROG, though all we've done is reduce the bell volume and increase the horn volume. My only criticism would be that the horns could be louder.

 

Standing in the yard at Barrow Hill a few years ago, I was momentarily confused to hear the start up sequence of a Tsunami fitted GP40. I was standing next to a 57 that uses the same EMD 645 engine and the sound was a dead ringer for a Tsunami.

 

Loksound decoders are undoubtedly capable of great things as witnessed by the sound schemes available for British locos. However many of the US sounds leave a little to be desired. I guess if someone were to put the same effort into recording and editing the sounds as has been done over here, they would be a worth competitor.

 

I always find myself disappointed by QSI decoders. The horns and bells are very good, better than Tsunamis, but the engine sounds are poor. They sound OK at idle but are "electronically manipulated" to represent notching up. In effect the recording is sped up losing the bass and sounding nothing like a real engine. A waste of money IMHO. Some of the preview videos of the latest Emulation Technology sound files look much more promising so maybe I need to re-evaluate my opinion.

 

Similarly, while MRC decoders are cheaper than many of the other sound decoders, they just don't sound as good. They used to have issues with Lenz systems too. The only time we tried one, it just sat there making uncontrollable noises and refusing to move. Are you saving half the price of a sound decoder by buying an MRC decoder? I'd argue you're wasting your money on something that doesn't sound right. Would you buy a loco that looks wrong?

 

I have a few Digitrax sound decoders that I've been meaning to try as a cheaper alternative to Tsunamis. While they are undoubtedly less capable, some of the sound projects available from the digitraxsound yahoo group show promise.

 

Just my opinions...

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no short horn function

What does this mean? Horn on any US loco is F2, which is a non-latching function on any US throttle, so the horn sounds for as long or short as your hold on the button. Perhaps you are using a European throttle?

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This youtube video shows a good A-B comparisson between a QSI Titan decoder with recent software, and a Tsunami. (The Titan is a successor to the Quantum revolution style sound decoder in your U30B, which still uses older sound files and processing).

Besides other differences, you can clearly hear that the Titan was recorded inside the engine compartment, while the Tsunami must have had microphones fitted to the outside of the hood, picking up more external sounds from the exhaust and in this case a much clearer and recognisable generator whine for this type of engine configuration. The horn on the Titan is much nicer again though...

 

 

 

This user has loads more sound clips on youtube, so you can get some impressions of various sounds etc. 

 

For comparison here's a real GP9 working, and you can clearly hear what it should sound like from the outside. Make your own judgement on which sound decoder came closer. :-)

 

Edited by torikoos
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I have not heard a Titan in the flesh, but have never heard a more convincing 567 than Soundtraxx's version - even in their old cheapo decoders. They are certainly better than the QSI versions that I have as used in earlier Broadway Limited products. And MRC are not quite there - again I have some factory installed in Genesis F Units, and when idling they have a habit of suddenly chucking out random sound effects that are garbage.

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Thank to all for the replies. Looks like Tsunami are still highly regarded for sound.

 

Can anyone suggest any links to websites that show sound decoder & speaker installation?

 

 

Mal

Edited by Alcanman
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I have many U.S sound loco's now and based on my own findings, here's what I think!

Without a doubt Tsunami has the most accurate prime mover sound, especially where the EMD 567, 645 and 710 engines are concerned. I must have listened to thousands of youtube video's over the last few years and I know what an EMD should sound like, weather that be inside an SD40-2 or an F7 A and B set!

I don't doubt for a minute that Loksound has better motor control but ive fine tuned my CV's on the Tsunami's and have no trouble at all with very slow speed switching performance on any of my loco's.

I also find them easy to set up multiple locomotive consists now that I have a digital speedometer to help me match them.

 

QSI I find use generic sounds on all their decoders, like the highly irritating air release sound on start (which just doesn't happen!) and the Revolution version I have in an SD35 is so nasty and 'shrill' like Ive disabled the sound altogether. The only thing I like about QSI is the horn sounds have more punch than a Tsunami. To give QSI the benefit of the doubt, I had a listen to a new Titan, but even these just don't sound like the real thing to me!

Going back to my Revolution fitted SD35, even on a 'boosted' programing track, the dam thing will still not program! I will shortly be ripping out the Revolution for a Tsunami.

 

Moving onto MRC, I can only echo the comments above!

The last one that I can't recommend is anything fitted with MTH's Proto Sound 3. I have one of their SD70ace's. The sound to me sounds like a continuous loop and the as the loco notches up, it sounds much to like one sound finishing and another starting rather than a smooth transition of increasing throttle. PS3 is also designed to work with MTH's DCS system making it not ver compatible with NMRA DCC systems, advanced consists are a no-no with PS3 loco's unless that is you have the latest but even then, you cannot alter all the CV's!

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Hi Mal,

 

Just go onto You Tube and type Soundtraxx or Tsunami into the search index....

 

Brings up plenty of videos to look through.

 

Hope this helps....

Thank to all for the replies. Looks like Tsunami are still highly regarded for sound.

 

Can anyone suggest any links to websites that show sound decoder & speaker installation?

 

 

Mal

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Thank to all for the replies. Looks like Tsunami are still highly regarded for sound.

 

Can anyone suggest any links to websites that show sound decoder & speaker installation?

 

 

Mal

Mal, it is all very dependent on the model, decoder manufacturer, speaker type, that the best thing are probably the generic descriptions. The majority of manufacturers have downloadable PDF's on how to fit sound decoders..

For further reading I recommend downloading the free Model Railroad Hobbyist magazine, there has been a whole series on DCC in there, and a couple of installments on how to fit Sound decoders too. Lastly, indeed as others suggested, try youtube to see how people have done it. 

 

Here's one to start of on a medium size locomotive. 

 

Edited by torikoos
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Just to reiterate the above, Model Junction was selling off Titans a while back at nearly half price! It has to be said, I think they were having trouble shifting them, they do tend to reduce prices on stragglers that are slow to shift and they need room for new stock.

I wish that Tsunami had the finesse in motor control that Loksound does but where the actual prime mover sound is concerned, the Soundtraxx product is hard to beat and just pips Loksound to the post.

Ive also dabbled in Tsunami with the Alco sound, I custom installed sound in an Atlas C420 a couple of years ago. Atlas mechanism's what they are (excellent), I also had no problems in good slow speed control.

 

Ive had the following video on my hard drive for a couple of years but I just uploaded it, this is one of my SD40-2's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A-KnKR-fuY&feature=youtu.be

Thought I had one of the Alco C420 but I cant find it at the mo.

Edited by Gary H
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  • 2 weeks later...

ESU have just added some new videos to demonstrate their sound decoders, which they will also be using in forthcoming factory fitted releases for Atlas and Intermountain

 

If the sound is really this good, I'll definatley consider them. This one is for a GE U18B  and also features some nice Guilford/MEC pics

 

 

 

Mal

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ESU have just added some new videos to demonstrate their sound decoders, which they will also be using in forthcoming factory fitted releases for Atlas and Intermountain

 

If the sound is really this good, I'll definatley consider them. This one is for a GE U18B  and also features some nice Guilford/MEC pics

 

 

Mal

That is spot on! the best GE sound Ive heard to date, certainly streets ahead of the QSI version.

Edited by Gary H
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sounds good indeed. ESU is certainly going full steam (?) ahead in updating their sound libraries since the V4 and select series have been released, which contain more memory so can handle better and/or more sounds. 

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Hi all,

 

Love the video...

 

The horn sounds like it's maxing out the amplifier and causing the speaker to make the distortion even worse.

 

Very difficult to set up a decoder to give a good horn sound.

 

I'm playing with the Soundtrax to see if I can reduce a similar effect.

 

How long before we get sound decoders with bass and tweeter outputs?

 

Just an idea!

 

Thanks

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Hi all,

 

Love the video...

 

The horn sounds like it's maxing out the amplifier and causing the speaker to make the distortion even worse.

 

Very difficult to set up a decoder to give a good horn sound.

 

I'm playing with the Soundtrax to see if I can reduce a similar effect.

 

How long before we get sound decoders with bass and tweeter outputs?

 

Just an idea!

 

Thanks

The problem is that to have any appreciable bass, you need to move air and to move air you need a big bass cone! There's no problem with high treble frequency's but those lows are a whole different ball game in a model locomotive.

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