Talyllyn Junction. The Station area has been started!

[Jintyman]

Talyllyn Junction
7mm scale,
Based 1960 – 69.

The Idea.

Talyllyn Junction West Station was a secluded junction station, typical of the likes of Dovey Junction in being a bit isolated. Set near the small Hamlet of Talyllyn, the station was full of character, having two platform faces, and a unique slip on the diamond in the double crossover at the east end of the platform.

I remember watching a video showing Talyllyn Junction in the very early 60's, with Panniers, 2251's, 84xxx's, 56xx's and Mickey Mouse locos with short 2,3 and 4 coach trains, of both Collett non corridor stock and BR Mk1's, as well as a Stanier period 3 comp!!! Talyllyn Junction closed in 1962, but my rendering will envisage that it remained open till at least the end of steam.

Here is a map showing the general formation of the area:




And here is a signalling diagram:





The Space Availabile.

I am lucky in having a 32' x 16' Garage, and also a 12' x 6' shed at the bottom of the garden. Within the garage I will be able to fit both my current Wrexbury Marsh OO layout, with the Station, Junction and the Merthyr end fiddle yard. I will require a temporary fiddle yard/traverser that will sit on the driveway when the weather is fine to facilitate the operations of trains up from Brecon. At the other end of the garage will be a hole in the wall that will take the railway in the Hereford direction, but down the edge of the garden and round to a fiddle yard/traverser in the shed. This will be a run of about 50' from the outside of the garage wall to the outside of the shed, incorporating a gentle 8' radius curve for the 90 degree turn.
The railway will not encroach onto the garden, but just be a part of it as a single track running through the, yet to be made, raised border.

Motive Power.
This is only an idea, it could be more, it could be less.

BR(W):

2 x 57xx class 0-6-0PT locos
1 x 4575 class 2-6-2T loco
1 x 56xx class 0-6-2T loco
1 x 2251 class 0-6-0 loco & tender

BR(M):

1 x 3F class 0-6-0T loco 'Jinty'
1 x 3F class 0-6-0 loco & tender
1 x 2MT Ivatt 2-6-0 loco & tender

BR(Std):

1 x 84xxx class 2-6-2T loco


BR(Diesel)

1 x Class 24 Bo-Bo loco
1 x Class 25/1 Bo-Bo loco
Possibly an early type DMU of the 60's

Coaching Stock.

Collett Dia D98 3rd B' Set Coaches
Collett Dia E131 Composite Coaches
Collet Dia C54 All 3rd Corr Coach
BR Mk1 BSK Coach
BR Mk1 CK Coach
BR Mk1 SK Coach

Non Passenger carrying stock:

Various items of non passenger carrying vehicles of BG, GUV, Syphons, etc will be used
There will be some freight traffic, although Talyllyn West didn't deal with much at all. Most freight would be passing through.

Infrastructure:

Talyllyn Junction will have hand built track throughout, using wooden sleepers, plastic chairs and nickel silver rail from C&L, and it will be built to O-MF standards.

There is the opportunity to imagine that Talyllyn stayed open into the 1980's, which could give a modern slant to it, with the likes of 24's, 25's, 31's, 37's, etc and those ubiquitous DMU's.
But I intend to stick to basing it in the 1960's for now, with the possibility of other time frames open to me.

The whole project will take time, a considerable amount of time in fact, but I think I'll be able to make good progress alongside my OO layout, I just need to manage my time better, and get my garage insulation finished.

Control.

Control will be by DCC, in particular a Lenz LH100 and 5A transformer.
I am looking towards having Sound equipped locos as well, but as everything else, it will all take time.

I am currently insulating the walls and ceiling of my garage, and also will need to do the same to the shed.
I hope this will be of interest to you all. After the sale of a couple of G1 items I made this last week, I should be able to give this project a kick start with some stock, a few coach kits and some track construction materials, although track laying will not be for a short while yet!!!

Any comments will be appreciated


Jinty ;-)

Edited August 15, 2017 by Jintyman
Image removed due to copyright issue.

[railwayrod]

Hello Jintyman.

 

This sounds like a great project which I will follow as items are posted. As they say every journey starts with a single step. There is no hurry as long as you are enjoying yourself while construction progresses.

 

Rod

[Simond]

Jinty

 

This sounds wonderful. I shall follow with interest. I trust you are planning this over a prolonged period as it is not going to be a quickie. I suppose it depends how much you will do yourself (and how much time you have) and how much you can/want to outsource.

 

It's mildly confusing that the signal box diagram appears to be south-up!!!

 

How will you accommodate the two non-Brecon routes?

 

You can follow my erratic progress on the links in my signature, I hope you'll find some bits & pieces of interest therein. I can recommend the Lenz DCC controllers, I am feeling my way with point & crossing construction using C&L in 31.5mm, and I can vouch for both Loksound V4 and Zimo sound chips in a range of locos. More to follow in that department in the near future!

 

Do keep posting - I'm sure you'll have an avid following very soon!

 

(And if you need some '30's stock, for your "other era" days, I'm sure I could bring some to run!)

 

Best

Simon

[Jintyman]

How will you accommodate the two non-Brecon routes?

Thanks Rod & Simon,

 

The two routes that will remain in the garage will be the Brecon route, that will be on a temporary fiddle yard on the driveway, folded away when the weather is inclement, and the Merthyr route will be accommodated within the garage. The outside run will represent the Hereford route, with trains of both Midland and Western origins.

 

Yes it will be a protracted build, but as I mentioned earlier, I will be starting to amass locos, coaches and track components from the funds from the sale of my G1 items, essentially some kits to be getting on with.

 

Jinty ;-)

[muddys-blues]

Hello Jinty ...... welcome over to the skint side ..... or you soon will be !!! now lets see   I have just worked out your stock it will be approx £11.487 & 43 pence, give or take 68 pence off the total   , I think some of the lovely 47's may be on sale soon !!!

 

Only kidding Matey, I look forward to our joint running sessions in a year or two 

 

Happy modelling

Craig.

[MartinWales]

This sound a very interesting concept-I will be looking forward to regular updates!

[Ray H]

Good luck with this.

 

It's mildly confusing that the signal box diagram appears to be south-up!!!

I believe that the orientation of the diagram is determined by its position over the frame so the northern most tracks would be at the bottom of the diagram if the frame faced south.

 

I was equally confused by the home signals on the left hand side of the diagram where there appeared to be more arms than routes available. Then I realised that they were the starting (or section) signals at the boxes in the rear and only shown because they carried the fixed distant signals applicable to the junction.

 

Signal 24, the up home, appears to be a colour light, presumably to aid sighting through the tunnel.

Edited May 6, 2015 by Ray H

[Jintyman]

I look forward to our joint running sessions in a year or two 

At least Craig!!!!!!!

 

Thanks,

 

I can guarantee that there won't be any sale of my 4mm Duffs!!!

Although, I've easily spent the G1 funds a week before I've got them (it's too easy really). But no really, selling the 3 G1 small locos, that were just sat in boxes, was a wise move as I will be able to put about 3 locos and a few coaches on the shelf ready.

 

Jinty ;-)

[Simond]

If it's any help, (which I doubt, but anyway) I started my O gauge stock collection in 1998, by building a Springside 45xx. It's due a sound chip sometime soon...

 

Best

Simon

[Simond]

Ray, yes, I knew the diagram would have been drawn to suit the signal box position, what I didn't know was where the box was in relation to the map!

 

After a few moments, the penny dropped...

 

Best

Simon

[muddys-blues]

If it's any help, (which I doubt, but anyway) I started my O gauge stock collection in 1998, by building a Springside 45xx. It's due a sound chip sometime soon...

Best

Simon

Aah Simon, a man after my own heart, no point in rushing those good things.

 

Happy modelling

Craig

[Jintyman]

I've found the video with Talyllyn Junction in.

 

Talyllyn J'ctn appears just after 16:30, where a Brecon to Newport train leaves Brecon for Talyllyn Junction.

 

http://youtu.be/5NuF2rQkW-E

 

Hope you find it interesting

 

Jinty ;-)

Edited May 11, 2015 by Jintyman

[Dava]

Talyllyn Jct was one of the last hunting grounds of the Dean Goods 0-6-0s, possibly just before your period (1957).

 

Dava

[Jintyman]

Talyllyn Jct was one of the last hunting grounds of the Dean Goods 0-6-0s, possibly just before your period (1957).

 

Dava

And what a handsome loco they were!!!

I've seen a picture of one at Talyllyn J'ctn on a short passenger in the late 40's I think it was.

 

 

A Question if I may. If anyone fancies watching the Youtube video I posted above, could they give me some idea of the diagram numbers of the coaching stock seen at or around the Junction please? I've recognised the Collet Dia' D98 B'Set coaches, it's the others I'd like to be more certain of.

Thanks in advance for any help given

 

Jinty ;-)

[81A Oldoak]

What you really need is one of these:

[The Stationmaster]

Good luck with this.

 

 

I believe that the orientation of the diagram is determined by its position over the frame so the northern most tracks would be at the bottom of the diagram if the frame faced south.

 

I was equally confused by the home signals on the left hand side of the diagram where there appeared to be more arms than routes available. Then I realised that they were the starting (or section) signals at the boxes in the rear and only shown because they carried the fixed distant signals applicable to the junction.

 

Signal 24, the up home, appears to be a colour light, presumably to aid sighting through the tunnel.

I suspect the Up Home was actually a 'banjo' signal (i.e. a large disc as can still be found at Worcester) as it is not drawn as a colour light would be when you see the diagram full size

[Jintyman]

as it is not drawn as a colour light would be when you see the diagram full size

I'd love to see a larger and clearer schematic of the box diagram if anyone has one. I only have what is above, and only at that size!!!!

 

Jinty ;-)

[hartleymartin]

What you really need is one of these:

 

You know, It was 11 or 12 years ago I moved from 4mm GWR to 7mm NSWGR with a dabbling in 7mm British. Occasionally I look at your stuff and wonder if I should have gone 7mm GWR!

[muddys-blues]

Nice models there ........... but you don't want to be brewing up, move that time scale Jinty and 'ave some of these rattling and rolling past on the junction 

[Jintyman]

Nice models there ........... but you don't want to be brewing up, move that time scale Jinty and 'ave some of these rattling and rolling past on the junction 

But we did have early DMU's running in the early 60's, Derby Lightweights I believe were around then, I'm sure there must of been others in S. Wales/Mid Wales.

I'll be stretching the life of the line anyway to the end of steam, so there were plenty of DMU's around by then (and WR railcars too!!!!).

 

Jinty ;-)

[Guest bri.s]

Just stumbled over this I knew you were doing 0 gauge but didn't realise you'd started a thread

I Look forward to the long journey ahead it sounds a great project

 

Brian

[81A Oldoak]

But we did have early DMU's running in the early 60's, Derby Lightweights I believe were around then, I'm sure there must of been others in S. Wales/Mid Wales.

I'll be stretching the life of the line anyway to the end of steam, so there were plenty of DMU's around by then (and WR railcars too!!!!).

 

Jinty ;-)

Derby Lightweight DMUs first appeared in 1954/55. BR Metropolitan-Cammell Lightweight DMUs (laster Class 101) appeared in 1956.

[br2975]

But we did have early DMU's running in the early 60's, Derby Lightweights I believe were around then, I'm sure there must of been others in S. Wales/Mid Wales.

I'll be stretching the life of the line anyway to the end of steam, so there were plenty of DMU's around by then (and WR railcars too!!!!).

 

Jinty ;-)

 

Unfortunately, the only Derby Lightweights to reach South Wales were loaned temporarily (by Heaton ?) to Cathays for about a month or so circa 1959.

.

I don't know of any regular diagrams that took DMUs to Talyllyn Jct. - the climbs either way to Torpantau would have taken its toll on any units travelling from Merthyr and the valleys.

.

Don't know about BR Class 2 2-6-2Ts 84xxx and ex-GWR 56xx - but you could also add an ex-LYR 0-6-0 as a few were working trains off Hereford in the 1950s.

 

I have a couple of photos showing a an English Electric Type 3 (Cl.37) on the B & M at Dolygaer and emerging from Torpantau tunnel so there's something else to consider (copyright issues may prevent my posting the photos here).

 

But then, " Rule No.1 applies " -  it's your layout.

 

Brian R

Edited May 13, 2015 by br2975

[Jintyman]

Derby Lightweight DMUs first appeared in 1954/55. BR Metropolitan-Cammell Lightweight DMUs (laster Class 101) appeared in 1956.

Thank you Chris, that is informative.

 

 

Unfortunately, the only Derby Lightweights to reach South Wales were loaned temporarily (by Heaton ?) to Cathays for about a month or so circa 1959.

.

I don't know of any regular diagrams that took DMUs to Talyllyn Jct. - the climbs either way to Torpantau would have taken its toll on any units travelling from Merthyr and the valleys.

.

Don't know about BR Class 2 2-6-2Ts 84xxx and ex-GWR 56xx - but you could also add an ex-LYR 0-6-0 as a few were working trains off Hereford in the 1950s.

 

I have a couple of photos showing a an English Electric Type 3 (Cl.37) on the B & M at Dolygaer and emerging from Torpantau tunnel so there's something else to consider (copyright issues may prevent my posting the photos here).

 

But then, " Rule No.1 applies " -  it's your layout.

 

Brian R

Yes I would imagine the Torpantau climb would test most DMU's.

 

I've seem a photo of a 56xx at Merthyr sitting on the front of a Brecon train, although you're probably right with regards to the 84xxxT loco.

A class 37 eh, a number would be helpful???

 

Jinty ;-)

[The Stationmaster]

The route into Brecon via Talylllyn Jcn was quite heavily restricted.  In 1947 it was restricted to 'Uncoloured' and 'Yellow' restriction engine sonly although B*M engines coded 'Blue' were permitted as were ex TVR Class O4.  I can't find any authority back then for 56XX to go north of Pontsticill.  All photos of the BR period which I have seen have only shown 'Yellow' restriction engines north of Pontsticill - latterly only 57XX panniers, and of course the Ivatt Class 2 2-6-0s plus 2251 0-6-0s.

 

Like many routes in South Wales which closed to passenger traffic c.1962 the services from Newport to Brecon were never dieselised and of course the 'terror' of Seven Mile Bank was a further factor although in reality there were probaly insufficient dmus available and it would be seen as a waste of money to train Brecon men on them.  From Brian's comment about an EE Type 3 at Dolygaer it seems likely that they were permitted on the freight workings which remained as South Wales was dieselised - the only real alternative being a 350 (class 08), which would have taken rather a long time to get to Brecon from Merthyr let alone Newport.  The thought of a D63XX on Seven Mile Bank suggests to me that they weren't even considered (too much training let alone their other issues) so simply authorise the EE Type 3 restricted as necessary.

 

I doubt the 82XXX 2-6-2Ts got up there - plenty of work for them in the Cardiff Valleys before the dmus arrived.