EMUs, locos, coaching stock and associated items for Balcombe

[Re6/6]

Being prompted by Ian's (5BEL) 4LAV thread I thought that I'd dig out some snaps of the beginnings of the 6CIT project for Balcombe (stalled ATM).

Upon perusal of the 'King' drawings I found that the 6CITs (all first class seats units) had shorter TFK coaches (58') than the normal 6PUL/4COR trailers (62'6) thus fitting quite well with the Hornby Maunsells.

Considering that the Hornby models were rather nicely made and accurate I felt that they would make a good basis for cutting'n'shutting, utilizing the standard chassis, ends and roof sections.

 

The door and window positions were different on the 6CIT TFKs to the standard Maunsell FKs, so four new side ends had to be made out of nickel-silver sheet.

 

This is as far as the project has got at the moment.
 

Shows one of the short TFKs with driving motor trailer 11001, the prototype slab sided version.

 

Photo ctsy of Chris Knowles-Thomas

 

The 'cutting' process.

(images 3, 6, 7 & 8 are actually of an all third)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The sides.

 

 

 

 

 

Showing the different window and door spacings

 

Sides and roof lightly attached.

Edited April 2, 2018 by Re6/6

[Southernboy]

6-CIT build?

 

That made me have an excitedly sharp intake of breath!

 

Good luck - definitely something I'd like to replicate in N Gauge one day.

Edited December 26, 2013 by Southernboy

[Re6/6]

Hornby Brighton Belle trailer carve up!

 

I was lucky enough to get hold of a spare 'Doris' body from Ebay for the project....

...which was duly cut up.

 

 

the cut'n'shut process

 

An untouched Doris below. This shows the difference in window arrangements on the 6PULs/6CITs Pullman trailers

 

All put back together...still much filling and finishing to be done...and then the cut up of the interior to consider!

 

Edited December 27, 2013 by Re6/6

[Re6/6]

The DMBT build.

 

This is for the second prototype driving trailer no 11002, from which the production batch were based with their six and a half windows compared to this one with seven windows. As can be seen from the King drawing the window spacings on the Kirk Maunsell open 3rd aren't quite correct but I didn't fancy cutting'n'shutting seven small pieces of plastic side so I made the correct length with small alterations to the luggage compartment.

 

It would have been nice to have the spacings actually right but with the length correct I applied the Captain's 'Black 5 yardstick'..."if it looks like a 6CIT/6PUL motor coach it must be one from normal viewing distances!

 

The pieces of side and door come from the aforementioned Kirk open 3rd, brake 3rd (with the flat profile scored on the back and gently bent and flooded with solvent) and two offcut doors.

 

 

The floor was made from 60 thou 'Plasticard' and the underframe from 5mm² nickel-silver rod for strength and to accommodate a Hornby 'Belle' motor bogie.

 

 

The nickel-silver 'face' was made from a spare 5BEL etching as pattern, slightly widened,  from a previously planned M.A.R.C. Models  Belle DMBT. ...that was until Hornby came along!

 

The complex curved shape of the vertical joins was done using decorator's caulk, built up slowly and then filed & sanded to get the shape...(still not quite right!)

 

The cab roof was made from layers of 60 thou 'Plasticard' and a lot of shaping.......again more work needed until it looks right!"

 

 

Mounted on its bogies with a Kirk Maunsell roof. I may consider an MJT aluminium roof section to give a really straight roof. The profile may not be totally exact..but hey ho.. I would defy anybody to comment on a slightly incorrect roof profile when the set is running across the viaduct at full line speed!

 

 

 

For the slab sided original prototype no 11001, which normally ran in a 6CIT unit (picture in first post) will be made from a Bill Bedford set of flat side etches for a Maunsell open 3rd, but this time the etch will be cut and soldered to produce the correct spacings. Despite any 'Black 5 test' it is nice to have it accurate....At least I'll know and be satisfied...a****y retentive, or what!

Edited December 27, 2013 by Re6/6

[10800]

Nice going John, you'll have finished this before I've converted my 5BEL to P4 at this rate!

 

And a good example of 'acceptable accuracy' in the face of limited time/other distractions!

[Colin parks]

Hi John,

 

An epic conversion is underway here! It will be interesting to see this project develop.

 

Re. motor coach sides, they look to be the same as a 4 COR in layout. If you are going to cut-and-shut the slab-sided one, it might be worth checking on the panel widths between windows: They are not all the same width. The panel where the saloon partition is situated is wider by the width of the partition i.e. approx. 1mm.

 

Good luck!

 

Colin

[Re6/6]

Hi Colin

 

Thanks for the tips. I hadn't checked!

[emt_911]

John

 

I've been following this with great interest and think you are right about the minor errors with the window spacing.

 

I wouldn't have considered using decorator's caulk. Is this something you have used successfully before?

 

Duncan

[Re6/6]

Duncan

 

I found that decorators caulk does work well when applied in thin coats. 

 

I originally used De-Luxe 'Perfect Plastic Putty' filler @ £4.75 for a small tube http://www.deluxematerials.co.uk/pages/fillerproducts.htm  but found that it seemed to be the same make up as ordinary decorators caulk at a fraction of the cost.

 

I recall that somebody on here drew my attention to this.

 

I tried other types of cellulose fillers (Squadron etc,.) but I don't get on very well with them. They seem to dry out in the tube and aren't as pliable as caulk.

 

For the cost alone, caulk is worth a try.....but it's always 'horses for courses'...!.

[emt_911]

Thanks John

 

I've got plenty lying around, so when work resumes I'll give it a try.

 

Duncan

[Re6/6]

A good day today! The custom etches have arrived to build two of our 4-LAV sets required for Balcombe.

 

They were done by Allen Doherty who is 'Worsley Works'.

 

I must say that I'm delighted with them. Beautiful crisp etches for all the important bits.(I just don't have the skills and patience that you have Colin!)

 

I thought that the 'juice heads' on here would like to see them. 

 

The build won't start for a little while, but it's good to have them as they will really fill a gap.....just waiting now for Bachby to announce them as their next...........!

 

It was a very seamless process getting these etches done by 'Worsley Works'

 

 

Edited February 7, 2014 by Re6/6

[Brian Kirby]

Hi John,

   They look pretty good to me, etched corridor partitions too! At first glance i thought a utility van had sneaked in on the act (the short etch), but with eyeballs on maximum squint, i think i can now make out two 4LAV wrap-around motor coach half ends? Will these be mixed with Kirk BIL parts, or are there more etches to come? Who's roofs will you use?

 

                                                                                                       Cheers, Brian.

[Miss Prism]

No half-etches for bolections, or would they have made the overall etch too expensive?

[Re6/6]

Hi John,

   They look pretty good to me, etched corridor partitions too! At first glance i thought a utility van had sneaked in on the act (the short etch), but with eyeballs on maximum squint, i think i can now make out two 4LAV wrap-around motor coach half ends? Will these be mixed with Kirk BIL parts, or are there more etches to come? Who's roofs will you use?

 

                                                                                                       Cheers, Brian.

 

I may be using some Kirk bits from some BIL kits that I've got. This is it for the moment until I've had a really good look at the etches. I'll probably be using some MJT aluminium roof section. Not sure which part number yet but I have some in stock that are very close to the end etch profile.

 

I've checked them with King and the sides are spot on.

 

No half-etches for bolections, or would they have made the overall etch too expensive?

 

I'm still considering having some etched or maybe investigate laser cut 'Romark'. We've had some very small and thin pieces cut for the viaduct 'fancy work'.done this way.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Re6/6

[Joseph_Pestell]

Has Worsley done these just for you? Or are they available to others?

[Re6/6]

Has Worsley done these just for you? Or are they available to others?

 

Yes Allen did do them for me as an order. He did the artwork etc as well, but I'm sure that he would welcome any orders as he (and others) usually sell the etches for general order once the original work has been done.

[Re6/6]

I had intended to file the etches away in a box, but you know how it is....one just has to have a play around.

 

They are just etches, so as the man once said..."go figure"

 

Well,having sat in front of the tele watching the Olympics (I've just got to get on snow one last time before decrepitude gets too much of a hold!) much 'figuring out' as to how to proceed was done and a start was made with the undercarriage of one of the trailer cars. It was an excuse to get out the resistance solderer and have a play with that. (not been used for a few years now) so the bits were tacked together conventionally and then by resistance. I must remember to lift the foot switch before lifting the probe from the work!

 

The etchings are nice to work with and well thought out. The solebars, foot boards, fold down trussing and buffer beams have been added.

 

 

Edited February 10, 2014 by Re6/6

[10800]

Ha! I just knew you wouldn't be able to resist ...

[Re6/6]

I got incapacitated at the weekend so some nice sitting down and playing with the etches was the logical conclusion!

 

The first job was to add all the side detail.

 

I experimented with making a grab handle jig by way of the John Hayes article in MRJ 83 but couldn't get the consistency that was needed. The 'Maunsell shape' didn't seem to work with this method.  Probably better for GWR type as described. Anyway I'm not building any GW coaches at the moment!

 

In the end I used Roxey etched ones which will work quite well once I get the consistency of shape that is needed. Door handles were made from Peco track pins squashed and filed to shape.

 

Hinges to be added.

 

Experiments in glazing were made using 0.17 glass microscope glass cover slips, which has proved quite promising. Rather too many were broken to begin with, but with practice....!

 

Door handle consistency not quite right yet..also a couple of mistakes with the door stops! 

 

Edited February 25, 2014 by Re6/6

[chrisf]

"Incapacitated".  Not "as a newt", I trust?

 

I am building a GWR coach at the moment and suffered a high breakage rate of etched grab handles.  The way forward for me will be bending wire with the aid of a jig, be it the John Hayes design or another idea that someone gave me at the weekend.  Details will follow if the results satisfy me but I'm not easily pleased!

 

This looks to be a most interesting project!

 

Chris

[Re6/6]

 Chris, it was a physical incapacitation as opposed to a fluid intake indispostion fortunately (or unfortunately...!)

 

The Hayes method looks to be a good method for GW versions. The SR ones are much 'sharper' in the curvature top and bottom.

 

I would be interested if you have success with any method as I have quite a few GW coaches to build in the future!

[Colin parks]

Hi John,

 

 

The side is looking good! 

 

Re. commode handles: I used the Roxey grab handles on the 4 COR I made. The tricky bit is getting the bends right each time as they have no half-etched fold line if I remember correctly. It  would be possible to make a bending  jig from three layers of brass sheet, with an angled middle section to match the angle of the handle. This would  create a pocket/slot into which the commode handle would be inserted, leaving just the 'legs' to be bent sticking out.  That would give you the consistency of bend that you need.   

 

Chrisf's method of bending and filing wire in a jig would give the correct basic shape of commode handle but it would not have the characteristic flattened 'bulge'.

 

All the best,

 

Colin

[Re6/6]

Thanks Colin.

 

The Roxey handles are good, but as you say they don't have any fold line. This is the way that has worked for me.

 

 

 

 

[Colin parks]

Hi John,

 

That method of folding the handles looks just as good a solution.

 

The lack fold lines on the Roxey etchings does have its advantages though as they are much stronger when bent and can be re-worked without snapping. I also used these handles on the Hornby 2 BIL upgrade and if the handles are securely fixed, some gentle adjustment with pliers is possible the get the handles to all stand vertically - not the easiest of tasks as the bending process influences the way these handles will sit(as you now know!)

 

All the best,

 

Colin

[Re6/6]

Thanks Colin,

 

Yes, I guess that any fold lines would be a weak spot as it sometimes takes a couple of goes to get the bends right!

 

What is useful is the very faint 'bolt head' etchings to give guidance. You're quite right about about getting them to stand vertically. With practice I think that they will certainly do the job.

 

Fortunately Allen's etching holes are virtually perfect to suit these handles. Only a very small bit of tweaking is needed on each one.