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Bachmann E4





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#26 pete_mcfarlane

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 10:57

Oh good, I am not alone in eyeing every new model as a carve up! The alternative body whether resin cast or 3D printed to fit the chassis, as suggested by 'its-er' sounds like a winner to me. Bound to be someone in the P4/EM department wanting to build their own chassis, who will relieve you of the E4 body.

If somebody wants to do an alternative body for the E4 chassis, then the E4X rebuilds would be a good bet. The various X rebuilds of the Brighton radial tanks are quite attractive in a freakish kind of way with their oversized boilers.



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#27 Anglian

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 11:47

Ordered in LBSC Umber.



#28 G-BOAF

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 11:56

Response from Bachmann

Andy thanks so much for that.

I was right about the splashers then! Depending on how they arrange the lining (BR Black) and panels (on the LBSC and SR versions) the immediate visual impact of the splasher size can be mitigated a little.

 

Also note the whistle on the cab roof. Assuming they've also done the firebox-mounted whistle, a nice variation there.

Chimney is excellent, with compound curve at the base. wonderful!

 

Re Dome: I'm willing to blame the grey finish in the Bachmann photograph, but I still think there's something note quite right about the dome shape, I still feel there is too much vertical on the model dome, but I can't put my finger on it exactly.

Compare prototype

http://locoyard.file...birch-grove.jpg

with model

http://www.bachmann..../E4EP_front.jpg

Anyone any thoughts?


Edited by G-BOAF, 21 January 2014 - 11:57 .

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#29 Oldddudders

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 11:57

Ordered in LBSC Umber.

Good. I hope the umber version sells well, so Bachmann are encouraged to do the yellow version - with name. All these lovely tanks - classes E3 to E6 - had names in their first livery, the E4s being mainly named after Sussex villages. That whimsy was stopped when sensible Marsh umber appeared. Let no-one pretend the pre-Grouping scene wasn't colourful.


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#30 Nick Holliday

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Posted 21 January 2014 - 13:28

Good. I hope the umber version sells well, so Bachmann are encouraged to do the yellow version - with name. All these lovely tanks - classes E3 to E6 - had names in their first livery, the E4s being mainly named after Sussex villages. That whimsy was stopped when sensible Marsh umber appeared. Let no-one pretend the pre-Grouping scene wasn't colourful.

Sadly, the Bachmann version represents those fitted with an I1 boiler, with the extended smokebox. Not as drastic as the E4X rebuild, but quite a visual impact, nonetheless. This re-boilering took place after Marsh was in charge, and unfortunately all would have been turned out in umber with no name. It should be remembered that Birch Grove only carried a name and umber on the Bluebell.

Perhaps Branchlines (the etched kit people) could be pursuaded to create a conversion kit from the Stenning/Weald Models E4 kit, but an enormous amount of care would be needed to preserve the yellow livery as the dome and possibly the safety valves would need changing as well as the smokebox, and all the extraneous pipework along the boiler should go too.

Edited by Nick Holliday, 24 January 2014 - 10:56 .

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#31 Andy Hayter

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 21:29

Does that mean that the Bachmann livery will be fictional?  Or just that said model should not carry a name?



#32 Talltim

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 21:35

I think I'm right in saying that the Umber is correct, but the earlier named yellow wouldn't be, but they haven't said they will do it anyway

I think I'm right in saying that the Umber is correct, but the earlier named yellow wouldn't be, but they haven't said they will do it anyway

#33 Nick Holliday

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 11:00

Does that mean that the Bachmann livery will be fictional?  Or just that said model should not carry a name?

The umber livery would be correct for the model as shown, although I cannot be sure that the large gauge pipework along the boiler is appropriate for a pre-grouping loco.  If it is produced without any name, that would be correct for the LBSCR era.  If it is named Birch Grove then that would only be correct for its preserved state, as, to the best of my knowledge, none of the E4's retained their name following the application of the umber livery, and certainly not with the extended smokebox.

If Bachmann were to do a yellow version, that would require a different smokebox and a change of boiler fittings as well.  Just for the record, a number of the E4 tanks first appeared in Stroudley's goods green livery, as they were intended as mixed traffic locos, although all were in yellow by the end of the century, and 12 of them were sent to France during the Great War and I believe some of them retained their WD grey livery for a while after they returned.



#34 brushman47544

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 11:09

The umber livery would be correct for the model as shown, although I cannot be sure that the large gauge pipework along the boiler is appropriate for a pre-grouping loco.  If it is produced without any name, that would be correct for the LBSCR era.  If it is named Birch Grove then that would only be correct for its preserved state, as, to the best of my knowledge, none of the E4's retained their name following the application of the umber livery, and certainly not with the extended smokebox.

If Bachmann were to do a yellow version, that would require a different smokebox and a change of boiler fittings as well.  Just for the record, a number of the E4 tanks first appeared in Stroudley's goods green livery, as they were intended as mixed traffic locos, although all were in yellow by the end of the century, and 12 of them were sent to France during the Great War and I believe some of them retained their WD grey livery for a while after they returned.

 

Except that the Umber version will be numbered 579 according to the Bachmann website so it's name if carried should be Roehampton. ;)


Edited by brushman47544, 24 January 2014 - 11:09 .


#35 phil-b259

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 11:20

Does that mean that the Bachmann livery will be fictional?  Or just that said model should not carry a name?

 

IIFC what Bachmann are producing will be correct i.e. none of the E4s will be named. As has been mentioned earlier, ALL names were removed from LBSCR engines when repainted into the umber colour scheme introduced by DE Marsh, Thus the Bluebell's rendition of 473 in umber livery with its name on the side is a completely fictitious preservation one, something never seen in real service



#36 Andy Y

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 16:05

Andy thanks so much for that.
I was right about the splashers then! Depending on how they arrange the lining (BR Black) and panels (on the LBSC and SR versions) the immediate visual impact of the splasher size can be mitigated a little.


Having had a good look over the EP sample of the E4 today I'd be quite comfortable in saying that, when painted black, any oversizing of the splashers to accommodate OO wheel standards won't look bad at all. I've included and underside shot. It's apparent the matter has been considered when having a good look underneath as the allowances are quite tight and manipulating the model around to look in 3 dimensions it's apparent that the needs of the cast footplate and their commensurate thickness mean there's little more could be done to mitigate any influences on the splashers.

1s.jpg

2s.jpg

3s.jpg

4s.jpg

5s.jpg
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#37 Graham_Muz

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 16:14

Great pictures Andy thanks for posting really shows its going to be another cracking model


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#38 G-BOAF

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 18:08

some impressive engineering there. Dome looks a lot better in those shots as well.

Just to check, is there a tooling option for a boiler-mounted whistle? 473 certainly should have one there and not on the cab roof.

 

EDITED - "boiler-mounted whistle"


Edited by G-BOAF, 24 January 2014 - 22:34 .


#39 Bluebell Model Railway

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 20:52

some impressive engineering there. Dome looks a lot better in those shots as well.

Just to check, is there a tooling option for a boiler-mounted dome? 473 certainly should have one there and not on the cab roof.

I Guess you mean the whistle? I wondered this myself, I guess this is the LBSC version.... not the SR preserved example, I see the whistle has been in different places during it's life...


Edited by Bluebell Model Railway, 24 January 2014 - 21:09 .


#40 G-BOAF

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 22:35

I Guess you mean the whistle? I wondered this myself, I guess this is the LBSC version.... not the SR preserved example, I see the whistle has been in different places during it's life...

yep. Funny I remember thinking 'must write dome' and then wrote just that!

I only ask as between them, Bachmann and Andy have released pics of two models, one with a BR numberplate, and one without. Both have cab-mounted whistles.



#41 darren01

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 00:27

Hi

looking very good one on pre order, not long now!.



#42 Oldddudders

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 10:27

Just for the record, a number of the E4 tanks first appeared in Stroudley's goods green livery, as they were intended as mixed traffic locos, although all were in yellow by the end of the century,

Bradley records 475 Partridge Green (!) as being in green until receiving umber in July 1912.



#43 34theletterbetweenB&D

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 11:09

The underside view is very revealing. The aspect that caught my attention is the trailing truck wheel arrangement. Looks as though it is in a swivelling mount, much as the arrangement on the 56xx - also 0-6-2T - model. What I found with this latter chassis is that this makes the vehicle track sensitive, as the wheel can take an oblique set when going through a point network leading to derailment, especially bunker leading. (Peco large and medium radius live crossing points for the record.)

 

A simple lightly sprung pony truck is a far better choice in my opinion, completely reliable. (Since I couldn't have my N7 falling over the points all the time, I fixed the 56xx chassis by gluing on shims bearing on the axle to prevent any pivoting action, more than adequate sideplay to still get this chassis round a 24" radius.)



#44 S.A.C Martin

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 11:40

Looks utterly superb. Great pictures of the E4 too. However is there a bit of pipework missing from the model? 

 

index.php?app=core&module=attach&section

 

 

CIMG0588_2.jpg

 

This could of course be a later addition, I don't know. Not familiar with the prototype other than my limited visits to the Bluebell.



#45 Oldddudders

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:26

Engineering detail is not really my sphere, but I read that the I1 boiler in this application needed to have the clack valves repositioned from their original location underneath, and that is what I believe this to be. So I suspect, yes, they should be there.



#46 Matloughe

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 21:43

Others have said it, but I am going to say it again the EP looks absolutely superb with those curves the model looks delicious. I can't wait for it to arrive; currently splashed out for the LBSC Marsh Umber, and Southern Green E4.... and also the Southern H2 as well... whoops. 

 



#47 GreatWesternFan220

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 05:03

Having had a good look over the EP sample of the E4 today I'd be quite comfortable in saying that, when painted black, any oversizing of the splashers to accommodate OO wheel standards won't look bad at all. I've included and underside shot. It's apparent the matter has been considered when having a good look underneath as the allowances are quite tight and manipulating the model around to look in 3 dimensions it's apparent that the needs of the cast footplate and their commensurate thickness mean there's little more could be done to mitigate any influences on the splashers.

attachicon.gif1s.jpg

attachicon.gif2s.jpg

attachicon.gif3s.jpg

attachicon.gif4s.jpg

attachicon.gif5s.jpg

OMG! They look so beautiful. I can't wait to get preserved example when it gets released. :imsohappy:



#48 JSpencer

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:28

I think I can agree with others about chimney and dome both looking a tad too tall and thin. Though that may just be an optical illusion. I guess Bachmann will measures both to ensure they are correct.

Agree on the bit of pipe work being missing.

Other than that, nice looking model.

Edited by JSpencer, 26 January 2014 - 10:28 .


#49 ianmaccormac

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 22:08

The photo I have of 579 in LBSC Umber does not have the pipework and it has a cab mounted whistle.
Cheers
Ian

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#50 darren01

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 07:17

Hi

I have seen  both the EP Bachmann are doing,One has the pipe on the side and the other has the western house pump and no pipe work on the boiler.

Hope this helps.

Darren


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