Jump to content




Photo
* * * * * 1 votes

Porth Dinllaen in 0

0 gauge O gauge Cambrian coast Nefyn GWR 1930s Porth Dinllaen




  • Please log in to reply
844 replies to this topic

#1 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 25 November 2013 - 20:35

Hi,

Looking at some of the posts on RMWeb, and recent show guides, it seems that I am not alone in my choice of fictional scenario!

I've been researching Porth Dinllaen for a while now, as it is the scenario I have chosen to develop for my intended 0 ( or should that be O?) gauge layout.

Brunel seriously considered Porth Dinllaen as a competitor to Holyhead, the line would have surely come up from Barmouth, via Harlech, Porthmadog & Pwllheli. How it got there from the midlands without climbing Talerddig is another question (double headed Kings with bankers...? Would have been a sight to behold - and hear!)

Set in the early 30's, the pipe dream will, if and when it comes to fruition, comprise a garden room hopefully about 35-40' x 15-18' with a terminus to fiddle yard layout arranged as a wrapped oval - a quarry branch will connect to the fy to provide a continuous run. The station plan to date is based on CJF's "Minories", with two additional parallel goods reception roads which give access via a lift bridge to the goods docks.

I'm intending to be able to get 8 coaches in the platform, but will probably have to settle for 6. A loco shed, with t/t and coal facility will be provided under the fairly steep curving climb ( more bankers) up the cliff which lies alongside the present day golf course, towards Nefyn town at which the GWR will provide a small station and local facilities, and the junction to the quarry, before the main line departs in a south easterly direction towards the fiddle yard. There should be around 70 feet of visible double track before it dives into a tunnel. In 0, this will take a while, and cost a lot....

Ironically, there are some similarities with Folkestone, as a harbour at the bottom of a steep hill, single pier, bridge access, just without the interests of the local landlords preventing the seaside being polluted with a loco shed means I can put it at the bottom rather than the top of the bank! I could even use multiple 57xx's as bankers!

Traffic will comprise regular "Irish Mails", plus passenger services to & from London, the midlands and more locally. Outbound freight will cover cattle, sheep, milk & meat, fish & veg of various sorts dependent on the season, plus dock traffic from Ireland (which may comprise much the same profile), and block trains from the quarry. Inbound freight will comprise coal (for the ships and for Ireland, which I believe still imports it) and manufactured goods, and quarry empties.

So far, I have built most of the locos that will be required, from Martin Finney (47xx), Springside (Hall, 48xx, 45xx), JLTRT (King), CRT (1361) , Warren Shepherd (52xx), Acorn (57xx) and Scorpio (Castle) kits, bought a Dean goods, scratch built a 28xx and need a couple of 43/63xx and Birds/Bull/Dukedogs and a couple more shunters to complete the roster. They are all DCC fitted, the King & 28xx have sound, which I love!

I have amassed 50 plus wagons ( and will need another 50) and 20 plus coaches & brown vehicles, and the main thing I need now is the time & money for the garden building ( or a decent lottery win!!!) in which to start the baseboards and track laying. As that won't happen for at least three & probably five years (not counting on the lottery win here!!!) I will content myself with building more elements of the layout; there is a turntable ( see "stepper motor turntables" in RMWeb), and I've made some pleasing progress with a 7mm scale Stothert & Pitt 12t crane based on the original drawings of the crane at St Peter Port. I've also rescaled the manufacturers drawings of the Edgerton float bridge from Birkenhead docks from1/48 to 1/43.5 ( I hate Henry Greenly!) and am awaiting the opportunity to develop a set of laser cut parts for it.

Train operation will be DCC, points & signals will be mostly servo-driven, though I have a dozen tortoises that will get re-used. Aiming to keep driving and signalling separate.

I hope to rip up the Greater Windowledge Railway and start on the loco shed, it being the only bit of the grand plan that will fit in my lounge, some time early in the New Year. At least, by then I'll have a turntable, a coal stage /water tower and most of the locos...

I'm interested to hear the views of the multitude!

All the best
SD


a few references -

Phil Greaves Rhyd y Clafdy, (Model-railways-live .co.uk)
Trefor - LNWR approach from Caernarvon (RMWeb)
Porth Dinllaen (RMWeb)
Provisional coastal terminus idea (RMWeb)


Proposed London to Porth Dinllaen Railway Report
Pwllheli and Nefyn Light Railway Papers
http://archiveshub.a...tion=0#rightcol

http://en.wikipedia....idfran/Sandbox2

http://www.forgotten...ion/purdon.html

http://en.wikipedia....i/Porthdinllaen

http://www.rhiw.com/...ailway_llyn.htm

http://walks.walking...h-Dinllaen.aspx
  • Like x 5



#2 81A Oldoak

81A Oldoak

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,000 posts
  • LocationChandler's Ford, Hampshire

Posted 25 November 2013 - 21:23

Porth Dinllean has always been an appealing scenario for a might-have-ben layout. My fictitious 4mm opus Abersoch featured a branch from the equally fictitious Boduan Junction to Morfa Nefyn. Your stock list ought to include some ex-Cambrian loco and wagon types. Click here to see progress on my Cambrian 0-6-0 goods loco. http://www.rmweb.co....-gladiator-kit/

 

I shall follow this thread with interest.

 

Regards,


  • Agree x 1

#3 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 25 November 2013 - 22:03

Thanks Chris

Lovely bit of work on the 0-6-0, but I got distracted by Ivor....

Hope to catch up with you and your Fowlers at Reading - told you I needed a couple more shunters - I have a kit for a 1361 and the Fowler could easily have found its way to the back of beyond... Rule1 applies! (Although it might have been a lengthy journey)

I'm sure I could find room for some ex-Cambrian stock in due course...

Best,
SD
  • Like x 1

#4 81A Oldoak

81A Oldoak

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,000 posts
  • LocationChandler's Ford, Hampshire

Posted 26 November 2013 - 13:33

There will be plenty of Fowlers at Reading (Dragon, Tower, Roxey). I'm usually to be found chatting to Chris Basten at Dragon.



#5 Donw

Donw

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 7,338 posts
  • LocationMinehead

Posted 30 November 2013 - 22:30

We obviously share some interests Simon except my layout will be set earlier with the Cambrian and Great Western as seperate companies.  The proposals for such a line was to come from Shrewsbury through the Tanat Valley up the Berwyns and across to Snowdonia which would have required some spectacular engineering. Best of luck with your project.

Don


  • Like x 1

#6 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 01 December 2013 - 19:34

Don

Thanks for your note - good luck to you too!

When you look at some of the bigger projects in here, and meet those lucky guys (and occasional girls) who have built something special, it's sometimes a bit daunting! And there's the time and money, and family commitments, and the boat, and then some silly sod expects me to go to work too! Outrageous!!!

Anyway, more as an experiment in using the forum, I've posted a picture below of my scratch built cardboard Clyde Puffer, "Olive", (named in memory of M-I-L), which is nearly finished, (only about fifty more hours needed to call it complete) and appears on the very much unfinished harbour wall East Quay, my shunting puzzle, otherwise known as the Greater Windowledge Railway. Olive will, one day I hope, be part of the grand plan!

I'll post some more pix in due course - think I'll use the proper camera rather than the iPad!

Best
SD

Attached Thumbnails

  • image.jpg

  • Like x 6

#7 steve fay

steve fay

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,864 posts
  • LocationCwmbran South Wales

Posted 01 December 2013 - 19:57

Please post some pictures of you locos up for us to see.
  • Agree x 1

#8 Donw

Donw

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 7,338 posts
  • LocationMinehead

Posted 01 December 2013 - 20:06

Simon

I see it is not a waterline model so will you have it on drying out mud like Watchet Harbour waiting for the tide?

Don


  • Like x 1

#9 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 01 December 2013 - 21:37

Hi Don,

That was the idea - I'd like a couple of ships, but they're big, and a wee bit unwieldy, particularly in 7mm, so I'll probably settle for a tug or two and a mail tender - there are a few photos in a book/magazine thingy I got last month at the Folkestone show - and maybe a small coaster.

Of course, if it's moored on the "other side of the pier", you'll never know!

SD
  • Like x 1

#10 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 02 December 2013 - 06:20

Steve

Some loco photos here

http://www.gwr.org.uk/galdobson.html

Will post some more when I get a chance

Best
SD
  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 1
  • Like x 1

#11 asa

asa

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 262 posts

Posted 02 December 2013 - 07:49

I like the Clyde puffer Simon,you've made a great job of it.

#12 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 02 December 2013 - 08:33

Slightly off topic, but fun nonetheless, another loco I built

http://www.gauge0gui...ink.asp?id=1426

Asa, thanks for the kind comment, I have some homedrawn plans and lots of build photos of the Puffer - I intended to do an article for the Gazette, but as we all know, the road to Hell...

SD

#13 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 02 December 2013 - 16:05

I suspect some of you can't access the last link, apparently you need to be a GOG member, so here are a couple of photos of locos I built when the kids were young.  Both DCC (ideal for sensible Vmax!) and ideal for banging a couple of Lima minerals about on Dad's railway.

 

 

Attached Thumbnails

  • toby mavis.JPG
  • toby low angle.JPG

  • Like x 3

#14 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 02 December 2013 - 16:10

and here's a couple of sensible ones...

 

close-ups are cruel !!!

 

SD

Attached Thumbnails

  • 57 pannier.JPG
  • 5903e.JPG
  • 5903b.JPG

  • Like x 7
  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 2

#15 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 02 December 2013 - 21:24

few more of the Puffer...

 

clearly needed dusting before photography, sorry about that.  I need to go to a show where there are things like engine room vent cowls, because she clearly needs a pair of them - maybe a couple of small portlights in the engine casing, a binnacle and wheel in the wheelhouse, and the lights need finishing off.   Then a couple of tarpaulins across the cargo hatch  - maybe I'll do it open but that would mean modelling the inside, which might be a bit much.  Still, it can be opened, and I can replace the plain card with proper hatch planks and a ridge beam.  Will see how the mood takes me, when & if the mood takes me.  The whole ship is cardboard, the spars are kitting needles, and the glazing is from the stiff bits you get to keep the collar of a new shirt tidy.  The figures are Phoenix I think.  I was particularly pleased with the winch, which is cardboard, with two capstans made from... the ends of the knitting needles that made the mast and boom.

 

I built her when we came back from abroad nearly 4 years ago, and I had no tools or anything (all in a container on a ship) and we were living in temporary accommodation.  I managed to find a propellor for her, last week.

 

best

SD

Attached Thumbnails

  • olive focsl.JPG
  • olive port bow.JPG
  • olive port qtr.JPG
  • olive stbd bow.JPG

  • Like x 12
  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 6

#16 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 14 December 2013 - 12:54

Hi to all

 

I have done a bit of sketching, to explain my concept of how the line might have been, and consequently, what the model might finally look (a bit) like.

 

I hope the notes in the PDF that is attached can be read - it is ok at 200% zoom.   I've added it as a screendump below.

 

What you will see in green are the lines of the water's edge (not sure of the state of the tide! - fairly low from the appearance of the beach) and the cliff top and bottom and in grey, the outline of Morfa Nefyn town - these were redrawn from Wikimapia screen dumps, copied at 1/43.5 into my CAD program.  This allows direct placement of the model onto the real scenery.  The area shown in the picture is 45m wide by 40m north-south.  Obviously I'm not planning to model that, but I think it is a good way of imagining how the line might have worked in reality, had it ever been built.  The CAD program is basically limitless, so I can do this, now, and then do the "selective compression" later.

 

I overlaid the bits of trackplan that I have done for the passenger station and the loco shed and added a few more details.  The lift bridge is not how I originally envisaged it, as I was going to have it on a kick-back from the goods reception roads, which would  have been alongside the passenger station, and I'm not sure whether it's reasonable for passenger stock to run over it, particularly at the bottom of an incline !  but they did so over a swing bridge at Folkestone, so there's at least some justification.  I want to do a rolling bascule as per Birkenhead docks (according to my scouse pals, I'm a woollyback...).

 

I imagine that the line would come up from Pwllheli alongside the A497, which from memory runs in a shallow valley for a considerable part of the route.  There would then be a halt in Morfa Nefyn town itself, with cattle, goods, and limited passenger facilities, as Morfa Nefyn & Nefyn would have been much bigger had the harbour been built - and staff would have to get to/from work - although it's not actually very far, I suspect that workers' trains are not unreasonable.  There would, of course, be a signal box, along with level crossings, a bay for the banking locos that get the trains up the cutting from the harbour, and the junction to the quarry line.  The purpose of the quarry line is simply to allow the layout have a continuous circuit - and of course to provide a bit more traffic.

 

From Morfa Nefyn the line dips into a cutting that takes it down into the cliff and brings it out on an embankment (probably arched brick / stone) which descends behind the loco sheds, which themselves are built on the reclaimed land from the cutting spoils.  As the line descends to the level of the harbour, a double junction to the left takes the freight stock around the inner harbour, whilst the passenger, mails and parcels continue over the lifting bridge and into the main station, which has the main quay on the seaward side (a la Fishguard?) and some small access to the inner harbour as well.

 

The rest of the layout is planned to be a nested figure 8 with fiddle yard effectively under the scenic line running towards Pwllheli.

 

Thoughts, suggestions and comments very welcome.  (a substatial win on the lottery would also be very welcome!)

 

br

SD

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Attached Files


  • Like x 3

#17 Steve O.

Steve O.

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 234 posts
  • LocationBoston, USA

Posted 14 December 2013 - 13:09

Hi Simon,
Good luck with the layout. Having a history (albeit fictitious) will bring credibility and logic to your creation.
I lIke the cutting through the cliff face and the bascule bridge. Will follow your progress keenly.
Cheers, Steve.

#18 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 14 December 2013 - 16:16

thanks Steve

 

I see that the screendump didnt make it

 

try again...

 

aha, that's what the "add to post" button is for...

 

SD

 

 

 

 

porth dinllaen.jpg


  • Like x 1

#19 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 14 December 2013 - 20:30

couple more loco photos following Steve's request.

 

Dean goods, I bought some years ago, from a chap from the Pett club.  Beautiful, runs very sweetly, Portescap & Zimo chip.  I need to paint the tender axles if I'm going to do low-level shots!

 

dean goods v2.JPG

 

28xx is a mix of bits & scratch, Boiler is from Warren Shepherd, as are the castings - the rest is my problem.  Fully sprung, ABC gearbox on a canon coreless motor, ESU Loksound chip from Howes.  Still got a way to go.

 

CIMG2349.JPG

 

 

br

SD

 

 

 


  • Like x 5
  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 2

#20 Isambard Kingdom Brunel

Isambard Kingdom Brunel

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 1,091 posts
  • LocationSkelmersdale Near Wigan

Posted 22 December 2013 - 12:18

Hi if you are interested in Welsh Railways please express an interest at

 

http://www.rmweb.co....s/#entry1272387

 

Thanks

 



#21 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 25 December 2013 - 06:56

Merry Christmas!

#22 Simond

Simond

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 4,405 posts
  • LocationKent

Posted 28 December 2013 - 16:19

First attempt at an O gauge signal

Kit from Scale Signal Supply about 10 years ago - been sitting, part built, looking at me for most of that time!

Driven by servo motors, in the style of Jon Fitness' models of this parish, to whom thanks for inspiring me to get my finger out - if imitation is indeed the sincerest form of flattery, I hope the imitation is good enough!

The servo motors are controlled by an Arduino Uno, I'm just playing with interlocking using that. It seems to me that this is a cheap and effective means of signal control, at about £3 per servo, and £20 per Arduino, which can drive at least 7 motors.

Learning points - don't wire the lamps in series - they are too dim, that said, it is convenient to drive them off the 6V supply for the motors, and I hadn't planned that when I fitted the lights.

Difficult bits - handrails!

image.jpg
image.jpg
image.jpg
image.jpg
image.jpg
  • Like x 11
  • Craftsmanship/Clever x 2

#23 Jon Fitness

Jon Fitness

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 2,497 posts
  • LocationAt home in Lake, usually at my workbench.

Posted 28 December 2013 - 23:18

Lovely bit of work! Always nice to see worky signals and the activation by arduino sounds interesting. I've seen mention of it in the MERG mag but never really investigated it. Keep up the good work!
Jon. F.
  • Agree x 1

#24 81A Oldoak

81A Oldoak

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 3,000 posts
  • LocationChandler's Ford, Hampshire

Posted 29 December 2013 - 18:16

Lovely bit of work! Always nice to see worky signals and the activation by arduino sounds interesting. I've seen mention of it in the MERG mag but never really investigated it. Keep up the good work!
Jon. F.

Yes indeed. Working semaphore signals are essential whenever they are installed, especially in 7mm scale. Chaz Harrison's solitary GNR somersault signal guarding the exit from his Dock Green layout is a joy to watch and its periodic activation was as interesting as watching the associated rail movements at Warley this year. 

 

CK


  • Agree x 2
  • Like x 1

#25 Donw

Donw

    Member


  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 7,338 posts
  • LocationMinehead

Posted 31 December 2013 - 19:53

I found it a pleasure to operate Bob Harper's Maristow all the signals worked and so did the catch points and traps. There is nothing like working signals to catch the flavour of the old railway.

Don


  • Agree x 3
  • Like x 1












Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: 0 gauge, O gauge, Cambrian coast, Nefyn, GWR, 1930s, Porth Dinllaen