Modelling 1960s & 1970s Diesels & Electrics

[Strathwood]

Cannot seem to find a central point on RM Web for anyone modelling 1960s and or early 1970s era diesels & electrics, whether this be via a diesel depot/stabling point (pre TMD era I am afraid) or any other form of layout such as Phil Bullock's lovely Abbotswood Junction (whilst very nice would be too large for the space I have available, so it would need to be a stabling point for me),

 

I am sitting at the cusp of whether to pursue futher modelling along this theme or to allow other interests to take control for me personally, such as Southern Region 1950s/1960s or Scottish Region 1950s/1960s in an end to end form.

 

Can anyone help with photos, ideas etc of their layouts or projects to finally sway me personally in the direction of modelling a stabling point circa 1967-1969 for myself please?

 

Just like so many other modellers I am sitting on approximately thirty locomotives across several genre, with 1960s era diesels in both 4mm and N gauge, the latter for another now stalled project. Also I have onboard already some 4mm Southern Region steam, but with Hornby's 700, 2-Bil and 2-Hal and Bachman's E4 posing great temptations for the future I feel myself being pulled in this direction too.

 

Whilst I do like the attractions of watching the trains go by within a limited space, hence the N gauge stock, I cannot come to terms with the aspects of detail being so easily seen by my soon to be fifty seven year old eyesight anymore, so these will just have to find new homes. So 4mm has the batton for me for the future, but what about modelling a stabling point that is not set in the late 1970s, 1980s or 1990s as so many modellers seem to be doing, instead what about one set in 1967-1969, when I was still an impressionable ten year old lad!

 

Surely this must be well trodden path, can anyone help with inspiration an examples of what they have done please?

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

Edited September 22, 2014 by Strathwood

[Rugd1022]

Hi Kevin, you are certainly not alone on that score! I've chopped and changed so many times over the years and it's the main reason why I've never managed to build a layout.

 

If it were me, I'd go for the 1967-69 era stabling point, as you're well aware the variations in livieries in almost any part of the country during that time are wide and often quite unusual. Despite books such as yours now covering the period (at long last), layouts from that time are rare indeed. Operationally it could be quite limited but visually it could well be rather special... the Hornby and Bachmann ready-to-plonk diesel depots are worth a look and can easily be modified to represent something more specific, according to region and area etc.

 

Go for it....

Edited September 22, 2014 by Rugd1022

[Strathwood]

Hi Kevin, you are certainly not alone on that score! I've chopped and changed so many times over the years and it's the main reason why I've never managed to build a layout.

 

If it were me, I'd go for the 1967-69 era stabling point, as you're well aware the variations in livieries in almost any part of the country during that time are wide and often quite unusual. Despite books such as yours now covering the period (at long last), layouts from that time are rare indeed. Operationally it could be quite limited but visually it could well be rather special... the Hornby and Bachmann ready-to-plonk diesel depots are worth a look and can easily be modified to represent something more specific, according to region and area etc.

 

Go for it....

Thanks for the vote, yes already have a Bachmann stabling point fueling shed in stock, lurking in the garage along with Heljan's Rapters. More replies welcome.

 

Kevin

[Rivercider]

I expect Clive Mortimore will be along when he sees this thread,

he has nicely captured the atmosphere I think you are after.

 

In the mean time search for his layout threads on here 'Pig Lane' and 'Hanging Hill'  

 

cheers

[Strathwood]

I expect Clive Mortimore will be along when he sees this thread,

he has nicely captured the atmosphere I think you are after.

 

In the mean time search for his layout threads on here 'Pig Lane' and 'Hanging Hill'  

 

cheers

Oh yes, to be honest I had forgotten about those two layouts.

 

Kevin

[Allegheny1600]

Hi Kevin,

Like you and so many others, I've chopped & changed in all manner of scales and eras and I definitely see what you're saying with regard to the SR stuff, very, very tempting indeed. But, for me perhaps being only slightly younger than yourself, the late 60's or pre-Tops era is certainly what I find to be the most interesting of all the British diesel periods!

There have been a few inspirational layouts from this period, "Sundown & Sprawling" comes to mind and there is I believe, a chap on here who used to scratch-build or kitbash all suitable Eastern region stock for this period, not to mention 'Chard's writings too!

Cheers,

John E.

[Guest 40-something]

Cannot seem to find a central point on RM Web for anyone modelling 1960s and or early 1970s era diesels & electrics, whether this be via a diesel depot/stabling point (pre TMD era I am afraid) or any other form of layout such as Phil Bullock's lovely Abbotswood Junction (whilst very nice would be too large for the space I have available, so it would need to be a stabling point for me),

 

I am sitting at the cusp of whether to pursue futher modelling along this theme or to allow other interests to take control for me personally, such as Southern Region 1950s/1960s or Scottish Region 1950s/1960s in an end to end form.

 

Can anyone help with photos, ideas etc of their layouts or projects to finally sway me personally in the direction of modelling a stabling point circa 1967-1969 for myself please?

 

Just like so many other modellers I am sitting on approximately thirty locomotives across several genre, with 1960s era diesels in both 4mm and N gauge, the latter for another now stalled project. Also I have onboard already some 4mm Southern Region steam, but with Hornby's 700, 2-Bil and 2-Hal and Bachman's E4 posing great temptations for the future I feel myself being pulled in this direction too.

 

Whilst I do like the attractions of watching the trains go by within a limited space, hence the N gauge stock, I cannot come to terms with the aspects of detail being so easily seen by my soon to be fifty seven year old eyesight anymore, so these will just have to find new homes. So 4mm has the batton for me for the future, but what about modelling a stabling point that is not set in the late 1970s, 1980s or 1990s as so many modellers seem to be doing, instead what about one set in 1967-1969, when I was still an impressionable ten year old lad!

 

Surely this must be well trodden path, can anyone help with inspiration an examples of what they have done please?

 

Thanks,

 

Kevin

Hi Kevin

 

Not a stabling point but my layout, Rockvilla Goods, is early 70's green & blue diesels, all the loco's based on actual photos...

 

Best regards

 

Joe

Edited September 28, 2014 by 40-something

[Baby Deltic]

All I can say is break from the mould if you want to do a TMD. The book 'Diesel Depots - The Early Years' is a good starting point from a research point of view. Many of the TMD layouts on the circuit are so far fetched from reality in terms of location, layout and operation it defies belief. 

[Strathwood]

All I can say is break from the mould if you want to do a TMD. The book 'Diesel Depots - The Early Years' is a good starting point from a research point of view. Many of the TMD layouts on the circuit are so far fetched from reality in terms of location, layout and operation it defies belief. 

Thanks, I know what you mean. I have already spent a long time doing the research on this subject having looked into this over a twenty year period from time to time.

 

What I do not want is a layout that looks like a shelf with some locos running in and out from under a bridge at right angles to the stabling point, nor do I want lots of dead straight track as too many stabling points in model form seem to enjoy. Instead I like the idea of gentle curves and subtle level changes, just like the real world.

 

Giving consideration to the idea of the best of both worlds perhaps and a chance to model two interests without being forced to make a hard choice, I have another cunning plan! With one layout "box frame" sat on top of another, the whole can then have a cloth cover thrown over it to keep the dust and little fingers out whilst not in action in my study. This feeds the chance to capture multiple interests, lates sixties diesels and Southern Region branchline one above the other, also I like the idea of watching the scene from an eye perspective around track level, rather than the bird's eye view. This allows me to site the lot above my bookcases, also makes maximum use of the space available and takes away the need to provide legs for the baseboards. Should they ever be exhibited, we can concoct an arrangement involving several trestle tables allowing me operate from the front, with extra stock, coffee, lunch etc lurking out of sight around the back.

 

So perhaps we are almost getting there, at last...But please everyone keep any ideas and suggestions flowing.

 

Kevin

[CloggyDog]

If you've only a small space with which to play, something like Tony Wood and Ian Manderson's lovely little fuelling point 'Villiers Street' might be worth a look.

 

Archived thread, about http://rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2443&start=50#wrap about half-way down.

 

a 4'6" x 2' triangle, viewed from the 2' flat end.

Edited September 29, 2014 by CloggyDeux

[Strathwood]

If you';ve only a small space with which to play, something like Tony Wood and Ian Manderson's lovely little fuelling poing 'Villiers Street' might be worth a look.

 

Archived thread, about http://rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2443&start=50#wrap anout half-way down.

 

a 4'6" x 2' triangle, viewed from the 2' flat end.

You see what I mean, more info always required. Whilst I have seen this layout on 70s EM I had not known about its trackplan, thoughts move on another notch. many thanks,

 

Kevin

[CloggyDog]

Kevin,

 

there's more info (including a proper trackplan) in issue 66 (Page 18 onwards) of the Ickenham & District SME's newsletter 'Ashpan'

 

http://www.idsme.co.uk/IDSME/Ashpan/Ashpan066.pdf

 

HTH

Edited September 29, 2014 by CloggyDeux

[Strathwood]

Kevin,

 

there's more info (including a proper trackplan) in issue 66 (Page 18 onwards) of the Ickenham & District SME's newsletter 'Ashpan'

 

http://www.idsme.co.uk/IDSME/Ashpan/Ashpan066.pdf

 

HTH

Thanks, lots of useful material in this one article alone.

 

Kevin

[jonny777]

I get a feeling that you do not really want just a stabling point model, possibly because there is not enough satisfaction moving locos on and off shed. That kind of layout may be ideal for some, but as I half went along that route some years ago, I can say that it was not for me as I needed more variety in operation.

 

However, if you have a number of SR steam locos already, but want to accommodate 2-Bils/Hals then the choice of location must be very limited.  I am getting out of my depth here, but might something on the old East London line south of the river be appropriate? The place I was thinking of was Old Kent Road Junction, although I am not sure how much of the spur to the ELR survived into the BR era, but you could "imagine" that it had done; and that occasional goods trains ran from the GE lines, mingling with the passenger trains to/from London Bridge / Victoria.

[Strathwood]

Current ideas suggest urban stabling point c1967-69 for one level and modest double track Southern Region secondary route with third rail Berkshire/Surrey/Hampshire borders on the layout built below it. Next thing to decide here is ex LSWR route or LBSCR route for the building's and signals styles. Either way passenger services will be in the hands of single two car HALs or BILs. Presumption is they were split from the mainline services at a nearby junction. Goods traffic being only the local pick up, as sector plate and turntable fiddle yard can only cope with Standard 4MT and four wagons and brake, although if running an early 1950s scene the pick up could be in the hands of a T9 although M7s, Q1s, 700, E4, N, C, 4MT varieties could all appear, as could light engine workings with even N15s, Nelsons, Schools or Bulleids. To try and accomodate a four car EMU rake would be a coach too far within the space available..

 

Whilst the stabling point scene will have goods/parcel facilities incorporated as I have a fondness for parcels stock and the variety still to be seen in the late 1960s, this allows for something else aside from bringing locos on and off shed all the time. The styles of architecture here will appear area neutral in order to run all regions locomotives on differing operating sessions. No Deltics next to Warships for example, but one week Eastern Region another Western Region etc. With locomotives sharing two identities as appropraite to their liveries c1967-69, ie D9003 Meld on one side and D9021 Arygll & Sutherland Highlander on the other, so that when the loco goes off scene is turned and re-appears later it looks like I have an even larger stud of locomotives than reality. Nothing new in this I know, but it will mean I will be offering single nameplates from time to time for sale to any others likeminded.

 

In both cases it means the usual limited running associated with modest end to end layouts. However with the advent of DCC sound it adds another dimension to what are otherwise just shunting movements. It was the idea of watching the trains go by that kept the N gauge ideas going for so long. However there is room along one garage wall for something in the future so, this idea may be back and the Western Region hydraulics placed into storage as per the protoypes pending decisions...

 

Kevin

[br2975]

Cannot seem to find a central point on RM Web for anyone modelling 1960s and or early 1970s era diesels & electrics, whether this be via a diesel depot/stabling point (pre TMD era I am afraid) or any other form of layout such as Phil Bullock's lovely Abbotswood Junction (whilst very nice would be too large for the space I have available, so it would need to be a stabling point for me),

 

The late 60s and early 70s are 'my era'.

.

The early 70s were when I was most actively 'spotting' (altho there was a resurgence of interest in the mid 80s the 'number taking' was more like making a record of services and stock).

.

I still have most (but not all) of my notebooks from 1971 onwards, and a goodly selection of Ian Allan Combined Volumes and Locoshed books from the mid 60s onwards.

.

Together with other material such as 1971-1972 WTT's for South Wales, Sectional Appendix, DMU and CWN documents I have been able to wallow in nostalgia.

.

Until about a year ago I had minimal space for a layout - and Rosamund St. was 'designed' (term used loosley) to fit the then available space of some 68" x 15".

.

Even though my brother ('naturol' of this parish)  had built a replica of Ranelagh Bridge loco yard in 4mm, and which I have operated at several shows - small depots and stabling points were/are not for me. 

.

Therefore "Rosamund Street" was to be a small goods yard, where shunting could take place based on what I had observed on my spotting jaunts around the country.

.

But, I wanted it to be reasonable authentic and the movements justified........... so, there are fitted vans and mineral wagons, almost to the exclusion of anything else - no ARMS, no giant Trestrols, not even the odd CovHop just the mundane, but that's what I saw.

.

The size of the layout allows the use of the Inglenook shunting puzzle, and most mainline locos up to a 'Peak' (no one called them by their TOPS classes in those days) and three SLU (standard length units) in the headshunt. 

.

Using a card system to decide how the five wagon train should be formed adds to the operational interest.

.

I doubt I would have gained as much fun shuffling a few locos around a stabling point - but each to their own (Rule No.1 applies - "it's your model railway")

.

All this is the groundwork for my magnum opus which will be located in the garden shed and form an  18'0" x 9'0" 4mm scale 1971-1972 semi-industrial / semi-rural South Wales based 'roundy-roundy' known as "Twll Cach" where freight workings will predominate, and the 'bug set' will break cover every hour and rattle past GFYE 'six-eighters' from Radyr, a 'Brush' will appear now and again on an Aberthaw bound MGR and pairs of 'Type 2s' will work thro' from East Usk..

.

Brian R

.

Edited September 30, 2014 by br2975

[Strathwood]

The late 60s and early 70s are 'my era'.

.

The early 70s were when I was most actively 'spotting' (altho there was a resurgence of interest in the mid 80s the 'number taking' was more like making a record of services and stock).

.

I still have most (but not all) of my notebooks from 1971 onwards, and a goodly selection of Ian Allan Combined Volumes and Locoshed books from the mid 60s onwards.

.

Together with other material such as 1971-1972 WTT's for South Wales, Sectional Appendix, DMU and CWN documents I have been able to wallow in nostalgia.

.

Until about a year ago I had minimal space for a layout - and Rosamund St. was 'designed' (term used loosley) to fit the then available space of some 68" x 15".

.

Even though my brother ('naturol' of this parish)  had built a replica of Ranelagh Bridge loco yard in 4mm, and which I have operated at several shows - small depots and stabling points were/are not for me. 

.

Therefore "Rosamund Street" was to be a small goods yard, where shunting could take place based on what I had observed on my spotting jaunts around the country.

.

But, I wanted it to be reasonable authentic and the movements justified........... so, there are fitted vans and mineral wagons, almost to the exclusion of anything else - no ARMS, no giant Trestrols, not even the odd CovHop just the mundane, but that's what I saw.

.

The size of the layout allows the use of the Inglenook shunting puzzle, and most mainline locos up to a 'Peak' (no one called them by their TOPS classes in those days) and three SLU (standard length units) in the headshunt. 

.

Using a card system to decide how the five wagon train should be formed adds to the operational interest.

.

I doubt I would have gained as much fun shuffling a few locos around a stabling point - but each to their own (Rule No.1 applies - "it's your model railway")

.

All this is the groundwork for my magnum opus which will be located in the garden shed and form an  18'0" x 9'0" 4mm scale 1971-1972 semi-industrial / semi-rural South Wales based 'roundy-roundy' known as "Twll Cach" where freight workings will predominate, and the 'bug set' will break cover every hour and rattle past GFYE 'six-eighters' from Radyr, a 'Brush' will appear now and again on an Aberthaw bound MGR and pairs of 'Type 2s' will work thro' from East Usk..

.

Brian R

.

Sorry Brian but your locoshed suggests you need to get across onto the ECML more often if you are going to bag a lot more pre-TOPS cops...

 

But well done on clearing your Westerns, I know a lot of fellow spotters on here wished they had too! Don't worry about travelling to Crewe and northwards to clear your Class 50s as they will be coming to you soon!

 

Kevin

[The Stationmaster]

I was amused to compare Brian's book with mine.  Big difference is that mine is the 1962/63 Combined Volume -

I was missing three 'Peaks' above D 166,

Missing 5 x D200s below D300 and 16 above D300.

No such thing numbered D400 or the like,

But D600, D800 and D1000 all underlined and names written in for most of the latter where they weren't printed,

Out of D1500 - D1549 only 24 underlined.

 

All our yesterdays

[br2975]

Sorry Brian but your locoshed suggests you need to get across onto the ECML more often if you are going to bag a lot more pre-TOPS cops...

 

But well done on clearing your Westerns, I know a lot of fellow spotters on here wished they had too! Don't worry about travelling to Crewe and northwards to clear your Class 50s as they will be coming to you soon!

 

Kevin

.

The ECML took a bashing later with trips to London, for 'the Cross' also one memorable coach trip which took in the delights of Botanic Gardens, Drapers scrap yard, Goole, Immingham, Frodingham, Scunthorpe, Donny, The Plant etc .

.

But, from South Wales, the ECML was always a bit remote........

.

But, to whet the appetite of those transition era spotters, here is another page from the same 1971 Locoshed, and part of a Cardiff - Bristol trip in 1972. We used the 16:20 SO ex-Cardiff and bent our knees to get a half fare (all of 40p return) and knew that by the time we reached Marsh Junction there would be no one else around.

.

Mike

.

I'm jealous !

.

73 & 181 were my last Peaks.

.

A Gateshead 47 was my last Brush (forgotten which one now !).

.

Never got to clear my Warships, 828 Magnificent eluded me for years - then, I booked to travel on a Cardiff-Swindon 'footex' and knew it was on 'the dump' - but was off its wheels and out of view ! - but did manage the Westerns, Hymeks and 'nine-fivers'

.

Went to Scotland 1988 on 'the last great bash' (OK weekend away with 'naturol') but wanted to get 37264, which had been a Stratford resident for many years and had eluded me. ..... failed, it was on Canton when we got back !

 

Brian R

[Strathwood]

Kevin

.

The ECML took a bashing later with trips to London, for 'the Cross' also one memorable coach trip which took in the delights of Botanic Gardens, Drapers scrap yard, Goole, Immingham, Frodingham, Scunthorpe, Donny, The Plant etc .

.

But, from South Wales, the ECML was always a bit remote........

.

But, to whet the appetite of those transition era spotters, here is another page from the same 1971 Locoshed, and part of a Cardiff - Bristol trip in 1972. We used the 16:20 SO ex-Cardiff and bent our knees to get a half fare (all of 40p return) and knew that by the time we reached Marsh Junction there would be no one else around.

.

Mike

.

I'm jealous !

.

73 & 181 were my last Peaks.

.

A Gateshead 47 was my last Brush (forgotten which one now !).

.

Never got to clear my Warships, 828 Magnificent eluded me for years - then, I booked to travel on a Cardiff-Swindon 'footex' and knew it was on 'the dump' - but was off its wheels and out of view ! - but did manage the Westerns, Hymeks and 'nine-fivers'

.

Went to Scotland 1988 on 'the last great bash' (OK weekend away with 'naturol') but wanted to get 37264, which had been a Stratford resident for many years and had eluded me. ..... failed, it was on Canton when we got back !

 

Brian R

Hmmmm D6964 from Stratford was as common as muck to us London boys as were the rest of Stratford's entire allocation. Not sure I saw D828 Magnificent too often either, our pests at 81A were Swift, Tenacious, Temeraire, and Royal Oak. Whilst almost every time I went to Clapham Junction, D817 Foxhound would appear at some point of the day on an Exeter service. As for my last Peak, she was D138 finally bagged at Derby Works. Don't recall my last Brush Four but think it was one from Immingham. But my last Crompton was D6582, last Hymek D7038 and my last Deltic was D9004 the latter eluded me for far too long somehow. Although I most likely saw it beforehand as a speed blur passing in the opposite direction whilst on the ECML going in the opposite direction. Then one happy half term it turned up at last at the Cross, to save my shame finally. Whilst common Westerns in London for me seemed to be Talisman, Trooper, Firebrand and Marquis but I don't recall my last one as they seemed so easy to clear back then as were the Warships. However for London lads trying to get all of your Claytons and Class 26s, that was a real challenge and a half, even though it seemed every weekend all the Claytons were stopped and in long lines at various locations, it was hard to find the ones you wanted, although in the end all you had to do was visit, Millerhill, Haymarket, Polmadie, Glasgow Works and Ardrossan over a weekend to bag all bar two of the survivors by Easter of 1972.

 

The missing pair were at Derby RTC I think by the way.

 

Indeed happy days.

 

Kevin

[HillsideDepot]

Kevin,

here is my interpretation of a stabling point -

Quickly snapped with flash, so not looking its best, is London Road Locomotive Sidings, or if you prefer part of London Liverpool Street moved 120 miles or so west to be a WR location. The layout is just 4 foot long, by a foot wide with a fiddle yard of 21 inches. Odd sizes perhaps, but it sits at the end of my office on top and between book cases, so the layout is built to fill the space.

 

Boring to operate, possibly, but I've done a couple of shows with it and it keeps me amused. The track plan at Liverpool Street was strange, with locos regularly parked on a point making a cross-over unusable, but so long as you have a vague plan in your head when operating (sort of "that 47 is here for a while, that 37 is just calling in") then you can keep things turning over, but a certain amount of shunting is needed to release locos form some spots.

 

For added interest the station pilot can shunt a couple of parcels van or perhaps a sleeping car portion into the platform, and the Heljan parcel DMU has become a popular visitor (if rather too far west for their actual area of operation).  

 

I really ought to get on with more detailing/weathering!

[Strathwood]

Kevin,

here is my interpretation of a stabling point -

DSC_0196.JPG

Quickly snapped with flash, so not looking its best, is London Road Locomotive Sidings, or if you prefer part of London Liverpool Street moved 120 miles or so west to be a WR location. The layout is just 4 foot long, by a foot wide with a fiddle yard of 21 inches. Odd sizes perhaps, but it sits at the end of my office on top and between book cases, so the layout is built to fill the space.

 

Boring to operate, possibly, but I've done a couple of shows with it and it keeps me amused. The track plan at Liverpool Street was strange, with locos regularly parked on a point making a cross-over unusable, but so long as you have a vague plan in your head when operating (sort of "that 47 is here for a while, that 37 is just calling in") then you can keep things turning over, but a certain amount of shunting is needed to release locos form some spots.

 

For added interest the station pilot can shunt a couple of parcels van or perhaps a sleeping car portion into the platform, and the Heljan parcel DMU has become a popular visitor (if rather too far west for their actual area of operation).  

 

I really ought to get on with more detailing/weathering!

I like it but where is D8234 lurking? She was a fixture here for a while as the resident pilot.

 

Kevin

[PjKing1]

Hi Kevin

 

Just came across your thread, I, liking yourself was planning a tmd based in the late 60's early 70's, this for me is the best era because of the liveries and all the change (although ten years before I was born!!) but having started one I decided I just didn't have the space to do it justice for what I wanted. That doesn't mean a smaller depot wouldn't look out of place or un-realistic.

 

I've decided to go for a small junction (based on a proper location) with a depot off stage. So I can still run all my locos but just with a bit more operation potential.

 

Hope that helps

 

Paul

[Strathwood]

Hi Kevin

 

Just came across your thread, I, liking yourself was planning a tmd based in the late 60's early 70's, this for me is the best era because of the liveries and all the change (although ten years before I was born!!) but having started one I decided I just didn't have the space to do it justice for what I wanted. That doesn't mean a smaller depot wouldn't look out of place or un-realistic.

 

I've decided to go for a small junction (based on a proper location) with a depot off stage. So I can still run all my locos but just with a bit more operation potential.

 

Hope that helps

 

Paul

Hello Paul, I thought your Garston Bridge was coming along well and I had noted your liking for the Merseyside diesel/electric scene c1970. What was it that changed your mind?

 

Kevin

[PjKing1]

Hi Kevin

 

Thanks for the comments it was just the size of it, although Edgelane Junction isn't much smaller it's not a main line so no need for large fiddle yards that a main line would need, also with it being smaller it's got more realistic modelling potential I think.

 

I must admit modelling a real location (albeit slightly altered) is far easier as I find as there's lots of photos and info at hand.

 

Cheers, Paul