sammyboy Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 I dug out my copy of a old Model Rail magazine (January 2009) on the evening of New Year's Day 2014 and happened to notice that the legendary "Borchester Market" layout was featured in that perticular issue and started to read through the text and look at the great photos of what is such a iconic layout. Personally, I model these days in N Gauge, but appreciate any good layout built to any scale and would like one day to model a version of the Borchester layout to N Gauge standards. Sam 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) I dug out my copy of a old Model Rail magazine (January 2009) on the evening of New Year's Day 2014 and happened to notice that the legendary "Borchester Market" layout was featured in that perticular issue and started to read through the text and look at the great photos of what is such a iconic layout. Personally, I model these days in N Gauge, but appreciate any good layout built to any scale and would like one day to model a version of the Borchester layout to N Gauge standards. Sam Have you not managed to see it yet? It's a great layout and now that it's been saved has been to a few shows over the past couple of years. I believe it's going to the Spalding show in November. More about it under its current owners here http://www.newhavendmrc.com/club-layouts/borchester-market-1/ Edited January 2, 2014 by Pacific231G 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Fantastic layout, hope to see it one day. Paddy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 One of my all time favourites and I was so pleased to see it on the exhibition circuit at Horsham two or three years back. I took some pics and will dig them out. Although not to the professional quality of those on the web site, they may show features of the layout not covered in the existing pics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyboy Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 I have had the opportunity to go and see it when Borchester was at the old "Model Rail Live" event at Barrow Hill a few years back. I remember being stood at the terminus station end being surrounded by hordes of fellow modellers, all desperate to see the classic layout in the flesh. Sam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HSB Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 It was at Warley this year and it was nice to see it in the flesh. Showing its age a bit now but it was certainly an inspirational layout in its day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post gordon s Posted January 2, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Here are the pics I took at the Horsham Show. Amazed to see it was April 2008, so probably it's first outing under the new ownership. Edited January 2, 2014 by gordon s 28 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyboy Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 Great photos Gordon S. It shows just how compact the layout really is, clearly built for a spare bedroom in the original owners home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CUTLER2579 Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 From Gordon S Quote " Here are the pics I took at the Horsham Show. Amazed to see it was April 2008, so probably it's first outing under the new ownership." Quote. I think it had been exhibited at Brighton a good while prior to 2008 Gordon. I may of course be wrong as the memory plays strange tricks on me these days. I had the great pleasure of getting to know Frank & his good Lady slightly in the 60's when they lived in North West London. My all time favourite layout,just ahead of High Dyke from Roy Jackson, Geoff Kent & John Phillips. Still see that Lima Deltic and the Pesky Red Rat at "Retford" occasionally. Talk about not taking yourselves too seriously.Lovely people. Regards,Derek. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godders Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 There are also clips of it in a tv film called "a lineside look at model railways" presented by Bob Symes(-Schutzmann). It shows frank and his crew operating and shows why it was so good, the interlocking was discipline between operators, with orders from Frank. Cheers Godders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 ...Personally, I model these days in N Gauge, but appreciate any good layout built to any scale and would like one day to model a version of the Borchester layout to N Gauge standards... That would be an interesting experiment. What with human beings not scaling, if the operating well were left much the same physical size as on the OO layout simply for comfort, and the track plan network were then transposed onto the twice the linear space around the well that results, how would the track plan look? Many of the very cunning compromises used to get so much in on a 4mm layout - that the eye accepts thanks to their artfulness - could be eliminated for a more 'realistic' layout. Would it be better / equal in visual impact, given that it was done with equal modelling skill? I think it was someone in David Jenkinson's circle of modelling friends - possibly Arthur Whitehead? - about the time that DJ was embarking on his modest 'Little Long Drag' project, who proposed that the compression of ground plan that we are typically forced into might actually be a good thing. The real railway so often sprawls, and our perceptions of that sprawl when accurately reproduced tends to be that it is a little - dull? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Well as one of the current minders of the layout it's nice to see somebody raise an appreciation for the layout, hopefully you understand what this layout really is all about and why it is still worth showing. The plan is to periodically update the Newhaven & District website with some further layout details, http://www.newhavendmrc.com/club-layouts/borchester-market-1/ The layout will now be having two outings this year, Seaford Show 25/26 October Spalding show 15/16 November I can't speak for the operators but the layout itself is certainly behaving these days, the Warley show is probably the best it has ever run with us. A surprise to us at Warley was winning the Best Signalled Layout award from the Signalling Record Society, a fitting tribute to Frank Dyer really. The layout is still fully signalled and these fit in with all the timetable movements. What have we done? Well the two main station platform signals had been repaired on a few occassions by the looks of it and our Ray Warner has replaced these with etched brass ones. Ray has also managed to repair the arrivals starter signals which had also been damaged, but apart from some TLC we have not had to touch the main gantry signals, these were scratchbuilt by Frank Dyer, it's a work of art, even the platform arrival panel works to tell you if a train is going to platform 1, 2, 3 or 4. Charlie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RANGERS Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Frank was a truly inspirational character to many of my generation and the succession of His layouts which featured in the old Model Railways showcased the best practice for just about everything in those days, hard to believe it but almost 40 years ago now. 'Market was the only one of Frank's layouts I ever saw in the flesh but having seen it a couple of times in its original state and again a couple of times in the new guise, it doesn't appear to be an old, dated and obsolete piece, such as much of the RTR stock of that era appears today against contemporary standards, but more of a masterpiece which has matured into a true classic and can still show the newcomers something of great value. In short, it's a glowing tribute to a true genius who contributed so much to the hobby. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted January 4, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 4, 2014 It is one of those layouts that really does deserve its place in the history of our hobby. What happens to the layout between shows nowadays? Is it set up and operated regularly, as Frank Dyer used to do? I have just been reading his series of articles about layout operation in the early MRJs for the umpteenth time. They should be compulsory reading for anybody who wants to get the most satisfaction and pleasure out of designing, building and operating a layout. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I live in the hope that one day somebody will manage to organise an exhibition that brings together Borchester, Leighton Buzzard (from Buckingham) and Dundreich (C&MR). Whatever plans I have to cancel for that day, and no matter how far away it is - I'm going! :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted January 4, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 4, 2014 I live in the hope that one day somebody will manage to organise an exhibition that brings together Borchester, Leighton Buzzard (from Buckingham) and Dundreich (C&MR). Whatever plans I have to cancel for that day, and no matter how far away it is - I'm going! :-) You can count me in with Leighton Buzzard for that one! Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60526 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 "What happens to the layout between shows nowadays? Is it set up and operated regularly, as Frank Dyer used to do?" The layout moved from it's shed near Brighton down to the Newhaven Clubroom about a year ago. It's currently just sitting on it's runners while we get on with other club layouts. Because there is nothing wrong with it at the moment the chances are that it will be set up for some running but not to have the weekly sessions that Frank used to have. There are 6 operators at the moment, 3 are with the Newhaven club the other 3 live in Croydon, Huddersfield and York, so total running sessions are not practical, we only managed one session last year in September, mind you we were also doing a lot of electrical work then. We've probably got 4 or 5 new locos that are going to be added to the stud before the next exhibition, so that's a good excuse to get things running. Contrary to something I read about the layout on RMweb after the Nottingham exhibition implying that we were only running RTR stock, ever since we aquired the layout we have always had a mix of RTR and kit built, we were using 21 kit built locos at Nottingham and 22 at Warley for instance. To match Franks original stock, 4 of the new locos will be out of a C12 (Craftsman), J6 (Nu-cast), J50 (Lima/Perseverance), K2 (Nu-cast) and N1 (Little Engines), there's also a PDK Wolf of Baddenock coming along to replace a DJH version, that's 60506 not 2004 or 87027. That only leaves us with a 4F to make and we've got a Airfix/Comet model to make but it needs to take it's place in the works. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 (edited) Many of the very cunning compromises used to get so much in on a 4mm layout - that the eye accepts thanks to their artfulness - could be eliminated for a more 'realistic' layout. Would it be better / equal in visual impact, given that it was done with equal modelling skill? I think it was someone in David Jenkinson's circle of modelling friends - possibly Arthur Whitehead? - about the time that DJ was embarking on his modest 'Little Long Drag' project, who proposed that the compression of ground plan that we are typically forced into might actually be a good thing. The real railway so often sprawls, and our perceptions of that sprawl when accurately reproduced tends to be that it is a little - dull? I've always felt that to be true. The few layouts I've seen that have been dead scale have seemed at least to my eyes frankly rather dull. There is a saying that art is life with the boring bits left out and the modellers whose work I've most admired including Frank Dyer but also Peter Denny. John Ahern and Phillip Hancock seemed to understand that very well. I think it's partly to do with how we view layouts. In 00 we'd normally be the equivalent of maybe 50 yards from the nearest track and a hundred feet or so above it but perceiving that view as being from much closer. One thing I have noticed though is that the degree of compression that's acceptable seems to increase with scale so long as the layout is viewed from a similar distance. In O scale I can easily believe that four coaches is a mainline express but in 00 it would require a few scene breaks to achieve the same and I don't think it would work in N. I think it's to do with how much the eye takes in at a single glance. I don't know if there's a rule of thumb for that but if I were reducing a plan from 00 to N I think I might go for 2/3 rather than 1/2 the overall size and spread things out a bit more. Edited April 3, 2016 by Pacific231G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 You can count me in with Leighton Buzzard for that one! Tony Unfortunately the expenses budget for my own show wouldn't run to one of those layouts, never mind all three.... :-( Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyboy Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 At least if my proposed future N gauge version of Borchester was built, I'd have a lot more space for surrounding scenery outside the railway fence if the size of the existing baseboards were kept the same. Sam 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWales Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 (edited) Funny that I should stumble over this topic the day after I found Model Railways for September 1980 which featured Borchester Market ! Anyone know what happened to the follow up 'Hardwick Grange'? Edited January 10, 2014 by MartinWales 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 ... and can anyone share pics or plans of Borchester Town which I think was Market's predecessor? An article on BT got me back into modelling in the late 80s... unfortunately the products of Airfix Lima, Mainline and Hornby got me back out again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 (edited) Funny that I should stuble over this topic the day after I found Model Railways for September 1980 which featured Borchester Market ! Anyone know what happened to the follow up 'Hardwick Grange'? Try here, about halfway down…It's with Cardiff Model Engineering Society http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=16929&start=50 ..and some pics here. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52006-model-rail-167-march/ Edited January 9, 2014 by gordon s Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWales Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Thanks for that Gordon! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 ... and can anyone share pics or plans of Borchester Town which I think was Market's predecessor? You will find this in MRJs 36 to 42, I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now