Newcastle Emlyn - Early goods rolling stock

[Fat Controller]

Here's a possible reason why the train was pushed back.

In the picture of the van you kindly put up there can clearly be seen a hose attached to a water faucet. It might just be that the water tanks needed filling and the hose is too short to reach the coaches nearest the engine.  Any takers?

 

The coach is a mk1 buffet car with commonwealth bogies. Should be available from Bachmann....... I know Hattons have the chocolate and cream version in stock albeit on mk1 bogies.

 

Edit; Hattons unbelievably have two versions..... with commonwealth bogies too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Edit#2: I might just have to scratch build one of those match board vans

No need to scratchbuild in 4mm/ft; Parkside do their PC61, which looks to be similar, but on a wooden underframe:-

http://www.parksidedundas.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_LONDON___NORTH_EASTERN_RAILWAY.html

[Sasquatch]

Thanks Brian.


Having already built 9 different versions of LNER vans from Parkside kits I'm now looking to build further variations.

This one is interesting as it seems to be on an ex LMS chassis. What it might be worth doing is making one side and one end then make a mold and cast it that way I could make the LNER chassis version and might find a market for some castings to cover the cost of the RV rubber compound and two part plastic! 

 

Sorry Neil mate not trying to hijack your thread. I'll shut up now.

 

Regards Shaun

[Jaz]

No need to scratchbuild in 4mm/ft; Parkside do their PC61, which looks to be similar, but on a wooden underframe:-

http://www.parksidedundas.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_LONDON___NORTH_EASTERN_RAILWAY.html

 

Thanks Brian.

 

 

Having already built 9 different versions of LNER vans from Parkside kits I'm now looking to build further variations.

This one is interesting as it seems to be on an ex LMS chassis. What it might be worth doing is making one side and one end then make a mold and cast it that way I could make the LNER chassis version and might find a market for some castings to cover the cost of the RV rubber compound and two part plastic! 

 

Sorry Neil mate not trying to hijack your thread. I'll shut up now.

 

Regards Shaun

you guys have got to stop talking about wagons....im retaining information......i could become knowledgeable.....that's just not right......

[Sasquatch]

Sasquatch is a real nurd when it comes to wagons! It's more the case that I build layouts to run the wagons on where as most people do things the other way around!

[Fat Controller]

Sasquatch is a real nurd when it comes to wagons! It's more the case that I build layouts to run the wagons on where as most people do things the other way around!

At least you build the layouts...

[ChrisN]

Neil,

I regularly read RMMag so I asked the questions about backing coaches and got this reply

 

Setting back movements

The movement ChrisN observed sounds like "setting back", repositioning a train at the platform before departure.

This does indeed happen elsewhere - I supervised such a movement earlier today at Wharf station on the Talyllyn while acting as guard - but I don't think it was characteristic of any particular company's methods of operation.

On the TR stock is set back in order to ensure that the saloon in a train, which has double doors to accommodate wheelchairs, is positioned adjacent to the platform to assist wheelchair users; if it were not necessary to do this the movement would probably be avoided. Moving trains with passengers in them is not to be undertaken lightly because it is potentially hazardous - people tend to make a rush for the train, thinking they'll miss it, even if you explain that it's only being repositioned.

On most steam-age lines passenger trains tended to stop in a particular position along the platform as a matter of routine. Station staff would also position platform barrows in the area where the guard's compartment of the brake would come to rest - rolling stock would be marshalled to ensure, by and large, that this was consistent. This avoided the need for setting back or other repositioning once the train stopped. Passengers, being self-propelled, were expected to walk to where the train was, rather than vice versa.

 

Hope this helps. 

[Anotheran]

Thanks for that Chris,

 

It could well be then that the "setting back" was done at Bodmin General for the very reason that they did have a wheelchair ramp at a specific place on the platform. I had been suprised by the move given that there were passengers on board and appeared to be no need for it as all carriages were alongside the platform. But this gives some reason. I guess that means that it probably wouldn't have happened at NE though as the platform there was long enough for the normal two carriage trains. So maybe I'll need to put the occasional holiday train with an extra couple of carriages in, just so that it needs to be done!

[Anotheran]

For anyone that is interested I have done some research into the history of the station so that I can look at what I can run when. Here's my summary in my favourite application... Excel

 

 

The different colours of years are effectively blocks during which there was no change at all to the appearance of the station. Some of those boundaries I can ignore with modellers licence and others are so minor that I could ignore them anyway. Of course, the last line in local and general events never occurred on rail. By then milk was almost all by road, and NE had closed in 1973 anyway!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Anotheran
Adding back images lost by site change

[Anotheran]

Then I have the timetables. Again, I've entered the relevant information from the published timetables into Excel and produced suitable charts to show movements.

 

Firstly 1906, for which I only have the passenger timetable. I'm sure I could insert the 1911 freight workings here without too many arguments!

 

 

Then I have the 1911 timetable, for which I've not done the chart yet!

 

 

Passengers only for 1930:

 

 

I have the passenger only for 1945. But it's not very interesting as it's pretty similar to 1930, but with one fewer train in each direction. So next of interest is 1949, for which I have passenger and freight:

 

 

Finally, a rather depressing, all movements, timetable for 1961 for which I don't think I'll bother with the chart:

 

 

It's not as many as a layout like Grantham or Peterborough North, or even the Dent or KL, but I'm going to quite enjoy getting these movements correct with the right stock for three or four of the eras I can portray.

 

I also still have the feeling that I'm going to defy Beeching and let the preservation society that was set up actually succeed in keeping the line open as a preserved line. That way I can run it in the modern era with modern cars in the carpark, lots of people with cameras, and everything from GWR steam to some blue diesels. All at the same time!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Anotheran
Adding back images lost by site change

[ChrisN]

Neil,

This sounds like a good idea although once you get into BR days the paintwork will change,(probably).

 

My layout is set  firmly in 1895, (probably 18/03/1895 or there abouts).  However, given that it has to be transportable I think most things will be removable.  I will have to see how this works and I hope it will still look believable.  This may also extend to the people and if I can do this so it works I may be able to run different eras.  Remember, it is the people in their clothes as well as the buildings and traffic that define an era.

[Anotheran]

Although I said that the last timetable in my earlier post was depressing, it does allow me to replicate the scene in the picture in this link (I can't post here because of copyright) which I found through the dissused stations site.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/richard_davies_collection/6486900295/

 

I've already bought the 37 🤫 ... which will be suitably renumbered, correct headcode applied and then weathered... once I have some track to put it on!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Anotheran

[Anotheran]

Hi Chris,

 

This sounds like a good idea although once you get into BR days the paintwork will change,(probably).

I thought that too. But it was when looking at the disused stations site (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/n/newcastle_emlyn/index.shtml) and seeing distinctly GWR looking colours on the station building in 1964 that I realised I could get a long time window. Even the running in board remained the same until the station was closed to passengers!

 

Remember, it is the people in their clothes as well as the buildings and traffic that define an era.

I totally agree, and I've been watching your great work on the people for Traeth Mawr. They will, probably even more than the buildings, define your era.

 

On NE even with the buildings the same, or close enough, in colour, I will need to change people, traffic, posters and a few bits and pieces lying around. But I can certainly get away with the station from opening through to passenger closure with that. That was a big thing that attracted me to the station once I'd seen it on the dissused stations site.

[ChrisN]

Neil,

That is the advantage of the GWR, as it stayed fairly static in terms of colours for a long period.  Of course with re-enactment days people could be wearing anything!

[Jaz]

For anyone that is interested I have done some research into the history of the station so that I can look at what I can run when. Here's my summary in my favourite application... Excel

 

Station history.png

 

The different colours of years are effectively blocks during which there was no change at all to the appearance of the station. Some of those boundaries I can ignore with modellers licence and others are so minor that I could ignore them anyway. Of course, the last line in local and general events never occurred on rail. By then milk was almost all by road, and NE had closed in 1973 anyway!

I too love Excel, the right hand click notes....the working out with and without VAT, for what you paid for you railway stuff

Searching lists to see what you have and what you need. Excel is just the dogs foo dahs. If anyone needs a VAT equation just ask.

Listing on tabs your Hornby you Bachmann etc etc all separate but one simple click way.

[Jaz]

The data you have added here, is the life and soul of the layout, Kal loves the electronics, getting the tracks working spot on, I love the scenery.....But Kal undertakes how the schedules for the trains and locos work. And we discuss the era so the likely locos so there is some element of realism. 

At some point we need to check out 

Goathland....

Sheffield Park....when we finally get it done

Kalboro,,,,reference via Peterborough which is it's basis....although the station is not recognisable as such, it was the track plan that got Kal excited.

 

As ChrisN says, if you have a station that remained structurally the same, plus had the same colours OR returned to the same colours, for whatever reason nostalgia, preservation, coincidence, it gives the the chance to dress the layout fairly accurately in more than one time period, which means you get more for your money....   more than one layout, and when you are bored....you can swop.

[Anotheran]

The data you have added here, is the life and soul of the layout, Kal loves the electronics, getting the tracks working spot on, I love the scenery.....But Kal undertakes how the schedules for the trains and locos work. And we discuss the era so the likely locos so there is some element of realism.

That's very much how I'm thinking. It's to get as much fun as possible in all the fields I'm interested in... scenic modelling, painting, electronics, other technical bits and pieces, and historical maps, tables and data! On top of that I get to do a bit of woodwork and then play trains!

[Anotheran]

...which means you get more for your money...

Except then I do things like go out and buy a class 37 when everything else I had was built before 1935! So I get more for my money, but then spend more money using it!

  

Edited August 13, 2014 by Anotheran

[Sasquatch]

Neil. Congratulations on such an informative in depth thread.
The idea of pursuing preservation in model form on NE is great. One of my favorite layouts on here is BrightonEast. Kipford has done a great job of reproducing a layout based on Kemptown, a line which closed some 40 odd years ago.

Cars and people can be easily swapped out to change period. Most of the populous on my layouts have Hob-E-Tac glue on the soles of their feet!

 

Regards Shaun.

[Anotheran]

Thanks Shaun. It was the idea of being able to run stuff that would never have been seen on the line in real life, and a mix of things at that, that made me think of the make believe preservation. It so nearly happened in real life but the campaign failed as the price of the track rose day on day in 1972 due to the national steel shortage putting the line out of financial reach for the fledgling society, which also failed to attract much local support. But I can change all that!

 

I'll take a look at Brighton East (at last someone recommending a thread that isn't 50 pages long!)

 

I like the idea of hob-e-tac on the feet of the population. I'll use that one! There are a few minor changes to the buildings around as well that I could probably use a similar approach to. I'm not going to have trees growing over the years though! There are enough of them en-masse along the river which would have been growing and dying that I will assume that the average height of the woodland was fairly constant over the years.

[Anotheran]

One of my main intentions for NE is to replicate as many of the photographs I find as I can. That will give me a sense of satisfaction in a couple of ways. First is that it will keep me on the straight and narrow as far as placement of station buildings and so on goes together with making sure I'm running things that are close to prototypical. Second, it will give me opportunities to do some modelling beyond what I would normally consider doing.

With that in mid I have just purchased the Bachmann L&YR 2-4-2T in LMS livery. Please ignore the track. I use the settrack to run the locos in, so it was lying around and got used for the photo.



But it won't stay that way. My intention here is to replicate the first locomotive picture on disused stations NE page (Hence the pose I chose for the photo). I can't reproduce it here because of copyright, but take a look, I think it's nice! The photo, taken in 1911, show the Sharp Stewart built Cader Idris, sporting it's new GWR number 1306 (it had fairly recently been acquired from the Manchester & Milford Railway when that company was taken over. It's a 2-4-2T and looks very similar to the L&YR loco. As I only have one photo at the moment I'll be guessing certain things, but I can see that I need to change the face, the funnel and put a cover over the valves on the top of the boiler (you can see I really know what I'm talking about here!) as well as remove LMS and number and put on a name plate and new number plate.

 

One thing I have no idea on is the colour. It's a black and whit photo (of course) and for all I know it could be green, red or black (or any number of other colours). If anyone has any information on Cader Idris then I'd love to know. But initially I will be going for black (as the model currently is) and reproducing the photo in black and white!

 

Having said that, it won't be an immediate thing. I'm only posting now as I've just bought the loco as I didn't want to see them disappearing from my favourite local store and having to resort to eBay!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Anotheran
Adding back images lost by site change

[ChrisN]

Neil,

I like it.  As someone who models and era and a company that there are no RTR locos for and very few kits of stock I will have to convert what RTR stuff there is,that is unless I get time to learn how to solder and build brass kits.  Ah, there are no brass kits of Cambrian loco.  As I was saying, I like the idea of converting RTR locos.

 

Andy G has a loco bodging thread.  He has contributed to KL and Lunster and has links on his signature. There are others on the forum as well who do it as well, so there is plenty of knowledge and inspiration out there.

[Anotheran]

Chris,

Thanks for the pointer (it's becoming a habit me saying that!) I'll look up Andy G's bodging thread, and probably lots more, before I let myself loose on the model. I have to say that your thread has inspired me to make sure I can represent that very early era of the Newcastle Emlyn branch. Later eras will undoubtedly be easier, but nowhere near as elegant!

Edited August 17, 2014 by Anotheran

[Anotheran]

## Edit to say this should have been in my DE thread, not here. But as it's already been replied to I'll leave it here as well as cross posting it to DE ##

 

So, having made a start on the warehouse I had to do something while the glue was drying.

 

 

The pieces for the baseboard, cut on the driveway while the sun was shining as the garage is still full of boxes! This is just the pieces for one of the 4 x 1 boards... I cut the pieces for both. A little PVA, pilot holes, countersink holes and some manual screwdriver work (why I didn't use the power tool for that I have no idea!) and here we are, number one of two. I'm very pleased with my first proper baseboard, even if it is only 4 x 1!

 

 

Number two can wait until tomorrow as the glue is dry on the jigsaw that will be the top two floors of the warehouse front wall, so I'm going to have a pizza and then get back to that!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Anotheran
Adding back images lost by site change

[ChrisN]

Neil,

First baseboard, well done and it looks good.  Erm, is that your kitchen floor with nothing on it to protect it?  I shall look away now. 

 

Thanks for the previous comment.  The reason I want to model the late Victorian era is that the locomotives looked wonderful, everything was kept clean, (see discussion in the Pre-Grouping thread), and railways were king.  They carried everything and people as well.  They were at their height.

 

I looked to model maybe ten years later but any RTR stuff, like the Prairies, would still need to be backdated and all the other stock would have to be built.  So far I have only managed to half convert a coach to give a representation of a coach the picture of which shows it in a highly dilapidated condition maybe at least 50 years later, and paint a few figures.  If that has inspired you then I am pleased. 

[Anotheran]

Hmmm. Just realised that I've posted the building of the baseboard for Doxey End in this thread... so I'll copy it across and say no more about it here!