Brinkly Works! Weathering and self-designed 3D printed models

[Brinkly]

New Beginning

 

Greetings and welcome to my workbench thread. I thought that I would share the journey of building P4 stock, documenting my ‘bodge it and scarper’ approach in places!

 

Most of the stock featured on the thread will be for my own Horrabridge layout and the Devon Riviera Area Group’s (DRAG) Bodmin General Project. My chosen period for Horrabridge is circa 1955 with a year either side of that date; Bodmin General is set slightly later, circa 1960, with 2-4 years either side of the main period.

 

At the moment most of the stock is being built for Horrabridge, although it is perfectly suitable for Bodmin.

 

Prototype – Freight Traffic

 

The Launceston branch was reasonably busy right up to closure in December 1962. The line served a mostly rural community, although the two principle stations on the branch, Tavistock and Launceston, both had typical industry seen in a town. Livestock was particularly important, along with domestic coal and other general commodities. Traffic from the small quarry outside of Tavistock also provided traffic, this product being used for tarmac. Milk traffic was also a feature of the branch, coming from the Ambrosia Creamery at Lifton, the penultimate station on the line.

 

The branch saw three daily return freight workings. The early morning 5:00am goods was primarily for Tavistock, although it did convey some wagons for Launceston, the second 8:40am service was solely for Horrabridge – traffic for the Princetown branch was also carried on this train and lastly the 11am service, which was an all station pick-up service, collecting any wagons from Tavistock just after lunch, arriving at Launceston mid-afternoon.

 

Livestock traffic was particularly important to the local economy of both Tavistock and Launceston; both towns having large cattle markets. Tavistock market was also used for quarterly grading. (Grading of cattle was and still is where livestock are sorted into grades to give an agreed class, which then helps to determine the price.)  In a nutshell grading days were particularly busy, along with the day before and after the market. Dedicated livestock trains ran ‘when required’ to Tavistock, with cattle wagons being stored at Horrabridge on the run up to the market. Daily freight trains would also convey cattle wagons. One market in the mid-1950s was so busy that loaded wagons had to be brought to Horrabridge to get them out of the way, as all of the siding space at Tavistock and the quarry was full!

 

From a modelling point of view, I find this very interesting and the first wagons to feature on my thread will be for this traffic.

 

Model Standards

 

I have built a number of P4 wagons over the last few years and have generally standardised my methods. Unless it is an RTR conversion I used sprung w-irons and coupling hooks from Masokits, sprung buffers (if possible), a similar weight 55-60 grams and either Ultrascale or Exactoscale wheels – my preference is for Ultrascale, but the price might alter that view!

 

Some wagons will be fitted with an Alex Jackson coupling, the idea being that wagons will be set up in cuts of 2, 3 and 4 wagons, with the wagon at either end of the rake being fitted with a AJ at one end and a 3/screw link on the other, with the remaining wagons in the cut just having a 3-link or screw links. There will also be a number of wagons running with an AJ at both ends. I really like proper links, but hate operating layouts with them!

 

Where possible I like to model an actual vehicle and usually seek out photographs at shows, but also have a good selection of modelling and prototype books. Geoff Kent’s The 4mm Wagon Series (Books 1-3) are really useful, as is John Hayes’ 4mm Coal Wagon and the many articles he has written for MRJ over the years. My own standards really draw elements from both modellers, although my underframe fixtures and fittings does tend to lean towards Mr Hayes’ practice.

 

Ex LMS Diag. 1661 - M 69453

 

First up is an ex LMS wagon. I have a lovely shot of 5 of these wagons (or variants of) at Tavistock South during my chosen period, the rest of the train being hidden behind the goods shed!

 

Diag. 1661 was built over a number of years in the 1920s to a number of different diagrams – nothing is ever easy! My model is numbered M69453 photographed in 1959. (Picture is from Geoff Kent’s second book.) The wagon is ‘through-piped’ a term that I hadn’t come across before, but I presume this means the wagon can run as part of a fitted train, as it is painted in BR bauxite livery? (I’m sure someone will be able to clear this up!)

 

It was a fairly simple wagon to build, the basic kit is from David Geen’s white metal rage, although I have replaced the buffers and vacuum pipe with items from the LMS range, which are much finer than the items David Geen provides and fitted Masokits sprung w-irons. MJT RCH axle boxes will complete the replaced components.  

 

M69453 isn’t completely finished the roof, metal side strapping and axle boxes need to be fitted, along with a coupling – this wagon will be fitted with a Masokits screw link coupling at either end as it will be part of a rake of 4 other cattle wagons.

 

It took around 6 hours to build and runs very smoothly. It comes in at 75 grams, which is something I will have to bear in mind with other wagons, but I don’t think it will misbehave.

 

It is a fairly new kit, being released about 12 years ago. The castings are very clean and it required very little cleaning up. Unfortunately I didn’t document the first part of the build, but the ex SR 1529 has been constructed in an identical way.

 

Ex SR Diag. 1529 – S53780

 

Next is another David Geen whitemetal kit, the Southern Railway’s D1529 No. S53780. Four variations of this design were built between the early 1930s to 1949. 53780 is one of the earlier Maunsell builds. Again the photograph has come from Geoff Kent’s second book.

 

The instructions for this kit are quite poor! David admits in the instructions that, ‘We must apologise that we can only generalise about the construction of this kit as we don’t as yet have one to build ourselves.’ Although it is quite simple really!

 

Below is the first part showing the early stages of construction.

 

First of all this is what you get. I purchased two kits!

The sides and ends, with the internal divider and a floor piece in the centre - photo 7 shows its use.

The Coffman clamp is really useful - you can purchase them from the States or Finney and Smith.

Coffman in use, doesn't half make life easier!

Make sure that the sides are a tight fit. I had to re-adjust the parts after the photo was taken.

All soldered up using Carr's 70 Low metal soldier and Carr's Red Flux

Ends ready for LMS buffers and vacuum pipe.

First part of the underframe - you can see the cast floor piece from earlier. I've also soldered a 10thou nickel silver floor to the underframe to help fit the sprung w-irons. The nickel silver floor isn't going anywhere!

 

This finishes the first installment, more later. Whitemetal soldering is very easy, the SR cattle van will be the third kit that I have built. The iron was set to 200 degrees and the flux was applied with a pin.

 

Hope this is of use or interest to someone! Thanks for reading - moor soon.

 

Regards,

 

Nick.

Edited October 27, 2021 by Brinkly
New title.

[Sidecar Racer]

Saw that title and thought , blimey , thats novel .    

 

 Seriously though Nick , good to see you making some progress , I will be watching

this grow .

[Brinkly]

Saw that title and thought , blimey , thats novel .    

 

Thought the title might raise a smile!

[10800]

Nice one Nick, I'll look forward to following this!

[Brinkly]

Nice one Nick, I'll look forward to following this!

 

Thanks Rod. I thought I would fly the flag for all things P4!

[Nelson Jackson]

Great start to your workbench, looking forward to seeing them finished, is it possible to construct whitemetal kits using superglue instead of solder?

[chrisf]

It's good to see that someone else has one of those right angle clamp type jigs.  Mine was feeling quite lonely!

 

Chris

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...white metal rage...

Hello old friend, haven't seen you around since trying to build some K's possibly dia 100 21T hoppers in the 1960s.

 

I am sure the P4 graded cattle will be a tour de force.

[Brinkly]

A piped wagon has a through vacuum pipe, but is not fitted with a vacuum cylinder which operates the brakes. It made life easier when forming up a fitted head as a piped wagon could go anywhere in the rake of fitted wagons. Less shunting would be involved. As for livery, a good question I do not know the answer to. You may get a definitive answer if you posted a question in the UK prototype forum.

 

White metal, hmmm not my favourite material but I have built a few wagons from kits with it.

 

Do you think that clamp would work for 7mm scale?

 

Anyway, good work Nick. I like your historical research section.

 

Thanks Paul,

 

I presumed through-piped was just that. The wagon in question is in BR bauxite livery, so I will just replicate that. The advantage of a photo is you capture that particular wagon. I was amazed when I started looking at GWR wagons in BR days how many little changes they went through. LNER axle boxes being one that leaps to mind!

 

With regard to the Coffman, good question. I'm not sure. It isn't very big, although you could clamp up to about 1cm in thickness. I bought mine as I've got a growing pile of white metal kits (about 20 last count). The Coffman does make life easier, although you could use set squares and an 'L' shaped surface?

 

Kind regards,

 

Nick.

[Siberian Snooper]

Do you think that clamp would work for 7mm scale?

 

The clamps come in several different sizes, I think the longest is around 4 inches long. I have several pairs of different sizes. Not only useful for wagon building but also any structure that needs to be square. You can solder inside or out or glue. A very useful and versatile bit of kit, I got mine from Finney and Smith.

 

SS.

[Brinkly]

I think that the one I have Paul is the biggest. A friend has this model and a smaller one, but so far we have both found that the larger clamp is the best.

 

Regards,

 

Nick.

[nzgresleyfan]

Great start to your workbench, looking forward to seeing them finished, is it possible to construct whitemetal kits using superglue instead of solder?

'scuse me for butting in and answering a question on someone else's thread but as I looked through and didn't see an answer, I thought I'd stick my nose in!

 

Yes, it is possible to use superglue, or other suitable adhesive, but I'd really recommend trying the soldering option.  Not only is it a lot more permanent but it's also much more time-efficient, as you don't need to wait for the glue to set before moving on to the next stage.

 

Have a look on here for advice, (I've seen lots of discussion on soldering kits in the past) or have a chat with someone at a show or your local club.  I did this after building my first kit with glue (Harrow Models chassis for the Dapol railbus).  One of the chaps in the club I belonged to hosted us at his home one day and let those of us who were interested loose on a spare kit that he had on his workbench.  I was hooked and have soldered ever since! 

[Captain Kernow]

 

The iron was set to 200 degrees and the flux was applied with a pin.

 

 

I was never persuaded by those clamps, prefering to use little bits of wood and to burn my fingers on a regular basis, but you've made a very good job of that soldering, Nick.

 

I think it pertinent to point out, however, for those who may not have contemplated using a mains iron to solder whitemetal, that a 200 degree setting is more than capable of melting your castings, which is why whitemetal solder (from Carrs, certainly) is billed as '70 degrees''.

 

However, I only ever use a mains iron for this purpose myself, and at a broadly similar setting. As Nick has no doubt realised, the trick is to keep the heat on the assembly just long enough for the solder to flow and do its work, but as soon as that happens, you need to take the iron away!

 

To that end, I'd prefer the 'burnt finger' approach to keeping parts together until the solder has set, as with whitemetal soldering, you do get a definite sense of where and when the heat is going...

[brianusa]

Checking on the progress at Horrabridge.  Agree with the Cap'n having burned just about every finger at one time or another and melted a lot of castings!  While not building anything as critical and intricate as a OO model, I now use super glue or Duco cement which just about fixes anything.

 

Brian.

[Brinkly]

Thanks for your posts gents. Only just had chance to catch up, mega busy at present.

 

Hopefully there will be an update over the weekend, but it will depend how much work I get done between now and Friday. So I'm off to be a good church mouse and get on with my home work!

 

Regards,

 

Nick.

[davidbr]

I was never persuaded by those clamps, prefering to use little bits of wood and to burn my fingers on a regular basis, but you've made a very good job of that soldering, Nick.

 

I think it pertinent to point out, however, for those who may not have contemplated using a mains iron to solder whitemetal, that a 200 degree setting is more than capable of melting your castings, which is why whitemetal solder (from Carrs, certainly) is billed as '70 degrees''.

 

However, I only ever use a mains iron for this purpose myself, and at a broadly similar setting. As Nick has no doubt realised, the trick is to keep the heat on the assembly just long enough for the solder to flow and do its work, but as soon as that happens, you need to take the iron away!

 

To that end, I'd prefer the 'burnt finger' approach to keeping parts together until the solder has set, as with whitemetal soldering, you do get a definite sense of where and when the heat is going...

 

I disagree with the Captain.

 

Firstly, holding pieces firmly in the right position is important.  The Coffman / Right Angle holds well, allows you to make small adjustments before committing yourself and gives access to the joint from both sides.  You don't need to burn your fingers unless you are a masochist - all too often the heat makes you shift your fingers, however involuntarliy, and with them the joint.  If you use other clamps, remember that if they are metallic, they will absorb heat and take it away from the area you want to solder which will mean that you must put in even more heat and, with white metal, this may not be desirable.  If you can pad the surface with a bit of foam or cloth, this reduces the heat transfer; the Right Angle clamp has heat resistant pads.

 

Secondly, a general rule of thumb for setting the temperature of your soldering iron is to double the melting point and add about 30^o which makes 170^o for low melt. This works well with small parts where there is less metal to heat up and you do not need to leave the iron on the piece as, with the metal taking the heat, the solder will flash in to the joint.  However, where you have larger quantities of metal, you need more heat to get the joint hot enough to accept the solder.  A large bit is not always a practical way of doing this so an alternative is to increase the temperature a little.  200^o works well in this situation - I have done it many, many times.  The white metal is in no danger of melting unless you leave the iron on it for too long and by this I mean literally leaving it there, in one place, for half a minute or more, something one does not do when soldering.  The idea is to get in and straight out.  

 

If having your iron at 200^o frightens you, try soldering scrap white metal starting at a lower temperature and working up.  Remember that larger pieces of metal need more heat to warm them up and take the solder.  Practise on scrap, experiment and find out for yourself but don't dive straight in on your kit if you have doubts.  I assure you that setting your iron at 200^o (no more and perhaps slightly less) is not a problem unless you leave your iron in the joint for any length of time.  Talk to demonstrators at shows and more experienced modellers and they will all tell you that ideally your iron goes straight in and out again in the shortest time to get the job done.  If you have to leave the iron in for any length of time, you are not doing the job right.

 

The David Geen and ABS kits Nick is making have mitred corners which are not accurately 45^o and leave a gap on the inside.  Hand holding such a joint is not easy and the clamp in this situation is more sensible and helpful.  If you then drag out some low melt solder on your bench, cut a bit off and flatten it in pliers, you can cut bits and place them in to the joint.  With a small to middling bit on your iron and a small amount of solder on it - ready melted solder helps the 'cold' piece in the joint to melt more quickly - you can get the iron in to the joint from the back and out again with absolutely no danger to the casting at all.  Capillary action takes the molten solder to the outside of the corner joint for a very neat finish.  Once cooled a bit, add some more solder to the inside and run the iron fairly quickly up and down the inside of the joint.  Because the large amount of white metal will absorb the heat, you will find that you only melt the surface of the soldered joint which will smooth over and leave a neat finish inside the joint that needs little or no cleaning up.

 

All this time, the work has been held firmly and comfortably by the clamp.  I use Carr's yellow label flux and apply a drop right in to the joint with a hypodermic which is cleaner and more accurate than a brush.

 

David

Edited September 13, 2014 by davidbr

[buffalo]

Effective clamps need not be so complex or costly. See here for one that works equally well with plastic, brass or white metal corners.

 

Nick

[Brinkly]

Ex GWR Box Vans & Masokits Sprung W-Irons

 

Greetings everyone,

 

I thought that it was about time for an update. I've promised myself to build 6 wagons a month and currently I am on track to hit that goal. One reason is to encourage me not to sit in front of the TV when I get home from work, the other is to ensure that Horrabridge and Bodmin actually have some rolling stock, when the time comes for testing and running!

 

I was planning to complete the two ex Southern Railway cattle vans today, but I couldn't find my low-metal solder. As it turns out, I'd put it away in the wrong box, but having looked for it, for well over an hour, I gave up and decided to move onto other outstanding projects. Then whilst looking in said box for a packet of buffers, there it is, looking up at me! Not a happy bunny.

 

Anyway I've had a number of request asking how to put together the Masokits sprung W-Irons. The 4mm Coal Wagon by John Hayes had a good explanation, but bar him, I haven't really seen this system in use. It really does surprise me, as I've had total success with the system, with high-speed wagon tests over three cross-overs on TT2, with no derailments and most importantly the wagons have been shunted without buffer heads and by hand! They seem to stubbornly stay on the track, so I really do recommend this system if you haven't tried it, because it really does produce great running.

 

First photo shows what you get. Two sets of etches in bags. One steel - springs and carriers and the other the etch itself. You get a flat bar, which has the wheel base etched straight through, which doesn't half make getting the correct wheel spacing easier. (A small piece of brass rod is included to help aid the wheel base setting.) A small etch with four washers can also be seen to the left.

 

All soldered up. Takes about 20 minutes.

 

Next up the 3ft springs with washers and wasted bearings are soldered in. The trick is not to get any solder on the front of the etch. You also have to file the bearing down slightly using a small jig provided with the etch, although I didn't photograph this.

 

Springs separated from the etch - bend the 'spring' over and then add a blob of solder.

 

All made up and read to go - you can see the filing on the bearing.

 

And that's it. Nothing too difficult. Slow and steady is the best advice. Give it a quick test on the bench to ensure it is straight - this one is probably the best I've made yet as it seems to be almost perfect. I gave it a quick push along the bench and it stayed nice and straight, didn't curve off at all - very happy Nick!

 

Below are a couple of ex GWR box vans nearing completion, all four use this system. All will eventually have etched brake parts - a mix of Masokits, Bill Bedford and Craig W. Nothing like standardisation!

 

Two Ratio kits built 5 or so years ago. Painted with Humbrol enamels - nearly done - tweaking of the height will be completed once the springs and axle boxes are fitted. 

 

Three Ratio and a Bachmann RTR body on a scratch built chassis. All run beautifully smoothly on TT2 when shunted over the three cross-overs.

 

Right that is all for now. I'm off for a Kopparberg!

 

Kind regards,

Nick

[DougN]

Nick, I would suggest changing any bearings where filing has gone too far as the friction increases. You need to leave the cone inside the bearing un touched. I didn't worry about it until I found the wagons didn't roll well and covered the issue on the scale4 forum. With one russ Elliot. So I have now mended my ways ...... And always buy extra bearings! BTW I like the wagon thread!

[Brinkly]

Nick, I would suggest changing any bearings where filing has gone too far as the friction increases. You need to leave the cone inside the bearing un touched. I didn't worry about it until I found the wagons didn't roll well and covered the issue on the scale4 forum. With one russ Elliot. So I have now mended my ways ...... And always buy extra bearings! BTW I like the wagon thread!

 

Hi Doug,

 

Thanks for your advice. I haven't discovered that problem, but it is worth bearing (pun intended!) in mind!     I did use Alan Gibson wheels on a couple of earlier wagons and have to say I wasn't impressed, but I think I had a bad batch of wheels. Presently some of these wagons really are too free-running, which will make shunting on the gradient even more exciting!

 

Kind regards,

 

Nick.

[Brinkly]

 Hi everyone,

 

It has been a couple of weeks since the last update. Most of my modelling has focused around getting projects to a state of completion, before starting anything else!

 

Last night I attended DRAG (Devon Riviera Area Group) and took full advantage of TT2! Below are a couple of videos. 

 

This is the first 'official' Bodmin General train. 4569, a Bachmann model, converted to P4 by myself using Ultrascale wheels, is coupled to Brian's (Taz) Comet B-Set (you will have to ask him which diagram they are). Bit of jerky running from 4569 as it was only picking up from one axle! Although Brian's B-Set ran very smoothly, even at HS2 speeds!

 

 

 

The next video shows my Bachmann Warship, converted to P4 using Gibson wheels, hauling a van train, some of which are featured on the thread.

 

 

Most of box vans are sprung using the Masokits system, although the four LNER vans towards the end of the train are Bachmann wagons converted using Ultrascale wheels and pinpoint axles. Some still need a quite a bit of work, ranging from underframes to painting, but I've been experimenting with Gibson wheels and I have to say all of them behaved really well all night. The train went over the B7 and A5 crossover without issue, which was particularly satisfying, although stupidly I didn't film that - something for another day. Some of the wagons also need 'tweaking' as they are not quite running at the right height, but having said that they did perform really smoothly, so I must have got something right!

 

The Warship (Bachmann model) had a slight problem early on in the evening. One of the wheels had shifted on the axle and was completely over-gauge! I converted this loco back in 2008, it was the first one I did and I didn't glue the wheels to the axle, so really it has done very well (over the years it must have run for hours on TT2). Long term it will receive a heavy overhaul, where she will be repainted into BR green (currently BR blue), sprung bogies will be fitted and a new motor, as this one is on the way out.

 

I purchased her in 2007 from a local shop as a 'non-runner' for £10, when I got her home it turned out the screws had been tighten up too much on the fly-wheels, resulting in the poor running, quick bit of tweaking and she was fine. I replaced the pick-ups, but now they have had it!

 

Anyway more soon. Once again thanks for looking.

 

Kind regards,

Nick.

[Brinkly]

Sunday 9th November - Mogo Covered Van

 

Greetings everyone,

 

I thought it would update my thread sharing my current work. In my last post I included a clip of a Warship loco hauling a van train. Keen observers would have noted that a lot of the wagons didn't have brakes! And over the weekend all have now bee fitted!

 

Anyway back to more practical matters.

 

I started this wagon about 4 years ago! Its the dear old Ratio ex GWR Mogo van. Having had a couple of spare hours this afternoon I decided to finish her off. (The four sides of the body had already been assembled.)

 

First job was to fit the floor, 20 (or so) grams of lead flashing and the internal partition.  

 

 

I have found that on a couple of wagons, the sides have started to 'bow-in', so from now on the fitting of partitions will be standard procedure! The floor and internal partition are both made from 40thou styrene.

 

Above shows the fitting of Lanarkshire buffers. I follow John Hayes' practice of drilling the buffers out to 1mm and using a slither of wire insulating plastic to retain the buffers - more on that another day. The 1mm bar aids the fitting of the buffers. I've used a RCH sprung w-iron from the Masokits range and Ultrascale wheels - I do have quite a stack of spoked wheels to use up.

 

 

Photos 4 & 5 show the van nearing completion. Just coupling hook, buffers, axle boxes and tie-bars to do. Plastic brake gear has been employed and has significantly sped up construction. From now etched brake gear will only be fitted to show case stock, simply as Bodmin is going to need quite a whack of stock and we haven't got a huge amount of time!

 

Anyway hopefully a bit more to follow later on in the week, or next weekend. Any questions, tips or advice please feel free to comment.

 

Kind regards,

 

Nick.

Edited November 9, 2014 by Brinkly

[Worsdell forever]

...In my last post I included a clip of a Warship loco hauling a van train. Keen observers would have noted that a lot of the wagons didn't have brakes! And over the weekend all have now bee fitted!

 

 

The ones without roofs and paint distracted me from the missing brakes... 

 

Nice work.

[Brinkly]

The ones without roofs and paint distracted me from the missing brakes... 

 

Nice work.

 

Hehe

 

Thanks Paul. The reason what to check the Gibson wheels really, working on the theory that it is easier to 'tweak' without all the brake gear in the way. The next big job for a lot of my stock will be painting, although that job will probably wait until the spring.

 

Kind regards,

 

Nick.

[ullypug]

Nice work. I've not used the masokits sprung system. How much do they work out at?

I like the buffer fitting guide using 1mm brass!

Look forward to seeing it finished.